Low Down Sound Club, Part Four

[lomo]

The LDS 12/6 will get as loud as the 8 Ohm PH210 but you' might need 500 watts into its' 8 Ohms to get that volume from it. It'll be lower and clearer as well, at about 45 lbs. His build quality and finish are really as good as Mesa's (and that's hard to do).
That 12/6 will bury the Scout 12......deeply and quickly. Keep in mind this comes from a Mesa fanboy-I absolutely love the Scout cabs and my Walkabout.....but some of the newer designs are simply a step up IMHO/IME.

Originally Posted by LowBSix

Hey guys, I'm intrigued by this thread and the LDS website.

I want/need to lighten the load.

I've shrunk my set up to the TH 500 driving a MESA PH 210/8 ohm or a Scout 12/4ohm.
The PH is 53 pounds and I love the bottom end and punch. It takes me two hands and/or a small dolly. The Scout is 38 pounds and I love the voice/growl I get and can carry one handed; yet it's awkward.

I don't need a huge rig anymore around town and if needed, they'll backline a rig for me. Don't use my 1989 SWR 410 anymore, but I'm not gonna part with it.

That being said I saw the 3x8s on the LDS site and am curious of the 12/6 or 15/6 vibe.
I play fingerstyle predominently, occaisonal pick and/or slap.

Your thoughts???

[LowBSix]

Originally Posted by lomo

The LDS 12/6 will get as loud as the 8 Ohm PH210 but you' might need 500 watts into its' 8 Ohms to get that volume from it. It'll be lower and clearer as well, at about 45 lbs. His build quality and finish are really as good as Mesa's (and that's hard to do).
That 12/6 will bury the Scout 12......deeply and quickly. Keep in mind this comes from a Mesa fanboy-I absolutely love the Scout cabs and my Walkabout.....but some of the newer designs are simply a step up IMHO/IME.

I'd like to keep the weight at 35 pounds +/- and 4 ohms. But i get why i should call Don
Thank You!!!

I'm paying attention....

[::::BASSIST::::]

Originally Posted by KJung

I remember those. KILLER sounding cabs. I was still living in Detroit when you had the 'chuffing' issue. As you remember, when you sent one back for evaluation, I actually tried to replicate your issue, and even with a 15 db boost with a 40hz shelving control on my F500, I could not replicate the chuffing. Given that the RH450 you were using at the time was very attenuated down low, our guess was it was some sort of sympathetic vibration going on in the room you were playing in (edit: or , as I posted below, some strange interaction between technique, amp, bass, EQ that just lined up to do funny things with that particular cab design... it does happen).

That being said, the small 3012HO cabs are VERY midrange present, and given that you now totally dig a 15/6, that is pretty much night and day difference. So, these were just not the cabs for you. I absolutely loved them for my tone, and I believe the new owner is thrilled with them. I prefer the slightly more open sound of the similar box that Don makes with the 3015 nonLF driver, but two of the 3012HO boxes stacked is a dream rig for those who are more interested in definition and 'hearing the windings on the E string' versus big, open low end with no midrange bump.

Don is exceptional at providing after the sale customer service, and even works with customers who just 'don't like the cab he built', even if there isn't an actual problem.

I tried those cabs in at least 3 or 4 rooms so I know it wasn't the room. I was not boosting lows, but using my usual tone pot rolled off half-way, dead sounding flat wounds on a J bass. The rh450's tone of accentuated upper bass and low-mid did not have a big low-end. I don't know what was going on, but ultimately they did not satisfy me at all. Again, some cab gurus said the ports were too small, but I cannot say for sure as I am not an expert in terms of bass cab design. With the purchase of those cabs I was trying to upgrade from my UL112 stack which I gigged extensively and really dug. Guess it goes to show sometimes one should stick with what has proven to work and not give in to GAS.

Anyway, it was a disappointing experience for me as I lost quite a bit of money, but its all water under the bridge now.

Soon after, I went on my fEARful adventure and we all know how that turned out.

[KJung]

Originally Posted by ::::BASSIST::::

I tried those cabs in at least 3 or 4 rooms so I know it wasn't the room. I was not boosting lows, but using my usual tone pot rolled off half-way, dead sounding flat wounds on a J bass. The rh450's tone of accentuated upper bass and low-mid did not have a big low-end. I don't know what was going on, but ultimately they did not satisfy me at all. Again, some cab gurus said the ports were too small, but I cannot say for sure as I am not an expert in terms of bass cab design. With the purchase of those cabs I was trying to upgrade from my UL112 stack which I gigged extensively and really dug. Guess it goes to show sometimes one should stick with what has proven to work and not give in to GAS.

Anyway, it was a disappointing experience for me as I lost quite a bit of money, but its all water under the bridge now.

Soon after, I went on my fEARful adventure and we all know how that turned out.

+1 Not the cab for you. Of course, you would also have been just as happy with an LDS 15/6. Much closer to the tone profile (wide, relaxed mids, big low end) of the Epi UL cabs versus the brutal mid punch of the HO loaded boxes.

I loved those cabs though, but I'm all about hearing the windings on the E string. That's why there are so many different cabs out there.

One of the complications with ordering a totally custom cab from LDS is that Don will give you what you ask for, which very much might not be what you want.

Quite frankly, the same thing happened to me when I finally bought a 15/6 (in my case a fEARful, but they all sound very similar if using the same mid driver). I disliked that cab quite a bit. Shame on me though, since once I thought about it, and especially when you take a look at the guys who love those cabs (many of whom are like you.... dead flats, and also lots of DUB guys), it makes total sense, since my tone goals were totally opposite of that cab design's voicing. I don't even want to talk about the money I lost on that one! Live and learn!

[jnewmark]

Originally Posted by KJung

+1 Not the cab for you. Of course, you would also have been just as happy with an LDS 15/6. Much closer to the tone profile (wide, relaxed mids, big low end) of the Epi UL cabs versus the brutal mid punch of the HO loaded boxes.

I loved those cabs though, but I'm all about hearing the windings on the E string. That's why there are so many different cabs out there.

+ 1 on the 3012HO's. Since I had Don build me a vertical 212/horn cab with 3012HO's, I can't see using any other 12" speaker. The clarity, definition, and abilty to cut through a congested mix, is just wonderful. Am I getting Reggae lows ? No, but that's not my goal anyway. And I can never resist posting a pic of it !

[Chef]

Yeah: the voicing of LF drivers/mid driver/horn just isn't for everyone.
I've tried several variants of that...Since I replaced the 18Sound in my 12/6/1 with a Faital Don recommends, and let Ralf do the crossover to match that, I'm happier, but, it's still a much different thing than my GK Neo212's....

Yes, the HO drivers are a "more normally voiced" higher output choice; and if you don't dig the LF based stuff, the HO based stuff might well be a great choice for you.

[CL400Peavey]

Originally Posted by LowBSix

I'd like to keep the weight at 35 pounds +/- and 4 ohms. But i get why i should call Don
Thank You!!!

I'm paying attention....

If you want to hit that weight and impedance, I would be looking at a cab in lightweight ply, loaded with a Faitail 15PR400.

[5StringPocket]

Originally Posted by Chef

Yeah: the voicing of LF drivers/mid driver/horn just isn't for everyone.
I've tried several variants of that...Since I replaced the 18Sound in my 12/6/1 with a Faital Don recommends, and let Ralf do the crossover to match that, I'm happier, but, it's still a much different thing than my GK Neo212's....

Yes, the HO drivers are a "more normally voiced" higher output choice; and if you don't dig the LF based stuff, the HO based stuff might well be a great choice for you.

That's one reason I'm curious how well the Audiokinesis TC212 will tighten up the low end and increase the mid-presence for a pair of 3012LF's; sort of making those drivers sound different than you're used to hearing them.

[Chef]

I'll have one here next week

[LowBSix]

I spoke with Don today... We have very similar taste in cabinets and he's enthusiastic about a new Eminence 10 with the Faital 6. I'm probably gonna complete an order tomorrow for:
1010/6
4 ohms
About 30 pounds
Thanks for your guidance boys!

[Stumbo]

Originally Posted by Chef

I spent last weekend gigging the 12/6/1+12 sub, with the GK MBFusion and Sadowsky MV5.
Long term, it may or may not be "my thing," but dang if it doesn't work really well.

Have you tried fdeck's HPF-pre with this rig to see if it tightens up the low end or helps at different venues?

[Chef]

Yessir. I have. It can be used like that.
That really isn't what might make these (or any LF loaded cab) not my thing.

The LF's+mid+horn are a different thing than a traditional cab, they don't present the same way.
This is neither "good nor bad, just different."
They have different design goals, and that's readily apparent when you a/b the 12/6/1+12sub against something like
GK Neo's or Baer ML's;
three completely different flavors.

I have an AudioKinesis TC212 landing soon, at which point I'm gonna have to make some hard choices.

[lomo]

Originally Posted by LowBSix

I spoke with Don today... We have very similar taste in cabinets and he's enthusiastic about a new Eminence 10 with the Faital 6. I'm probably gonna complete an order tomorrow for:
1010/6
4 ohms
About 30 pounds
Thanks for your guidance boys!

I would love to hear that cab. Please post a review when you get it!

[LowBSix]

Originally Posted by lomo

I would love to hear that cab. Please post a review when you get it!

Will do!

[LowBSix]

I just gave Don a deposit on a 1010/6

2 Eminence 10 @ 450 watts each
Faital 6 @ 150 watts
30 pounds

[M Sterling]

I bought an excellent condition used LDS1212/6/1 from a tber a few weeks back. The build quality is as good as anything I've seen, and the sound is amazing. I have been getting compliments from band/audience/sound guy since incorporating it.

Its loaded with delt lfa's and I'm not sure what the mid and tweeter are, but the guy I bought it from said it was vintage voiced. Either way it sounds fantastic and I think in gonna have don build me another just like it. I'll post a pic in a little while.

[jnewmark]

Originally Posted by LowBSix

I just have Don a deposit on a 1010/6

2 Eminence 10 @ 450 watts each
Faital 6 @ 150 watts
30 pounds

Wow, that sounds cool !

[justBrian]

I'm in--just picked up a used LDS 15/6 yesterday. I am very impressed. Neo drivers--I think the whole thing weighs 50lbs?? Pretty sweet crossover, too, with an attenuator for the tweeter and mid....

Pics coming...

[DaveDeVille]

[Chef]

cool bass.