LMII XLR input question

[SteveMoodie]

Hi guys,

I own a Markbass LMII. I most often use it on rock gigs where I play Electric Bass and Upright Bass.

- I send my Electric to the 1/4" input
- I send my Upright through a Fishman Platinum Pro EQII (for the notch filter and phase switch) and then using a 1/4" to male XLR cable, I plug it into the XLR Input on the amp.

My question is...
Is this an OK thing to do - Since the Fishman preamp is meant to match the impedance of my Upright's piezzo pickup to a normal 1/4" input, yet I'm plugging it into the XLR input which is made for the original piezzo signal (eg. pre-Fishman preamp)?


I hope that makes sense!! (it may take a few reads to get what I'm talking about.. Haha)

Cheers
Steve

[JimmyM]

ya, it's fine, but better put something on the upright to kill the volume when you're not playing it. that's the only drawback to doing that.

[SteveMoodie]

Ok, that's good to know. Thanks.
Yeah I've been turning the volume down on the Fishman preamp when changing instruments.

I just noticed that the LMK has two 1/4 inputs with separate EQ's. I should have probably bought that instead... Would save my time with the Gain and Master changes on the LM2 when changing instruments. Doh!

[Tim1]

Hi Steven, I always thought that you actually had bought the LMK as when we discussed it you said you wanted the model with two channels. At the time I automatically assumed that the LMK was what you were referring to, I never realised that you had gone with the LM2 or may have been referring to it (if you remember when you bought your Bergs around we used my head to listen). Still, you won't be doing any harm as you are. By the way, hearing good reports about the band - keep it up.

[SteveMoodie]

Hmmm yeah. I have no idea why I went down the LMII route or if it was intentional. I may sell it and get the LMK. Having the separate Gain's and EQ's will be amazing for my gigging situation.

EDIT: I think that maybe, at the time, I didn't understand that LMII and LMK were different amps! Haha

[KJung]

Originally Posted by SteveMoodie

Hmmm yeah. I have no idea why I went down the LMII route or if it was intentional. I may sell it and get the LMK. Having the separate Gain's and EQ's will be amazing for my gigging situation.

EDIT: I think that maybe, at the time, I didn't understand that LMII and LMK were different amps! Haha

I believe the LMK has been discontinued, but there is a Momark version available.

You might also consider the LMTube. Pretty much the same tone as the LMII, but with phantom power and a separate gain control for the XLR, and they use a combo jack, so you wouldn't need your XLR to 1/4" adaptor.

[Tim1]

Steven, I just checked and Jansen still have three LMKs in stock. You may be able to sell your LM2 and get into an LMK without too much extra expense.

[JimmyM]

or you could just get an aby box. that's what i'm doing until my vt deluxe comes in. your way with the dial turning and all that is a pretty kludgy way of changing. you probably lose quite a bit of rockin' time to it. you already have a pre for your upright, so with the aby box you can just switch between the two with a foot tap. people say not to get morley aby boxes but mine works just fine.

[SteveMoodie]

Jimmy, my initial plan was to wait for the VT Deluxe to solve all my problems. And then when I realised my Upright HAS to go to the desk Pre because the notch filtering etc. is just so that I don't feedback on stage. If I send the "notched & phased" Post signal to the desk, the Upright will sound pretty rubbish (like it does for me on stage! Haha). And there's no way I'm not gonna put my Electric through the Fishman, all notched up. So even with an ABY, I'm screwed!
So I realise now that I have to keep both instruments apart with separate D.I.'s, separate Tuner/Mute pedals, and separate inputs.

Thanks Tim, I just wrote Jansen an email to see what they can do for me. I might also look into KJungs LMTube suggestion. Just have to decide if I need/want separate EQ's on both channels or not.

But it's good to know I can carry on using the XLR input in the meantime. I had a scary feeling I was doing something wrong to the amp with the preamp and crazy cable that I'm using. Thanks for the advice, guys!

[JimmyM]

at least you have a full circle and not the bp100

keeping them separate is the best solution for sure, but i don't always get that luxury so i had to come up with a way to use only one channel. makes me wish upright pickups came with kill switches on the bass itself.

[SteveMoodie]

Yeah, thankfully I've never heard the BP100. Only bad things about it! I actually rented my bass out to Neko Case's band when they were here recently, and they actually requested an Upright with the BP100. I was shocked considering the negative reviews I've read but they specifically requested that pickup. Hopefully I converted the bassist with the Full Circle!

Jimmy, I actually think I will have to get an ABY as well for when I'm provided with an SVT on bigger gigs (I've been unplugging from the SVT every time I change instruments!!). One day I'll have to start putting 2 SVT's on my tech requirement list...

[JimmyM]

i'm sure you didn't convert him some people stick rigidly to the bp100 for some reason. stanley clarke still uses one. i guess because it's so middy it's easy to make it sound real bright and overbearing. not my thing, dude. i use a rev solo ii. trust me...you're not missing out with the bp100. find someone giving one away, ok, take it. otherwise nah.

[Tim1]

If you are serious about changing you might also look at the Euphonic Audio iamp doubler, Steve. George has them at Bass Gear Direct for AU$950. I can't tell you anything about it other than it is aimed specifically at you "doublers", and the power rating appears on a par with the Markbass also rated for 8 and 4 ohms so it should match happily with your Bergs. Just a thought in passing, although if it was me and I knew I was happy with MB I would still go with the LMK, but someone else might chip in on this one.

[SteveMoodie]

Just spent about 3 hours researching the EA Doubler. It looks really nice. Almost perfect, but I'm concerned that it wont have enough volume for the rock stuff.
I can't seem to find much info of the Doubler being used on loud rock gigs.

I know that if I get the LMK, I will still have enough volume and will still love the sound. But on the downside I will continue needing to use 2 tuner/mute pedals and 2 D.I's.

[KJung]

Originally Posted by SteveMoodie

Just spent about 3 hours researching the EA Doubler. It looks really nice. Almost perfect, but I'm concerned that it wont have enough volume for the rock stuff.
I can't seem to find much info of the Doubler being used on loud rock gigs.

I know that if I get the LMK, I will still have enough volume and will still love the sound. But on the downside I will continue needing to use 2 tuner/mute pedals and 2 D.I's.

The LMTube would solve the tuner/mute isssue and the DI issue (the new line of LM's have more fully featured DI's with level control and pre/post switch). You could, again, also get rid of the 1/4" to XLR cable adaptor, since the XLR on the LMTube is a combo jack that can accept 1/4". The only downside is that you wouldn't have separate tone controls for the second channel, though you would have a volume control.

The AI Clarus+ would, IMO, be a better bet than the iAmp if you were concerned about volume. Two full channels, dual combo jack inputs, and tons of power. The voicing is a bit 'darker' than the LM, but great heads, especially for DB/fretless.

[SteveMoodie]

Hey Kjung. It get's tricky because even with the LMTube I would have to use my Fishman Preamp's HPF and EQ to get rid of on stage feedback for the Upright. Then if I was to use the LMTube's D.I., I would be sending that EQ'd to %$#$ signal to the desk, because it's happened before input on the Fishman. (and I don't want to send them that). Whereas the EA Doubler has the HPF etc. built in which means I can fight the feedback and over EQ on the amp and still send a clean Pre signal to the desk from the built in D.I (when it set to Pre).

So the LMTube would leave me with exactly the same 2xD.I./Tuner setup as the LMK, except with less control. So it's not ideal.

I'll do some research on that Clarus+ now.
Thanks for the help.

[Tim1]

Hi Jimmy and Kjung, just to give you an idea of what Steve and I are up against in little ol' Kiwiland, my SVT VR cost me NZ$4300 new which is US$3000 and the price now on them is NZ$5300 which is US$3700. We can access the major brands but anything topline we often have to order in without actually playing first - as with my VR. On top of that the Ampeg warranty here is only 12 months, not five years as in the States. We can sometimes get endorsement deals (less so for me now that I am not touring any more) or decent discounts if we know the right people. Otherwise we often import ourselves. So all this advice you are offering is especially helpful to the likes of Steve and me - I think I would be like a pig in slop if I lived in the States!

[SteveMoodie]

KJung, do you know if the 2nd channel of the LMTube is affected by the tone controls of the 1st channel?

[lbwdog]

They are.

[SteveMoodie]

Thanks for the help and input, everyone. I managed to get a LMK second-hand at a good price. I think it's the best option for my needs. Would love to try the LMTube one day, though!

Cheers
Steve