Need cabinet suggestion: fEarful/TL-606

virginiacreeper · #1 03-22-2010, 06:37 AM

I've searched many threads but haven't really found an answer to this question. I recently built a TL-606 cabinet and loaded it with an EVM- 15L after hearing many (Mesa and Dietz ) over the years. I like it a lot but about the time the paint is drying I discover the fEarful threads here on TB. I have the materials and hardware (no speaker yet) to build a second cabinet to be used at our practice space and 2 cabinet set-ups should we ever get out of the basement. Do I:
a) build a second TL-606
b) build a fEarful 15/6 and hope for compatibility when 2 cabinets are required
c) build a fEarful and load the TL-606 with a 3015 and hope for compatibility
d) build a TL-505 and utilize my EV 18b that is in a large/heavy cabinet? (this doesn't really address the need for a cabinet in two locations)
I definitely enjoy the sound of my current set-up but really like what I've been reading about the fEarful designs.
Thanks for any input you may have.

will33 · #2 03-22-2010, 06:48 AM

If you have the power to push it, an fearful can outperform a pair of the EV's, no need for a pair of cabs to handle most any reasonable gig. If you build one, I'd consider that the gig rig and leave the EV at the rehearsal space. The fearful will also sound vastly different from a TL-606, lower, higher, louder and widely dispersed sound.

If you like the sound of your current EV, building a second just like it would be the simplest and cheapest solution but you would likely need to use both of them at any but the smallest gigs.

lbwdog · #3 03-22-2010, 07:07 AM

If I were in your shoes I would definitely build a fEarful 15/6 to be used for all my gigs. You could then use the TL-606 for rehearsal, and as a second cab for big gigs. With the fEarful, you would have an extensively thought out design, using state of the art drivers. While the TL-606/EVM 15 is a very good box, it is still an older driver with limited performance.

You could load a 3015 in it and will probably match up better tonally with the fEarful. That's what I would probably do. There are a lot of vintage EV fans around, so you could probably sell the 15" & 18" EVs for a decent price.

Rumblefisher · #4 03-22-2010, 07:18 AM

The fearful is the evolution of the TL606. Basically, it can do everything the TL606 can't. It has more internal volume, a bigger port, and if you use the suggested drivers, sounds amazing. It really is a 3L" light, loud, and low.

rpsands · #5 03-22-2010, 09:05 AM

I'd build a 15/6 and see how you like it. Also, post in the fEarful thread to see if you can find someone around Denver to let you check one out

They are all over the country at this point.

I used to own a ~3cf cab with an EVM15L and frankly did not like it. The amount of bass available is laughable, and the top end is nice, but not an 18 sound 6nd410

The rest of the options you post, I'd consider adding another TL-606, but I'd recommend an Eminence 3015 (not LF) in it - see how you like that. It's a different midrange character than the EVM15L, but it has a LOT more bottom available and can be pushed a lot harder - and can take a lot of eq.

liam_g · #6 03-22-2010, 12:34 PM

I definitely love my pair of TL606s with 3015s installed. But then I play mostly fretless with flatwounds ...

I think a FEarFul would be great too, though.

Cheers,
Liam

virginiacreeper · #7 03-22-2010, 12:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by will33

If you have the power to push it.

The GK 800RB pushes the EV pretty hard; is this enough for a 15/6?
Thanks for the input folks.

Calaverasgrande · #8 03-22-2010, 02:09 PM

the 606 design sounds pretty good on bass because of its midrange tone. You can get bass out of them but it takes some eq.
I also have heard them perform better with other speakers, but as has been pointed out elsewhere in this forum, its always a crapshoot when you put a different driver in a vented cabinet that wasn't designed for it.
Sometimes its better, sometimes it's unusable, sometimes its just the same, but different.

liam_g · #9 03-22-2010, 02:13 PM

I modeled the 3015 in the TL606 in WinISD before doing the switch. It works very well. It's not quite the perfect dimensions for a 3015, but not too far off.

Cheers,
Liam

rpsands · #10 03-22-2010, 03:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Calaverasgrande

the 606 design sounds pretty good on bass because of its midrange tone. You can get bass out of them but it takes some eq.
I also have heard them perform better with other speakers, but as has been pointed out elsewhere in this forum, its always a crapshoot when you put a different driver in a vented cabinet that wasn't designed for it.
Sometimes its better, sometimes it's unusable, sometimes its just the same, but different.

It is not always a crapshoot if you model it. That's a bit of a general guide that somehow became an axiom, but the purpose was to suggest people use simple modeling programs to figure that stuff out instead of dropping drivers in at random.

There are very few bass cabinets below the boutique range where you could not improve performance (or performance AND weight) by dropping in a set of stock eminence drivers - it's sad, but most of the lower end companies use OEM versions of Eminence's drivers designed to be cheaper, not necessarily better. This is a big reason why I will recommend anyone with some patience do one of the following things: Build their own cabinet, have someone do it for them (LDS, Speakerhardware, etc), or buy an old cabinet and refit it with nice drivers, as opposed to buying a new cheap cabinet.

Even in the boutique range there're a number of situations where people have been happier with stock em drivers (e.g. some folks prefer the Deltalite 2512 II over the stock Aguilar GS driver).

koobie · #11 03-22-2010, 10:50 PM

What head do you use? Does it have enough power at 8 ohms to fully exploit a fEarful? What kind of tones/music do you prefer?

One of the reasons I initially opted to go with dual 3015-loaded cabs was to fully exploit the 4 ohm output of an amp I had, (since sold, hah!). After I sold the amp, I kinda wondered if I'd a been better off with a single fEarful, given that my current power amps have more than enough juice at 8 ohms to do justice to a fEarful.

I have only briefly heard and played through some fEarful cabs at our local GTGs and they are impressive on every level. In particular, the low end extension of both the 15/6 and the 12/6 is huge & effortless. I can't say a whole lot about the fEarful's off-axis dispersion of the upper mids/highs, I wasn't paying close enough attention to that aspect. But I have no reason to doubt that the off-axis dispersion is superior to most if not all conventional, old-school cabs.

My 3015-loaded 606-type cab sounds nice and clear (clear enough for my musical tastes, anyway) when I'm in front of it. But as expected, the clarity in the upper mids & highs drops like a rock when I move off to the side, even just a bit. But dang, in bass cabs there is a character to the sound of a full-range driver design that I seem to prefer. It's not as pretty or as extended as the two and three-way designs, but it's gutsy & immediate.

Aside from the very limited dispersion, for my admittedly pedestrian tastes, I think I like the cruder stuff better. However I do reserve the right to do a 180 after our next area's GTG!

will33 · #12 03-22-2010, 11:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by virginiacreeper

The GK 800RB pushes the EV pretty hard; is this enough for a 15/6?
Thanks for the input folks.

To clarify, the fearful is high in sensitivity (lot's of sound coming out per watt going in) so you don't need a big amp to make it get loud and sound good.

But you would need a pretty large amp to push an fearful close to it's limits, ie: get all you can out of it. The thing has so much excursion it can handle the larger bass amps out there and pretty good size poweramps in rack rigs.

The 800rb will sound great and play pretty loud through an fearful but that cab can handle more than that amp has to give.

Calaverasgrande · #13 03-23-2010, 02:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by koobie

My 3015-loaded 606-type cab sounds nice and clear (clear enough for my musical tastes, anyway) when I'm in front of it. But as expected, the clarity in the upper mids & highs drops like a rock when I move off to the side, even just a bit. But dang, in bass cabs there is a character to the sound of a full-range driver design that I seem to prefer. It's not as pretty or as extended as the two and three-way designs, but it's gutsy & immediate.

Maybe you are hearing what an inductor based crossover does to the sound on 2 ways and 3 ways. Inductors ring, so they smear the sound a little.
Which is why band limited single driver boxes sound more immediate. I've gutted the tweet on my Mesa. Becuase I hate that sound.
OTOH, I may have to build one of these fearfuls just so I can know of what you guys speak.

virginiacreeper · #14 03-23-2010, 09:04 AM

Thanks for all the information. I will obviously have to build a fEarful. Thanks greenboy and everyone else making this possible!

rpsands · #15 03-23-2010, 11:32 AM

The 800 RB is actually pretty awesome for a fEarful, as you can get a little extra juice out of it by biamping (and save 60-70 bucks on crossover parts, and an hour or two of time soldering).

Start your crossover around 500hz and move around from there.

virginiacreeper · #16 03-23-2010, 01:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rpsands

The 800 RB is actually pretty awesome for a fEarful, as you can get a little extra juice out of it by biamping (and save 60-70 bucks on crossover parts, and an hour or two of time soldering).

Start your crossover around 500hz and move around from there.

Good to know; thanks. I guess my only concerns now have to do with the fEarful being a little too "hi-fi" and how it sits in the mix. Apparently they do really well in a mix and I will just have to adapt if the cabinet sounds "too" good!

rpsands · #17 03-23-2010, 01:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by virginiacreeper

Good to know; thanks. I guess my only concerns now have to do with the fEarful being a little too "hi-fi" and how it sits in the mix. Apparently they do really well in a mix and I will just have to adapt if the cabinet sounds "too" good!

If it's too high fi, adjust the midrange volume on the 800rb until it sounds right to you

The beauty is that in a cab that can be truly studio-type hifi, you can turn it off. You can eq a strong voicing into a clean cab but you can't eq a strong out as easily (especially if there are FR limitations to deal with)>