New rig help - custom

[Nerk]

Hi everyone,

Just want to verify if this will work, I've still not completely decided... but here's the rig I'm thinking of putting together.

Pre-Amp: BBE Max
Power Amp: Yorkville AP4040: 1200w (x2) @ 4ohms (already aquired)
Cabinet 1: Ampeg PN-410HLF: 850w RMS @ 8ohm
Cabinet 2: Custom Built Peavey Black Widow 18" (or 15") 350w RMS @8ohm

So here's what I'm thinking... The power amp will do 600w at 8ohms, which is not enough for the 4x10, but too much for single 18". The cabs were going to be wired in series on a single channel, in order to leave the other channel open for a monitoring system.

In general, I'm thinking I have more then enough power in a single channel that I don't really need to use power amp to its fullest capacity... Am I at risk of under powering my 4x10 and overdriving my amp and over powering the 18" speaker and overdriving that speaker? or will the levels eventually balance themselves out magically?

Right now, for fun, I have my buddies yorkville bass head I think its 400w RMS, going to a 2x15 cab, not sure of the speakers, but they sound like crap and I have the line out from that head going into the effects return of my peavey 2x10tx... needless to say, I'm not satisfied with my current rig... noisy and muddy at the same time... Anyhow, got a pretty big gig in a week (opening act for Alexis on Fire) and I don't want to sound like garbage... so I need help... fast can anyone suggest anything?

I'm thinking the easiest solution is to just use both channels so I can adjust the volume of each cab accordingly... and also, what are the sound differences between an 18" and 15"... I rarely play a 5 string, but looking to fill in the gap that most 4x10's have in the low end department...

ok, hopefully that wasn't too much of a lengthy post... any help is appreciated...

thanks,

[MIJ-VI]

Originally Posted by billfitzmaurice

And placing two tens vertically halves their vertical dispersion. That's why the 4x10 is the worst possible speaker topology, because it has limited dispersion on both axis. As with a 1x15 you can tilt a 4x10 back so that you can hear it, though that doesn't help the rest of the band or the audience. Vertically stacked 2x10s give the best possible result for you and everyone else.

speaker cab questions

Originally Posted by billfitzmaurice

Anytime you stack two drivers dispersion will be halved on the stacking plane. Put them side by side and horizontal dispersion is halved, put them vertical and vertical dispersion will be halved. In a 4x cab dispersion is halved on both planes.

But if you stack the drivers vertically you can simply tilt the cab back so that you can hear it. If you stack four drivers vertically the vertical dispersion will be 1/4 that of one driver, but since the topmost driver is up close to ear level you'll still hear it just fine. With a 4x10 nothing can be done to make its dispersion angle any wider.
The narrow dispersion of the 4x10 on both planes, about the same as a 1x21, explains the preference of many players for a vertical 2x15, or stacked 1x15s. While one fifteen has narrower dispersion than one ten, it has wider dispersion than two tens.

speaker cab questions

As for mixing a 4x10 with a different cab in a full-range bass rig? Please check out the link in my sig.

BTW. I once tried a pre & power amp setup with a 18" for the lows. It sounded as musical as a mudslide.

For a truly Hi-Fi bass rig one would do well to consider a tone-shaping pre-amp (eg VT Bass Deluxe etc) into decent 3-way PA cabs, or better yet, a good 2-way powered wedge cab as an on-stage bass monitor and then DI with the VT' into FOH.

.02

[JimmyM]

i'll just briefly say that the whole underpowering thing is crap. i'll also say the idea that a 410 doesn't have as much low end as a 115 or 118 is also crap.

and don't panic about your gear. as long as it works, it'll be fine, even if it's a little noisy. chances are they'll run your bass through a di anyway, and it'll sound like whatever they want it to sound. better to take a little time and do a little research first. especially in your case where you've been told a lot of stuff that's been proven as myths.

[Sartori]

What MIJ and Jimmy said.

You can't underpower your cabs, that's a myth. Don't worry about it.

You CAN overpower your speakers. The 410 will take a lot more punishment than the 18. And don't worry about low end... the 410HLF is known for having enormous amounts of low end.

As for differences between 15" and 18" speakers... well, it depends on which two you're comparing. Speakers aren't so simple that size alone will make a huge difference in sound. Some 15" speakers are awful. Some are amazing. Same with 18" speakers.

Maybe ditch the 18".

Don't worry that this means you'll exceed the power handling of the 410HLF. Just because you have 1200 watts doesn't mean you're actually going to constantly be using all of it. If you're opening for Alexisonfire, you'll probably have PA support. If you're still worried, get another 410HLF.

Or just don't sweat it, or even just use what you have.