Need help on cabs for metal

[Halloween]

Hello guys,

I am looking for a 610 or 810 cab. I play in a death metal band, like Cannibal Corpse, Dying Fetus, etc. I mainly use fingerstyle, and pick occasionally, never slap. My basses are Spector Euro and BC Rich with EMG pickups, and my amp is Ampeg SVT-2 pro. I need a cab which should be loud enough and can cut through the noise, and hopefully easy to transport.

The cabs I am interested in
Ampeg 610 or 810
Mesa Boogie Powerhouse 610 or 810
SWR Goliath Senior or Megoliath
Bergantino NV610
EBS Proline 610 or 810
EBS Neoline 810
Gallien Krueger Neo 810
Schroeder 610L

The neodymium speakers cabs are much lighter, that is really good for me as I tour a lot. But I have no experience of those neo cabs, and I have been told the neo speakers sounds modern. Would you please give some suggestions?

Thanks very much!

Robin

[bexarametric]

I use an Ampeg 6x10 and smile. Although your bass and head are equally as important.

The 6x10 sounds close enough to the 8x10 to my ears and it's lighter. Of course if you're playing in a club, you may go direct anyway (making your cabinet choice insignificant to the audience)

Many of the cabinets on there will work. I really dig the Mesa stuff.

[JimmyM]

I agree that many cabs would work, even the neos. But Ampeg invented the 810 and nobody does it better IMHO.

[madmatt]

I would go 15's or 12's.

[Mybikeisblack]

Im in a band similar to that, I use the ampeg 610, works great!

[paganjack]

I can't speak to all of those cabs, but the NV610 is pretty dang awesome. Light, well-designed, and still vintage sounding. It's super easy to move. It has a ton of clarity, which if you play like Alex Webster, is awesome. I use mine in a power/prog metal band and it works like a charm. It kinda mixes itself into the band, more than a ported cab does. IMO, IME etc etc. I am biased towards the sealed cab sound.

[Doll]

Originally Posted by JimmyM

I agree that many cabs would work, even the neos. But Ampeg invented the 810 and nobody does it better IMHO.

If I am not mistaken I do believe Traynor was the first company in North America anyways to release an 810 cabinet?

[JimmyM]

Originally Posted by Doll

If I am not mistaken I do believe Traynor was the first company in North America anyways to release an 810 cabinet?

Theirs was a different speaker array, though. They had 3 columns, with 3 in the outside columns and 2 in the inside. Not the same thing, and IMHO not as all-around efficient as the Ampeg. However, your point is that they were first with an 810, and you would be correct, I spose, though I'm not exactly sure of the timeline.

[Halloween]

Originally Posted by paganjack

I can't speak to all of those cabs, but the NV610 is pretty dang awesome. Light, well-designed, and still vintage sounding. It's super easy to move. It has a ton of clarity, which if you play like Alex Webster, is awesome. I use mine in a power/prog metal band and it works like a charm. It kinda mixes itself into the band, more than a ported cab does. IMO, IME etc etc. I am biased towards the sealed cab sound.

Hi Jack,

Thanks for your input. I've never tried the NV610 or other sealed cab. Dose it work good with full tube amp?

Robin

[georgestrings]

Originally Posted by JimmyM

I agree that many cabs would work, even the neos. But Ampeg invented the 810 and nobody does it better IMHO.

IME, 810s by both Mesa and SWR smoke the venerable Ampeg fridge in terms of volume, low end, and clarity - by a LONG ways... I would imagine that the same thing can be said for EBS as well, but I have no direct experience in the matter...


- georgestrings

[Doll]

Originally Posted by JimmyM

Theirs was a different speaker array, though. They had 3 columns, with 3 in the outside columns and 2 in the inside. Not the same thing, and IMHO not as all-around efficient as the Ampeg. However, your point is that they were first with an 810, and you would be correct, I spose, though I'm not exactly sure of the timeline.

I have never used the old style Traynor 810 but seeing as they changed to follow Ampegs design I would venture to say Ampeg perfected the idea. Traynor has the claim of the first 810 in NA on their website which is the only reason I mentioned it, I would assume they would do their research before posted something like that.

[JimmyM]

Originally Posted by georgestrings

IME, 810s by both Mesa and SWR smoke the venerable Ampeg fridge in terms of volume, low end, and clarity - by a LONG ways... I would imagine that the same thing can be said for EBS as well, but I have no direct experience in the matter...

Clarity = tweeter, and I don't like tweeters. Turn it off in those cabs, and there's actually less clarity IMHO. Low end I'll give you, but as the Ampeg 810 goes plenty low enough for my tastes and the other cabs go too low for my tastes, so I'm not worried about it.

As for volume capabilities, knowing what I know about power handling capabilities, I would seriously doubt either the Mesa's or SWR's ability to handle more power in the real world than the Ampeg. Sure, their power handling numbers are higher than Ampeg's, but Ampeg gives you the number where fartout occurs, and SWR and Mesa give you the thermal power handling, which is a much higher number based on what amount of wattage causes the voice coils to melt down. Real world, any power handling difference will be slight at best. Besides, I'm so out of the loudness game and have been for a very long time

[garmenteros]

I'd go for mesaboogie on tone and power alone. It isn't light by any means. I'd like to try the ebs ones down the line but I've tried gks and ampegs and currently own a mesa so you already know my favorite.

[tdub0199]

Originally Posted by georgestrings

IME, 810s by both Mesa and SWR smoke the venerable Ampeg fridge in terms of volume, low end, and clarity - by a LONG ways... I would imagine that the same thing can be said for EBS as well, but I have no direct experience in the matter...


- georgestrings

Low end isn't going to cut through in a setting such as the OP's.... he will get drowned out by the low tuned guitars being in his frequency range... he will need more mids as the Ampeg 810 will cut through better IMO......

[rockstarbassist]

NV610 is what I'd pick. Way better tonally than the fridge and easier to move around. With the PH610 coming in second.

[rockstarbassist]

Originally Posted by tdub0199

Low end isn't going to cut through in a setting such as the OP's.... he will get drowned out by the low tuned guitars being in his frequency range... he will need more mids as the Ampeg 810 will cut through better IMO......

you know that's why amps have EQ, n?
Also ported vs. sealed is a whole 'nother discussion anyway. And does the Ampeg cut thru better IYO or actually IYE? How much time with it vs. the other models, specially?
His EQ'd DI signal is gonna make the FOH sound good or bad more than likely anyway. Lots of people on this board (and thread) talk a lot but don't have much real world experience vs. guys like george who uses/tries lots of gear, so his input is gonna be that much more valuable to the gigging bassist vs. basement br00tz or jazz virgins still working on their 3rd gig.

Also we all know Jimmy to be the death metal connoisseur of the board lol. Alex also recently switch to an SWR-1500 and SWR Megoliath 810, but you guys are probably right that it has no cut and he needs to switch back...

[tdub0199]

Originally Posted by rockstarbassist

you know that's why amps have EQ, n?
Also ported vs. sealed is a whole 'nother discussion anyway. And does the Ampeg cut thru better IYO or actually IYE? How much time with it vs. the other models, specially?
His EQ'd DI signal is gonna make the FOH sound good or bad more than likely anyway. Lots of people on this board (and thread) talk a lot but don't have much real world experience vs. guys like george who uses/tries lots of gear, so his input is gonna be that much more valuable to the gigging bassist vs. basement br00tz or jazz virgins still working on their 3rd gig.

Also we all know Jimmy to be the death metal connoisseur of the board lol. Alex also recently switch to an SWR-1500 and SWR Megoliath 810, but you guys are probably right that it has no cut and he needs to switch back...

It was my opinion if you can't read.... Thats the one thing I hate about this forum, the smartazz know it alls.......... you are right, you know everything..... and I'm a "Basement br00tz" with no experience what so ever..... go ahead Mr. Know it all, tell him how to set his EQ, tell him which bass to buy, tell him what kind of strings to buy..... which pickups to buy and so on.......

[JimmyM]

Originally Posted by rockstarbassist

Also we all know Jimmy to be the death metal connoisseur of the board lol.

I was playing metal before most of you existed outside of your dad's sack. Don't make the mistake of assuming that what a person does now is all they ever did or all they know how to play.

[georgestrings]

Originally Posted by JimmyM

Clarity = tweeter, and I don't like tweeters. Turn it off in those cabs, and there's actually less clarity IMHO. Low end I'll give you, but as the Ampeg 810 goes plenty low enough for my tastes and the other cabs go too low for my tastes, so I'm not worried about it.

As for volume capabilities, knowing what I know about power handling capabilities, I would seriously doubt either the Mesa's or SWR's ability to handle more power in the real world than the Ampeg. Sure, their power handling numbers are higher than Ampeg's, but Ampeg gives you the number where fartout occurs, and SWR and Mesa give you the thermal power handling, which is a much higher number based on what amount of wattage causes the voice coils to melt down. Real world, any power handling difference will be slight at best. Besides, I'm so out of the loudness game and have been for a very long time

Honest question, Jimmy - have you actually played the PH810 or Megoliath, and if so - have you pushed them hard to see how loud they'll get before farting out???

The reason I ask is, I have, and it's nearly impossible to get either to fart out - and in my actual experience, both will get significantly louder than Ampeg's 810... I'm not talking about numbers on a piece of paper, I'm talking about actual real world performance...

I realize that you qualified your statement about no one doing the 810 thing better than Ampeg as "IMHO", and you're certainly entitled to that... But, I would submit that when it comes to the type of situation the OP described, your most accurate statement was this:

"Besides, I'm so out of the loudness game and have been for a very long time"

I gig in a loud 2 guitar band w/ a pair of Triple Rec halfstacks every weekend, and I've played most big cabs on the market at one time or another - I *might* know a little more about this particular situation than you do...

One last thing - IIRC, a couple members of BassGear Mag calling the PH610 and PH810 the best cabs they ever played thru - I don't ever recall them mentioning the SVT810e at that time, though...


- georgestrings

[georgestrings]

Originally Posted by tdub0199

Low end isn't going to cut through in a setting such as the OP's.... he will get drowned out by the low tuned guitars being in his frequency range... he will need more mids as the Ampeg 810 will cut through better IMO......

Yeah, get back to me when you've gigged all 3 cabs in loud 2 guitar bands like I have, OK???


- georgestrings