My Huge Laugh For The Day: Music Store Trade Offer for Staccato'51

[kudzoorude]

Went to a local music store and fell in love with a Mesa Boogie M6 Carbine Combo. Yes...it's everything everyone says it is.

Since I have a great amp (Staccato'51) that only lacks in the classic tube growl area, I thought I'd bring it in to see what they'd give me for a trade offer.

First eyebrow raise came from the statement, "Sorry. We can't allow any lower pricing on Mesa products. Our contract states we can't adjust the pricing or we'll lose our reseller status." Now I know Apple does this, but Mesa?? Seriously?? Then they were trying to convince me that the MSRP was $1499 for any Mesa dealer when I've seen it for $1399 from MANY dealers. Has anyone else run into this statement?

So I figured..."Well. If they give me a fair trade offer for the Staccato'51, I'll consider it." I waited for 30 minutes or so while they researched the amp. Hooked up the Staccato'51 to an Ampeg 8x10 and an Ashdown 4x10. It sounded great of course. 4 people came by and were drooling over it. I could've sold the amp to them easily. BUT...I waited.

They came back with the offer. They could sell me the M6 Combo for $999 with the trade. Confused for a moment I asked what the trade was worth. They said $500.

I LITERALLY laughed out loud. I asked them if they were serious. Didn't they know this amp sold new for $1199 and was less than 6 months old? They responded that the amp was used. I informed them that I could easily sell it for $900ish? I thought they were joking. $500?!?! They didn't smile or laugh.

I laughed again and began packing my equipment. I know that retail shops have to make a profit...but this was near insulting. I just wanted a fair value trade; not to be bent-over. I had G.A.S. but it wasn't that bad. I won't be shopping there ever again.

[paganjack]

Mesa does in fact enforce their list prices. They can revoke dealer authorization if the seller sells them for less. I don't know why it would be $100 more there....

As far as the trade offer, that's kinda how it goes at most music stores. Sell it yourself and reap the rewards!

[BillyIVbass]

Sadly, that's the cold truth. More expensive items are having a slower turn around. I think you nailed it. You should probably try to sell your amp on your own.

As far as Mesa. They probably didn't tell you the whole truth. Mesa sells about as many amps as they make in a year.

[BryanM]

Their offer seems more than fair based on the information you've given. Most music stores, or any reseller of any sort of used merchandise for that matter, will buy at about 50% of what they sell at. Based on what you claim you could have gotten for it, they were actually exceeding that by $50, an offering you 55.55%. Used is typically the highest margin in any business that deals in new and used product because the margins on new items is typically on a scale of low for high priced items and high for low priced, so not a huge dollar amount for most things.

A lot of the larger sellers actually sell some higher priced items above the inflated cost (dead cost before DFI, early pay discount or bulk discounts) in order to stay competitive in the market, so the used gear acts as a buffer for a lot of stores, especially smaller stores that don't get bulk discounts or DFI from being a preferred vendor. Some of those smaller stores actually depend on that high markup from used items to cover expenses and turn a profit.

I can almost guarantee they were making less on the Mesa amp than they would reselling your Staccato '51, and on top of that the Mesa was planned inventory, meaning it doesn't take any additional stock space as it's a regular item. Your amp would be taking up stock space that might otherwise be filled with items that would turn over quicker. Your amp being a lesser known model than the Mesa, coupled with the fact that it does have playing time on it means that there will likely be some turnaround on it.

In regards to the MAP on the Mesa amp, the price they sell for is the minimum price they can advertise for. Even if you did see it for $1399 elsewhere, those dealers might have had a special agreement regarding MAP with Mesa, or might have had less overhead and were able to break MAP on actual sale price (it can be sold for less, but not openly advertised as such, even on the floor).

If you could have gotten $900 easily for the TC, why didn't you do that, then take the cash and hand it to the store, or better yet, take the cash to the store selling it for $1399 and gotten your amp for an additional investment of $499, rather than $999.

Sorry for the rant, I just hate when people berate music stores for following the rules set forth to allow them to carry the brands they want at better prices than otherwise and most importantly to offer the backing of the company that manufactures the items in question (If they lose their authorized dealer status by breaking map or otherwise misrepresent the brand, the manufacturer can deny any warranty claims by customers who purchased the item at that store, since by not being authorized, they constitute a third party and any non-transferable warranty is void when the item is sold to the customer.)

[TheDialog]

I agree, the offer was more than fair. If the amp was $1199 new most stores would offer about 25-35% of that depending on condition. They are there to make a profit. If the store was mine I would have offered about $400 or so in trade value. Staccato'51 v. Mesa...there's no comparison when it comes to name brands, which obviously sell better.

Don't not go back to that store. They didn't insult you. Be glad they took the time to research the head first and test it through 2 different cabs. I think that's extremely extensive.

[eyeballkid]

what you all say is true...
but what makes it laughable is that if he went thru with it, the music store would sell the mesa for $999, then sell his Staccato for $850-$900 and make $400 more than a straight sale and can act like this is a "deal" with a straight face.

this is why I NEVER trade in or sell to stores, its a total ripoff.
my advice if you want the mesa, sell the staccato and buy one used even steven.

[audiomitch]

Originally Posted by eyeballkid

this is why I NEVER trade in or sell to stores, its a total ripoff.

Very true. OTOH, when I'm looking at gear on Craigslist I always use the "50% of new" rule. And that's just a starting point for me.

Of course, some people think their gear has magically gone up in value somehow.

[rubato]

The $500 they offered you is probably as good as your going to see trying to do a trade at a music store. MSRP's on music equipment are usually around 250% of the wholesale cost, allowing the store to discount the price and still double what they paid for it. List price on the Staccato'51 is around $1550, street price is $1199. if you look hard enough you can find them cheaper. Wholesale is gonna be around $600... So if they are offering you $500 used for what they can get for $600 new...

If you like the Mesa, put your amp up for sale, take the money and go buy one. Music stores are in business to make money - not to make friends. You'll always do better selling your own gear than trading it in.

[nostatic]

More than fair trade offer. You can get more selling on your own, but you burn your time, effort, and assume some level of risk. The question is how much is that worth to you? And if you think you can get $900 for the Stacatto - do it up. I bet it'll sit on the market for a long time at that price.

I guess that people who rail against the music store "ripping someone off" on a deal like this don't put much value on their own time. Or on the service that the store is performing. And a person is always free to say, "no" to the offer.

[Crabby]

Keep in mind Mesa prices went up in December which would account for having seen the amp for sale cheaper at other stores in the recent past. The deal they offered you seemed reasonable to me considering how music stores have to resell used gear and make money to stay in business. I have the best luck buying used gear from big retail music stores that they are having a hard time getting rid of but have learned to be realistic when it comes to trading gear in.

[GeneralElectric]

I think they were more than fair with their offer.

Honestly too, think of it this way.

Your amp is $1200 new street value, right?

Out of all the music equipment out their, it is my experience that amps have crappy resale value (barring a few exceptions for whats 'in demand' at the moment) which is why I'll never buy a new amp.

When your amp leaves the store or shipping box expect to lose 30% of its sale value as you make your way to the parking lot. I play an Aguilar AG500 which is slightly more expensive than your amp. Its also a more recognizable brand. I could reasonably figure to get between 700 and 750 for the amp on the used market. On a good day. I had a GK2001RB. Looked brand new. I had trouble getting $800 for it when it cost around $1400 new if I remember correctly.

When you sell your amp to a store, of course you'll get less. But you also don't have to deal with the hassle and the aggravation of selling your equipment and if you need (insert new gear here) right now, its a valid option.

[Plays_For_Dog]

I traded once. Luckily, I got hooked up pretty fair. I'll never do it again though. After selling gear privately and seeing how much more I can get and still be fair about it... Trading in is a waste of value for your gear. Of course, once you sell, you have to have the difference in price for your new gear, or you go without amplification

[Billy3000]

I agree... saying you won't shop at a store anymore because you didn't like their trade value is overreacting a bit. The shop themselves can only hope to get about $750 at most for it, so they need to have a fair profit margin for themselves, and so if they have to haggle a lower price to sell it they need to have leeway there. $500 is a pretty fair trade value. You may not like that, but that's just the way that trade values are. If you want what your amp is worth then you need to sell it yourself.

[dbase]

My music store comes right out and tells me that "I'm gonna have to beat you over the head and steal your trade-in from you". They did this with a Peavey 1x12 combo I bought from them new and used it twice and traded up to my current rig.... It was still in the box, but to them "Used".
Sell it yourself and keep the profits.

[Stinsok]

Sounds like an episode of Pawn Stars.

[AMp'D.2play]

Originally Posted by kudzoorude

I informed them that I could easily sell it for $900ish? I thought they were joking. $500?!?!

A quick search of the completed auctions on eBay shows that a Staccato '51 recently went for $749. It was a seller re-furb in excellent condition, from an authorized dealer, with free shipping, a 30-day return policy, and a full warranty.

It's only one example, but your goal of getting $900 in a private sale is probably highly optimistic. Also, while TC Electronic puts out great stuff, it's not exactly a household name.

[zarigunn]

yeah, in here they wanted to give me 90 euros for a 6 month old hartke 5500 A with case.
Did LOL them to!
asswhipes

[Febs]

Originally Posted by kudzoorude

I laughed again and began packing my equipment. I know that retail shops have to make a profit...but this was near insulting. I just wanted a fair value trade; not to be bent-over. I had G.A.S. but it wasn't that bad. I won't be shopping there ever again.

They offered you a fair trade. Your expectations were unrealistic.

[JasonLamb]

my big laugh of the day is when people want to sell stuff they don't like to a music store and are offended when the store doesn't offer them retail for their stuff...come on guys...let's get real.

[Blues Bass 2]

This is why players just starting out have to educate themselves on how this works .

Never trade any equipment in , almost all stores will only give you half of what you or they can sell it for just like the other guys say . When I started out I would buy something with financing from the store and then when the gear didn't work out later I'd trade it in and refinance . I must have wasted a ton of money but I didn't care because I was only concerned with the monthly payment and getting what I wanted .

Always sell your gear to get different stuff , it's the only way to come out even or ahead at all . If you do that you will always be ahead of what a trade in will get you . It doesn't only apply to musical instuments and amps it goes for about anything you want to sell .

If you know how this works there is no reason to get pissed at the stores , it's just the way it works . Get hip to this concept and it will save you lots of money and bad feelings over the years . When you are young and don't have that much money to start with it is even more important , I did the trade in thing because I didn't know any better . Hopefully you young guys will read this thread and get a clue .