Omnidirectional cut-off point...

[will33]

That's what I took the sub beam steering to be, a sort of Danley, Meyer, McCauley type of highend stuff/thing. Not commonly found in even very high quality "regular" systems.

I was envisioning driver placement within the box, along with various geometry gymnastics internally involving various baffles/reflectors, etc., but yeah, it makes a lot more sense to do it with multiple boxes/positioning, just due to the wavelengths involved down there.

Thanks Mr. Gavin. More food for thought.

[will33]

"McCarthy", not those other highend names I threw out there.

Have to look up that paper...thanks.

[Russell L]

Well, last night was too LOUD! Gotta talk to the guys about that. Anyway, I started out with "frown face" eq. But, my nails required still lowering some high mids. Otherwise, the lows (40Hz shelving) were at 9:30, low mids (360Hz peak-type) at 1:00, high mids (800Hz peak-type) had to go down to about 10:00, and the highs (I forget what the freq is centered at) were at 10:00. No filters to start, not bad, but I soon wanted to use the VLE a bit. Sounded kinda thin in front of it (Markbass LMIII with dual 151P cabs stacked vertically on their small ends for height---does that make any difference?). If I stepped to the side it sounded fuller. After a set another guy played my bass through my rig. I went out front and walked around. By dawg if it didn't still have almost too much bottom. I forgot to dial back in some high mids for him, too, so it was a bit too round sounding, if that makes sense---too smooth, I guess. But, like I've said, the room is boomy, and there were three guitars going all at once, plus harmonica (at one point there were three harmonicas! never seen that before!). Anywhere I went in the room the sound of the bass was the same, though, I swear. Smooth or not, though, I could still hear it. I'm beginning to think that I can roll off 40Hz and below to almost nothing and still sound good through this system. I know even my little 121H combo puts out an amazing low end.

Sigh, alas, but I may still get an eq pedal so I can play with other frequencies, especially in the 80-120Hz region. It's the only way I'll know. Then, I may find that I don't need one, but I think I must try that route and see.

Obviously the lower lows were everywhere and anywhere in the room, though, all over. I love this Markbass stuff, except for a lack of extra eq control. Maybe I should get a Momark system?

[will33]

I'd look for something like a small, 2-band parametric eq you could add on before going out to get a whole 'nother amp.

You could surgically slice out your fingernail clack without losing all the upper mids, and then have another band to do with as you wish. Could dump the amps bass knob and put back in 80hz bass with the pedal or whatever control you needed beyond the amp eq.

[Russell L]

Originally Posted by will33

I'd look for something like a small, 2-band parametric eq you could add on before going out to get a whole 'nother amp.

You could surgically slice out your fingernail clack without losing all the upper mids, and then have another band to do with as you wish. Could dump the amps bass knob and put back in 80hz bass with the pedal or whatever control you needed beyond the amp eq.

Well, I thought of the Momark since right now I don't have a handy back-up amp anyway. If I did it, it could be my main and the LMIII could be my back-up. Otherwise, I'm looking at what's available in pedals. That would be cheaper for now.

[will33]

Well, if you need a backup, that makes more sense. It just seemed an expensive way of doing things to me to get another whole amplifier just for the extra eq knob or 2.

Everyone should have some sort of backup, some way of making the gig happen should a particular piece fail unexpectedly. For some, that means another amp, for others, just might mean a DI, but no gig should go south as the result of the failure of a single piece of equipment.

[Foz]

Omnidirection propagation will only occur in a free field [a purely theoretical construct]. In the real world boundary elements [walls, floors, baffles] must be considered or your estimates of behavior will be way off base.

Pistonic beaming onset is not gradual. This behavior arises from a wavelength/speaker cone dimension relationship that is non-trivial in its efficacy. Large pistons don't propagate small waves [relative to the piston size] like bubbles [or half bubbles] instead ray acoustic paradigms apply. This relationship is stark [review polar plots for large baffle mounted speakers and you will see the pistonic limit .

Boundary reflections including reinforcing reflections and edge effect caused by the speaker baffle have significant impact on propagation and ultimately speaker array performance and must be taken into consideration for any given listening position in order to make reasonably accurate predictions of results.

As bgavin points out all of the above is beyond the scope of the OP but if the thread doesn't expand in scope the take away conclusions will be gravely misleading.

[bgavin]

As Foz notes above, the polar charts reveal all.
One can debate endlessly the number of angels dancing on the heads of pins, but in the end the charts are the proof.

I have yet to find a T/S simulation that measures on the RTA the same as it shows on screen.

[KJung]

Originally Posted by Foz

Omnidirection propagation will only occur in a free field [a purely theoretical construct]. In the real world boundary elements [walls, floors, baffles] must be considered or your estimates of behavior will be way off base.

Pistonic beaming onset is not gradual. This behavior arises from a wavelength/speaker cone dimension relationship that is non-trivial in its efficacy. Large pistons don't propagate small waves [relative to the piston size] like bubbles [or half bubbles] instead ray acoustic paradigms apply. This relationship is stark [review polar plots for large baffle mounted speakers and you will see the pistonic limit .

Boundary reflections including reinforcing reflections and edge effect caused by the speaker baffle have significant impact on propagation and ultimately speaker array performance and must be taken into consideration for any given listening position in order to make reasonably accurate predictions of results.

As bgavin points out all of the above is beyond the scope of the OP but if the thread doesn't expand in scope the take away conclusions will be gravely misleading.

Yes, the room you play in impacts the performance of your rig