More power....? Mag300.

[Nowhereboy]

I've just had my first opportunity to put my new ashdown rig through its paces and Im a bit worried it isn't going to be loud enough!

I have a mag evo 300 head and a 210 on top of a 115. I have read on many forums this rig will be loud enough for medium sized venues but Im not so sure.

I have yet to play it with my band so I guess I'll find out how it fares up next week, however I have just gave it a good play through on high volume in my house and it certainly isn't as loud as I expected, I had it on full volume with the input pretty high and I was craving a bit more already. Thats before Im stood next to two marshal stacks and a hard hitting drummer.

Worst comes to worst I'll have to sell the head and buy something with more power right?

Will my cabs hold up ok with the higher power ashdown stuff? Im pretty worried about this now, just spent a good bit of money on this rig!!

[RickenBoogie]

More power is not the answer- more and better spkr cabs IS the answer. Decide which of the 2 cabs you own now are better, to your ears. Sell the other, and get two of the same. If it were me, I'd go 2 15's. This is assuming the 2 cabs you have are up to the task, (what are they?) You may need to ditch them both and go with a good 6x10, or 2x15.

[Nowhereboy]

They're mag cabinets mate, Im not confident two 15's would do the job to be honest. Ive just tried playing again their and with the mids up high and zero eq it will probably be loud enough for my band but only just. I don't fancy having it on the edge of its capability's constantly just to keep up.

Would another cab help increase the volume? Or should I just sell the 300 and buy the mag 600, tone wise its spot on, no problems, just isnt bloody loud enough!

I could comfortably afford to buy another cab, but don't want to waste money if it aint gonna help. I want substantially more volume. Do you think another 212 would help?

I could always return the whole lot to the shop but that would be a major hassle.

[Bass_Pounder]

Originally Posted by Nowhereboy

Would another cab help increase the volume? Or should I just sell the 300 and buy the mag 600, tone wise its spot on, no problems, just isnt bloody loud enough!

The key to getting loud is the proper amount of efficient speakers. They are FAR more important then throwing more watts at your existing cabs.

Doubling your wattage into your existing cabs will only get you +3db at BEST. If your cabs cannot handle the extra wattage, then you won't get any louder, and all the extra wattage gets burned off as heat until you kill your speakers.

[Nowhereboy]

Originally Posted by Bass_Pounder

The key to getting loud is the proper amount of efficient speakers. They are FAR more important then throwing more watts at your existing cabs.

Doubling your wattage into your existing cabs will only get you +3db at BEST. If your cabs cannot handle the extra wattage, then you won't get any louder, and all the extra wattage gets burned off as heat until you kill your speakers.

So what would you recommend? obviously I need a lesson in this department because as a former guitarist Im clueless here, my cabs are both 250 watt each, i thought that meant they could handle a 500 watt head, but I guess Im wrong on that?

If I add another 210 to my current rig would that help? Its gonna be a nightmare shifting three cabs to gigs, it would look awsome tho

[5 Wire]

Originally Posted by RickenBoogie

More power is not the answer- more and better spkr cabs IS the answer.

Truth. I played mine with a 112 and a 115 and it was more than loud enough. I also used a preamp.
Keep your input hot - tipping the red.

[Bass_Pounder]

Originally Posted by Nowhereboy

So what would you recommend? obviously I need a lesson in this department because as a former guitarist Im clueless here, my cabs are both 250 watt each, i thought that meant they could handle a 500 watt head, but I guess Im wrong on that?

If I add another 210 to my current rig would that help? Its gonna be a nightmare shifting three cabs to gigs, it would look awsome tho

The wattage ratings of cabs are the thermal rating at which the voice coil will melt - NOT the real world mechanical limits of the speaker (which depending on how much low end EQ you use could be HALF of the thermal rating).

So no...........cabs thermally rated at 500 watts will not take everything a 500 watt amp can deliver.

The only recommendation I can make right now is to spend some time reading through the FAQ's and the posts here in the amp forum to get a better idea how rigs really work.

[Nowhereboy]

Originally Posted by 5 Wire

Truth. I played mine with a 112 and a 115 and it was more than loud enough. I also used a preamp.
Keep your input hot - tipping the red.

Ive just tried this and it works much better, it sounds MUCH louder and the tonal quality goes up too.

Is it safe to do this tho? I mean its not constantly in the red, but it goes into it every now and again. Is that ok?

The speakers are copping fine with it, not struggling at all.....

[Bass_Pounder]

Originally Posted by Nowhereboy

Ive just tried this and it works much better, it sounds MUCH louder and the tonal quality goes up too.

Is it safe to do this tho? I mean its not constantly in the red, but it goes into it every now and again. Is that ok?

The speakers are copping fine with it, not struggling at all.....

If it sounds good, then it probably is good.

Many amps need to have a really good input signal to come alive - some of the Ampegs are that way too.

[bobbybass85]

The input meter is just a more detailed version of the clip light. There is no damage being done, it's just telling you how much signal you are feeding the eq and power section. I don't run mine flat out since I don't like the tone of that. I run it where the meter jumps into the red on peaks, but sits right at the limit during normal playing.

I've had the 210 combo with a 115 cab for over 6 years now and have never run out of volume and it's never quit on me.

Another thing, watch your EQ. I found that using a cut approach (as opposed to a boost approach) with the EQ opens up volume. If you dime the bass knob the amp has to work a lot harder than if you cut the other eq knobs to achieve a similar the bass heavy tone. If the amp is working less on EQ, it can work more on volume IME.

Hope that helps.

[chaosMK]

For a good while I used a MAG 300 with either 1x15 or 2 1x15's. When I used both 15's, it was loud enough for any situation. Cut your lowest lows and boost the low mids on it and you can get a little more presence without tapping all it's power too.

[Nowhereboy]

Originally Posted by bobbybass85

The input meter is just a more detailed version of the clip light. There is no damage being done, it's just telling you how much signal you are feeding the eq and power section. I don't run mine flat out since I don't like the tone of that. I run it where the meter jumps into the red on peaks, but sits right at the limit during normal playing.

I've had the 210 combo with a 115 cab for over 6 years now and have never run out of volume and it's never quit on me.

Another thing, watch your EQ. I found that using a cut approach (as opposed to a boost approach) with the EQ opens up volume. If you dime the bass knob the amp has to work a lot harder than if you cut the other eq knobs to achieve a similar the bass heavy tone. If the amp is working less on EQ, it can work more on volume IME.

Hope that helps.

Yea that does help, if anyone has links to somewhere that explains how bass amps and cabs work in detail that would be great. I clearly need to get up to scratch with my knowledge!

[Bass_Pounder]

Originally Posted by Nowhereboy

Yea that does help, if anyone has links to somewhere that explains how bass amps and cabs work in detail that would be great. I clearly need to get up to scratch with my knowledge!

You can get a good start here:

AMPS FAQ!! Info on OHMS, Allsize RIGS-OverUnderPowerCabs DIY TechTalk-Links

Take your time, there is lots of info in there on all kinds of subjects.

[bobbybass85]

^^^

That. That sticky thread helped me so much.

[RickenBoogie]

If you seriously need to get much louder, I'd ditch the 2 small cabs you have now and replace them with one BIG 4 ohm cab. An 8x10 would sound HUGE. And, +1 to reading through the faq's.

[Nowhereboy]

yea, thanks for those links guys, its all starting to make a little more sense now!!