MusicCord Audio Examples - What Do You Hear?

[testing1two]

Before anybody goes flame happy or hops on their snake-oil soapbox, let's try to keep this thread from getting closed by staying on topic. Your cooperation is greatly appreciated.

Much has been said about the MusicCord by Essential Sound Products. I do not own or endorse their products but I did notice that they have posted two product demonstration videos on their website by two notable Nashville session players, Eric Struthers (guitar) and Michael Rhodes (bass).

Bass Guitar Amp Power Cord Demonstration Guitar Bass Amplifier Cord Test | Essential Sound Products

While I cannot and will not argue the science behind the MusicCord or the way in which it is marketed, I will state that I notice an audible difference with the MusicCord in the videos.

AND NOW FOR THE DISCUSSION TOPIC: After watching the videos, do you hear a difference between the standard power cord and the MusicCord? Do you consider it an improvement?

Please, let's make every effort to confine our comments to the topic at hand and not spiral into an angry flame-fest or a 50 page mock thread. Cheers

[greenboy]

Why would I trust a video for this?

[Jonathan1990]

"Missing Plug-in". How ironic.

[testing1two]

Originally Posted by greenboy

Why would I trust a video for this?

I'm not asking anyone to trust anything, merely to watch, listen, and comment.

[stflbn]

I have no faith in a marketing company being able to resist tweaking the audio or volume on a clip to make it support their product. None at all.


.

[billfitzmaurice]

Originally Posted by testing1two

I will state that I notice an audible difference with the MusicCord in the videos.

The clip is an advertisement, not an independent 3rd party double-blind test. Now watch this, which was not concocted with the sole intent of selling a product:

YouTube - Audio Myths Workshop

[Robby Hoinsky]

I think I hear a difference, but it isn't 'night and day'.

There are so many reasons why this test is invalid -

he is playing two different times, he could be playing 'better' on the second take
he is telling you it is going to be better (influencing you)
the video is supplied by the company, easily tainted

Some, if not all of his claims are objective, particularly 'even got a bit louder', yet I see no frequency response or distortion measurements on their site a/bing their cable vs a stock one.

The only benefit is a placebo, but I'd rather take the red pill.

Robby

[greenboy]

Robby, it's also possible the electrical company was putting out better juice during one test than the other.

[jnewmark]

Originally Posted by greenboy

Comment? This is ...

Robert O. SABER ??!!

[bongomania]

Originally Posted by testing1two

I'm not asking anyone to trust anything, merely to watch, listen, and comment.

In all seriousness--watching, listening, and commenting all imply a basis of trust that the demo is not rigged or otherwise affected by factors other than the cord.

If you take it at face value, you're the one Barnum was talking about--even if (coincidentally) the cable actually worked as claimed.

[BigOldHarry]

Originally Posted by greenboy

Why would I trust a video for this?

Indeed.

Let's see this company show us the WHY of the supposed difference.

I know that with medical gear, a more shielded cord with heavy-duty ends is typical (which is what I use - I'm lucky enough to have access to these!!) but this just REEKS of the same snakeoil that Monster has been using for years to sell instrument / speakers cables.

[greenboy]

Originally Posted by jnewmark

Robert O. SABER ??!!

Highly likely it was indeed Robert O. Saber, rather than Robert O' Sober ; }

[Nev375]

Either my associates degree in electronics is not worth the paper it's printed on. And my understanding of the physics of how electricity travels down a conductor and how amplifiers work is missing a few lessons.

-or-

There's a company out there with a bogus product who are not above falsifying video sound clips and paying big name celebrities for endorsements. Who are cashing in on a niche market full of customers with way more dreams than common sense.


Fact: It is probably an excellent cord made of the finest materials, but simply plugging it in does not change the performance level of the mediocre building and municipal wiring between your amp and the power plant.

Fact: The power cord is not even a part of the audio signal.

Fact: Human perception, even among audiophiles, is highly fallible and very easily tainted by suggestion.

Also, I did not hear a difference in the sound clips, however, because of the above facts, I'm biased to not want to hear a difference making the demonstration completely irrelevant.

[vin*tone]

Originally Posted by testing1two

... I will state that I notice an audible difference with the MusicCord in the videos. ...

No you can state that there is an audible difference in the 2 sound takes. You are trusting the company that this is actually due to the cord.

[Bass_Pounder]

Not only do I NOT hear a difference between the power cables, I don't really hear any big difference between his $$ Ampeg rig and the "everyman" Hartke rig.

[testing1two]

Again, I make no claims for or against the legitimacy of the product, but I think the unsolicited conspiracy theories of deceit and trickery seem a bit harsh considering none of us have any first hand experience with the product. And faulting the demonstration for not adhering to double-blind objective criteria would disqualify virtually every musical product demonstration video in existence. Whether or not someone bases their purchasing decision solely on these demonstrations is another discussion entirely.

I know we would all love to see third party measured data through double-blind analysis and I am all too aware of the brain's natural susceptibility to manipulation when it comes to audio perception (I've been making "phantom adjustments" to guitar amps, pedals, and FOH mixes for years to rave reviews). But until such testing happens by somebody here on TB (and I'm sure it will at some point) we shouldn't commit so much time & energy to negative assumptions.

I too would be interested to know the design principle and the science behind it. So far, this excerpt from Pro Audio Review is all I could find [the entire review can be found here: ]Pro-Audio Review Articles

"Review a power cord? Yes, and the ESP MusicCord-PRO is honestly a worthy subject for discussion. Michael Griffin, founder, president and design engineer at ESP, describes the motivation behind the product: 'For dynamic peaks in particular, sometimes the amplifying equipment is just not getting enough current to reproduce the waveform accurately.'

The Theory

The wiring in between our breaker boxes and our outlets is typically flat with the ground lead in between the hot and neutral conductors; low magnetic/inductive interaction is in play. The typical Edison to IEC power cable is round and tightly bundled resulting in more interaction. Also, intuition would suggest that a move from a common power cord using 18 AWG wire to a larger gauge, say, 14 AWG, would yield more current capability, and it does, but Griffin says this actually compounds the problem as larger conductors have slower time constants, resulting in a sluggish response to demands for rapid current change.

The patented MusicCord-PRO approach uses an oversized 12 AWG ground wire as a core, spiral-wrapped with eight 20 AWG wires for a 14 AWG equivalent current capacity. Griffin elaborates: "As you go to smaller conductors, they have faster time constants. Of course, they don't handle as much current. By using multiple 20 AWG conductors (that have no audible phase distortion) in parallel, it's like taking these small conductors, with very fast time constants, and stacking them on top of each other. So you've got a very fast ramp up and drop off; AC current can flow faster. That's how you improve the transient performance." He adds that the ESP cables also have a braided copper RFI and EMI shield, offset by an inner jacket for improved EMI performance, particularly at 120 Hz."

[BigOldHarry]

Originally Posted by Nev375

Either my associates degree in electronics is not worth the paper it's printed on. And my understanding of the physics of how electricity travels down a conductor and how amplifiers work is missing a few lessons.

-or-

There's a company out there with a bogus product who are not above falsifying video sound clips and paying big name celebrities for endorsements. Who are cashing in on a niche market full of customers with way more dreams than common sense.


Fact: It is probably an excellent cord made of the finest materials, but simply plugging it in does not change the performance level of the mediocre building and municipal wiring between your amp and the power plant.

Fact: The power cord is not even a part of the audio signal.

Fact: Human perception, even among audiophiles, is highly fallible and very easily tainted by suggestion.

Also, I did not hear a difference in the sound clips, however, because of the above facts, I'm biased to not want to hear a difference making the demonstration completely irrelevant.

I'm with ya.

That said, I have seen really cheap/crappy power cables lead to poor amp performance - usually from interference, noise, bad behavior... but "Audio Quality"?? Bass notes? Sweeter amp sound? NOPE. NOT ONCE.

Oh - and thanks for Bill for posting that audio link again - it's a hoot (And features my new dirty-old-man crush Poppy Crum!)

[greenboy]

Reminds me of what Arthur C Clarke used to say his favorite definition of an intellectual was: "someone who has been educated beyond his/her intelligence..."

[seamonkey]

If the player truly believes there's a difference it's due to the
Ideomotor effect. He saw the ESP cable being plugged in and played differently.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ideomotor_effect

If the users can hear a difference, it can be measured. If ESP is trying to sell you on a video that there's a difference, then it must be recorded. They can run it through some analysis and show what the difference is.

If you go to buy a piece of gear, and changing the power chord makes it sound better then don't buy it! It's broken. There's something wrong with it.


Nothing new here. Same old snake oil.
Ad nauseam ...

[bongomania]

Originally Posted by testing1two

The Theory

Just FYI, this is what we call "pseudo science": the use of bits and pieces of "real science", mish-mashed together in ways that make zero sense, but that sound awfully impressive. Not one word in that "theory" explains how an amp will perform better. It explains how in principle it might be possible for that cable to conduct AC better than a badly-designed cable. But it does not take into account the literally miles of wiring from the power plant to the building, and the hundreds of feet of wiring inside the building--nor does it take into account how nearly all electronic equipment is actually powered: the AC reaches the power section and is converted to DC, and bridge-rectified, before it ever hits any other part of the amp circuit. In other words all aspects of AC, including phase, frequency, and distortion, are completely eliminated before the power reaches the amplifier itself. They can fuss with and fine-tune the AC in the cable all they want, and that will all be wiped away as soon as it hits the amp's power jack.