Question about running two cabs

amiller72392 · #1 06-05-2010, 05:06 PM

Hey guys, I know very little when it comes to amps and such. That being said. If I were to get a 2nd cab for my Backline 600 head, would it be twice as loud as running one cab? Because I can't really get the volume I need without it distorting from turning way up. Any tips on how to reduce distortion at higher volumes would be very appreciated. Thanks!

RickenBoogie · #2 06-05-2010, 05:08 PM

The FAQ's at the top of the page has all the answers. Not knowing the impedance of your ONE cab, makes it difficult to answer here. Your GK head can run as low as 4 ohms, no lower. Read the FAQ's and the answer should be clear.

amiller72392 · #3 06-05-2010, 06:27 PM

Yea right now I'm using a goldline 4x10. I like the punch from the 10in. speakers.

Gintaras · #4 06-05-2010, 06:34 PM

Your Backline is 300 watts at 4 ohms. With your 8 ohm cab you are running somewhere around 200 watts. You can add another 8 ohm cab and that will take you to 4 ohms total and will use the full 300 watts. Also your cab is rated at 400 watts.

You will be louder with another cab but I would investigate upgrading the head. Hopefully some G&K owners will comment.

canadian*eh · #5 06-05-2010, 07:44 PM

I am a Owner of a GK 1001rb II and am running it through 2 SWR Goliath 410 cabs... It does get louder with 2 cabs for the fact that i am going from 460watts up to 700 watt and also for the fact that i am running twice as many speakers with cabs as with one. That being said it does not get twice as loud even though i am jumping up 240 watts!!! maybe a 1/4 to a 1/3 as again as loud but that is it... and alot of that has to do with having the extra speakers. The fact is the more speakers you have the more volume. Now to twist things up a bit more it also depends on the sensitivity of your cab as well. a 610 cab rated at 110db's @1w1m is going to be louder then a 810 cab rated at say 98db's @1w1m just because it is tuned to be louder not because it has more or less speakers!!! Seeing with your head that is will be only jumping up 100 watts it will not like i said get a lot louder, but you will find,depending on the cab you add, that it will sound deeper,fuller and all around more clear and rich with a noticeably added volume!! That my 2 cents worth and i will end it here for now... There are alot of guys on here that know alot more about this then i do i just pick it up from them and i dont even know if i am100% right But i hope i am not to far off...i can only tell you what i have experienced ... but i hope it will help you in your search to become a better bass player and more familiar with you amp and cabs!!! Best Of Luck Cheers Mate!!~Elliot

Bass_Pounder · #6 06-05-2010, 08:06 PM

To get "twice as loud", you would need to increase your wattage by 10X

Running a second cab will increase speaker are, and lower your ohm load (which increases wattage output - but not by 10X). You may see an increase of up to 5-6db

amiller72392 · #7 06-05-2010, 08:22 PM

So if I replaced it with a higher wattage amp, say a 700 watt amp, would I be able to still run it to my 400 watt cab? And still be able to get a louder clean tone? Thanks for all the responses guys

canadian*eh · #8 06-05-2010, 08:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by amiller72392

So if I replaced it with a higher wattage amp, say a 700 watt amp, would I be able to still run it to my 400 watt cab? And still be able to get a louder clean tone? Thanks for all the responses guys

Well you would only be getting 460 watts from say a 1001rb II with your cab seeing that it is only a 8ohm cab...you still would be pushing your luck running that much power in to a cab that is only rated 400 watts you would want to have 2 cabs still so you could get your 700 watts @ 4 ohm rating that the head would give you... or if you are happy with only 460 watts at 8 ohms... i would say Up grade your cab to something other then a backline and go for some Pro stuff and if you still only want one cab but want all the power the head will give to just go with 1 4ohm cab... but then you are limiting yourself if you want to add more since most heads dont do good below 4 ohms and will cook if you drop them lower!!!

amiller72392 · #9 06-05-2010, 08:41 PM

So would I be able to keep the sound clean with say a GK 1001RB and 2 4x10's? I'm currently looking into an Ampeg portabass, 800W and am wondering if I picked up another 4x10 if it would help with this. Thanks!

oren · #10 06-05-2010, 08:46 PM

As I learned this stuff back in college (which was a long time ago, so forgive if any of it isn't quite right):

Theoretically, if speaker cabs were pure resistance, then the total resistance of two loads in parallel would be (r1*r2)/(r1+r2). So two 8 ohm cabs would show 4 ohms to your amp, an 8 ohm and a 4 ohm would show 2.6666... ohms, etc. (It actually gets more complicated than that, because speakers aren't pure resistance, they're more like inductors, which have impedance, which is sort of a variable resistance that varies with frequency. But that part is usually ignored in these kinds of conversations.)

When you cut the resistance in half you double the power (measured in watts). But because loudness (measured in db) is a logarithmic measure (which more or less approximates human hearing perception) a doubling of power gets you +3 db in volume.

lbwdog · #11 06-05-2010, 09:05 PM

Taking your first rig question; If you add an identical cab, you'll gain about 3 db in SPL. At the same time, you're reducing the impedance, so you'll increase power from 200w to 30w. This will give you another 1.5-2 db, so your total result will be a gain of 4.5-5 db.

IMHO,the BL 600 is a good amp but those Goldline speakers are a budget line made for Guitar Center/Musicians Friend and are rated for only 100w per driver. Your best bet would be to upgrade to a more sensitive, and higher power rated cab (I'd choose lighter as well). I would try an SWR Golight, or maybe one of G-K's upper line Neos.

canadian*eh · #12 06-05-2010, 09:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by amiller72392

So would I be able to keep the sound clean with say a GK 1001RB and 2 4x10's? I'm currently looking into an Ampeg portabass, 800W and am wondering if I picked up another 4x10 if it would help with this. Thanks!

The lower the ohms you go the cleaner the sound!! I have to say the gk 1001rb II has to be one of the cleanest sounding head you will ever use... not much frills with it!!! and she Get LOUD...i mean really LOUD!!! There are alot of 1000 watt heads out there that could take lessons from it when it comes to volume!!! Trust me unless you are playing a football stadium with out pa support there is no way you will ever use all that power... that being said i like having more power then not enough...you can always turn down!!! I am running mine through 2 410 cabs and wow she is sweet....i get nothing but compliments about how it sound...It is Punchy Low and clean!! By far the best sounding setup i have ever used or herd!! Best Of Luck Mate!!~Elliot

Bass_Pounder · #13 06-05-2010, 09:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lbwdog

Taking your first rig question; If you add an identical cab, you'll gain about 3 db in SPL. At the same time, you're reducing the impedance, so you'll increase power from 200w to 30w. This will give you another 1.5-2 db, so your total result will be a gain of 4.5-5 db.

IMHO,the BL 600 is a good amp but those Goldline speakers are a budget line made for Guitar Center/Musicians Friend and are rated for only 100w per driver. Your best bet would be to upgrade to a more sensitive, and higher power rated cab (I'd choose lighter as well). I would try an SWR Golight, or maybe one of G-K's upper line Neos.

/\/\/\/\

This

If you are serious about upgrading your rig - the first thing you need to do is ditch the Goldline cab.

Although rated at 400 watts, that is only the THERMAL rating before burning up the voice coil. Depending on how you EQ your amp, you might be lucky to actually get 125-175 watts out of that cab before it reaches mechanical limits and starts farting out/distorting.

amiller72392 · #14 06-05-2010, 09:27 PM

Thanks guys, what would you recommend for a better cab? I play in a 4-piece alt rock/post hardcore band so we play kind of loud. With two guitarists and and a drummer, so I want to be heard through them. Keeping in mind we play places without adequate PA systems. Thanks!

Jaco who? · #15 06-05-2010, 09:46 PM

http://www.rmcaudiodirect.com/Gallie...Amps-s/129.htm If you're considering upgrading your head to one of the RB series GK heads later on, you might want to consider the cabs from these guys. You'll be able to use the horn management feature to control the tweeter on a 700RBII or a 1001RB.

http://www.avatarspeakers.com/

These are always a good value too. I like their 2x12 cabs the best, particularly for lower powered heads. A 4Ω 2x12 or a pair of 8Ω 1x12 cabs would work well with the BL600, and be pretty decent with anything up to around 500 watts, imho - Also agree about the goldline sentiments above.

amiller72392 · #16 06-05-2010, 09:52 PM

Alright, thanks guys. I'll be looking into a better cab. I'll probably keep the BL 600 for now. And see if a new cab does the trick. I want to get the most out of this amp if possible. Because I love the tone...at low volumes. Once I turn up it gets too muddy and fuzzy. I hope a new cab will solve this.

amiller72392 · #17 06-05-2010, 10:04 PM

Sorry for the double post, but a quick question. If I did get a 1000 watt amp, could I run it into a 400 watt cab?

Bass_Pounder · #18 06-05-2010, 10:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by amiller72392

Sorry for the double post, but a quick question. If I did get a 1000 watt amp, could I run it into a 400 watt cab?

Yes, as long as you listen to your cab for signs that it is being pushed too hard.

However, if you are talking about still using the Goldline cab with a new, more powerful head - you already answered your own question below.........

Quote:

Originally Posted by amiller72392

Alright, thanks guys. I'll be looking into a better cab. I'll probably keep the BL 600 for now. And see if a new cab does the trick. I want to get the most out of this amp if possible. Because I love the tone...at low volumes. Once I turn up it gets too muddy and fuzzy. I hope a new cab will solve this.

It's not the head getting muddy and fuzzy at higher volumes, it is the cheap cab.

amiller72392 · #19 06-05-2010, 10:09 PM

Nah, I meant a nicer cab. Thanks so much for all the info. It really helps.

Bass_Pounder · #20 06-05-2010, 10:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by amiller72392

Nah, I meant a nicer cab. Thanks so much for all the info. It really helps.

Then yes.......no problem with running a 1,000 watt head through a 400 watt cab.

Even with a powerful head like that, unless you had severe EQ'ing going on and had the volume maxed, you would rarely ever be putting out the whole 1,000 watts continuously.

Your speakers will let you know when they are feeling the pain. Just listen for for it, and back the volume or low end EQ down.

Lastly, and most importantly...............the key to getting louder is ALWAYS more speakers - NOT more power. You would be better off running a couple of hundred watts through two 4X10's than you would running 1,000 watts through a single 4X10.