Need help with my bass tone.

line6spiderii · #1 12-12-2012, 04:50 PM

I am playing through a Ampeg PF-500 for over a year now. No problems with it at all. I am pushing it through a SVT 410 HLF cab. 4 ohm load also. I also use a BA-115HP Ampeg combo amp with my set up. I use the line out on the PF-500 in to the input of the BA-115HP. I am also using a MXR-10 band eq along with a BBE sonic stome pedal before the amp. My problem started when I started a new band. Both my guitarist play all tubes and and half stacks. My drummer plays a double bass kit with triggers on the kick drums. This set up used to be amazing with my old band. But now that I'm trying to keep up with tube amps I'm not getting the great tone I had by pushing the amps so hard. To get it loud enough to be heard I end up loosing alot of my bottom end. I want a really crisp clean punchy sound. Any suggestions on what to try with my current set up that might help. Also I'm considering going with a Mesa Boogie Big Block 750 to try and accomplish what I'm after. What are yall's thoughts on this. I'm a relatively new bass player and am learning more and more about bass equipment. I'm orginally a guitar player.

Got2SadowskyNYC · #2 12-12-2012, 05:19 PM

I think the problem is you got loud band members.

1) Use earplugs. This will do 2 things. Keep you from going deaf and you'll be able yourself better because it will peal a lot of high freqs. off.

2) Don't stand directly in front of your amp. Bass Freqs. need 20 feet or so to develope. Put the amp across the room facing you.

3) Depending on the how the live out is wired, it may be after the EQ, you need to be careful pulling into the front of a second amp. You can easily damage the second amp. This will also have a dramatic effect on the overall sound.

3) try to flatten out the EQ but boost the lows on the amp so it sounds full. If you're scooping the mids to much you're looseing your "cut". The Sonic Stomp is a happy face EQ. The Low knob is a boost only at 40hz. The "process" knob is a boost only at 10k. If you scoop on the amp, the EQ pedal and then use the Sonic you're loosing lots of mids so you cant hear yourself.

silky smoove · #3 12-12-2012, 05:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Got2SadowskyNYC

2) Don't stand directly in front of your amp. Bass Freqs. need 20 feet or so to develope. Put the amp across the room facing you.

I agree with everything you posted except for this, which is an outdated myth. It's simply not true. If it were, headphones wouldn't work for anything but the highest frequencies.

Roadkill · #4 12-12-2012, 05:38 PM

Get rid of the mismatched stuff and just run the PF500 into an SVT 8x10 cab - it should be plenty loud enough

. They are often available used on Craigslist. MF is blowing these out right now too:
http://www.musiciansfriend.com/ampli...peaker-cabinet

rodl2005 · #5 12-12-2012, 05:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roadkill

Get rid of the mismatched stuff and just run the PF500 into an SVT 8x10 cab - it should be plenty loud enough

. They are often available used on Craigslist. MF is blowing these out right now too:
http://www.musiciansfriend.com/ampli...peaker-cabinet

+1 The 410hlf is a very low tuned cab-so a lotta yr power's going into producing much low freqs-most you don't "need" -especially to cut thru/be heard in a band mix.
Get a 810, which will focus more of yr power into low mids rather than the ultra low freq area, & also give you twice as much speaker area altogether-which equals more volume.
I'd quit running the extra amp also. Might be doing less for ur overall sound than anything.
500w into an 810 (even a 610,215,412 - that's NOT tuned ultra low) will be heaps.

joelb79 · #6 12-12-2012, 05:58 PM

I cannot believe anybody has not suggested at least a 7Pro.

Kmonk · #7 12-12-2012, 06:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Got2SadowskyNYC

I think the problem is you got loud band members.

2) Don't stand directly in front of your amp. Bass Freqs. need 20 feet or so to develope. Put the amp across the room facing you.

Quote:

Originally Posted by silky smoove

I agree with everything you posted except for this, which is an outdated myth. It's simply not true. If it were, headphones wouldn't work for anything but the highest frequencies.

This "myth" is actually true. Sound waves travel differently based on frequency. Higher frequencies develop more quickly. The reason headphones work is that they are tuned differently to compensate.

RickenBoogie · #8 12-12-2012, 06:19 PM

I think a different, (bigger) cab will solve the issue. Your 410hlf is the wrong cab for you, but a sealed 810 would rock.

Roadkill · #9 12-12-2012, 06:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kmonk

This "myth" is actually true. Sound waves travel differently based on frequency. Higher frequencies develop more quickly. The reason headphones work is that they are tuned differently to compensate.

^ and regular bass cabs are tuned by aliens from the ninth dimension. You need to line them with tinfoil to make them sound right in this universe.

makohund · #10 12-12-2012, 07:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kmonk

This "myth" is actually true. Sound waves travel differently based on frequency. Higher frequencies develop more quickly. The reason headphones work is that they are tuned differently to compensate.

Doesn't matter how long the waveform is from one peak/trough to the next. That compression wave hits you no matter how close to the speaker you get. In the case of 40Hz, 40 of them hit you every second.

Doesn't matter that the front of the first wave is already 28 or so feet behind you by the time the end of it passes and the next one rolls in. It still hit you, and so will the next one.

My favorite quote from the below links:

"what you're arguing is a little like saying you can't feel a 3-foot arrow going through your body if you're only standing 1 foot from the tip when the archer releases it" - Richard Lindsey

About "bass frequencies need space to develope" myth

Bass Frequency Myth!

makohund · #11 12-12-2012, 08:53 PM

For the OP...

Redo all of your EQ from square one... turn off all of the outboard stuff and start from scratch (knobs at noon) on the PF500 into the 410HLF.

If you have enough volume, tweak to taste. If not, drop the low knob down and the volume up till you either have enough, or the tone starts to displease you. Find that limit. Then tweak to taste with the amp knobs, as close as can get it

Then start putting other things back in... first the EQ, and get it where you like it (in band mix, not solo). Then the sonic whatchamacallit (being wary of mid-suck mentioned in previous posts).

If after all of that, you like what you hear, but it isn't loud enough (or pushing loud enough is stressing your cab)... you need another of the same cab. Or a different cab.

You might be able to squeeze a bit more out with a a good HPF like the FDeck. Can eliminate unnecessary lows that eat up your headroom, and/or allow pushing your cab harder/cleaner.

two fingers · #12 12-12-2012, 09:05 PM

You need a lot more speakers to keep up with the volume of the other stuff, or a rig pointed at your head. Of course, another option would be to set fire to the half stacks and double kick kit. If they attempt to buy another of the same rig, remind them that you have more matches.