Researching a EV TL806Q DIY Cabinet build.

JMac4strngr · #1 08-20-2010, 08:39 AM

I have been toying with the Idea of building me a custom cab for a while. A while back I posted a thread about a 4-10 cab build I was brain storming and got a lot of usefull info from the guys on this forum, saving me wasting time and money on building a cab that would be fart city.
After thinking about it for a while and recent GAS attacks for a 4-12 cab, I went to doing some homework. I found the EV builders plans for the TL806Q cab, which on paper looks cool. I would be planning to build the cab off the plans to the letter, and loading it with four Eminence S2012's. The S2012's as far as I can tell from reading the specs would be a great match for the cab.
Any tips or advice from the pro's around here is appreciated and welcome. I really want to be sure I am going in the right direction before I pull the trigger and order the goodies.

JMac4strngr · #2 08-20-2010, 09:05 AM

Oh yea, here is the link for the Build plans......

http://archives.telex.com/archives/E...rs%20Plans.pdf

rpsands · #3 08-20-2010, 09:38 AM

Terrible design for a bass cab. Cut it in half from right to left and only do two vertical drivers.

JMac4strngr · #4 08-20-2010, 12:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rpsands

Terrible design for a bass cab. Cut it in half from right to left and only do two vertical drivers.

Interesting. What would be the benefit of cutting the cab in half and going with two vertical drivers versus the quad set-up?

rpsands · #5 08-20-2010, 12:27 PM

Vastly superior horizontal dispersion, half the weight, not having to wire series/parallel (so you get a 4 ohm load instead of 8 -- an 8 ohm 4x12 is yuck to me).

JMac4strngr · #6 08-20-2010, 12:45 PM

I understand what you are saying with the the 8 ohm thing. However I am trying to understand the the dispersion thing, wouldnt it essentialy be like putting two of the 2-12 cabs side by side? Or would the speakers being side by side cause the inferior horizontal dispersion? Couldn't that be fixed by off-setting the horizontal alignment of the speakers?
Oh yea, the weight of a cab like this would be a far cry lighter than what I currently use (Ampeg Fridge).

silky smoove · #7 08-20-2010, 12:49 PM

Horizontal dispersion is inversely proportional to the width of the speaking surface. It's counterintuitive until you start researching why it works that way.

JMac4strngr · #8 08-20-2010, 01:04 PM

So I read up on the Horizontal dispersion thing. According to what I have read most commercially available 4-10, or 8-10 bass cabs have poor horizontal dispersion. I see now, Hmmmm

BassmanPaul · #9 08-20-2010, 01:25 PM

Yep, vertical is the way to go as RP opines. The difference between stacking a pair of my 2x10s vertically against horizontally is quite dramatic. I can actually hear what I'm putting out.

Paul

rpsands · #10 08-20-2010, 02:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JMac4strngr

So I read up on the Horizontal dispersion thing. According to what I have read most commercially available 4-10, or 8-10 bass cabs have poor horizontal dispersion. I see now, Hmmmm

Yeah pretty much every 4x10/8x10 out there has worse off-axis mids than a vertical 2x15 would.

Plus, good on you for reading up on it

It really does exist.

JMac4strngr · #11 08-20-2010, 02:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rpsands

Yeah pretty much every 4x10/8x10 out there has worse off-axis mids than a vertical 2x15 would.

Plus, good on you for reading up on it

It really does exist.

Another thing that hadn't crossed my mind before You mentioned it. I find it absolutely funny that the industry standards for bass guitar equipment were designed that way to begin with.
So, I have been checking out the fEarful 1212 cab design, any thoughts on using the S2012's in that, or would the best option be to use the 3012LF's...... The 3012HO looks interesting as well.
Hey thanks for the advice BTW!

rpsands · #12 08-20-2010, 02:45 PM

My recollection is that S2012s want a bit smaller box than the 1212/6, but the 3012LFs are worth the money there...probably give you 6db more peak spl at least.

Building a cabinet akin to the Barefaced Super Twelve with 3012HOs would be a fantastic exercise...I made one kinda like his Midget and it sounded great. Lots of work to do yourself on tuning there though, and if you want a crossover.

The fEarful 1212/6 is a great design though. It'll do the work of almost any conventional 4x12.

1n3 · #13 08-20-2010, 04:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JMac4strngr

I find it absolutely funny that the industry standards for bass guitar equipment were designed that way to begin with.

The 810 originated in an era when commonly available drivers could only take 25-30 watts. To handle high power, you needed a lot of speakers. Eight speakers in a column wouldn't work, so they were arranged 2 x 4. That design (and the 410) persists today mostly because it "looks right", and the market buys what is familiar. This has been much-discussed here, as you've probably learned in your search.

Quote:

So, I have been checking out the fEarful 1212 cab design, any thoughts on using the S2012's in that, or would the best option be to use the 3012LF's...... The 3012HO looks interesting as well.

The fEarful 12 cabs are designed around the 3012LF, which is not a full-range speaker. The 3012HO is better for full-range, but you'd have to use a different cab design...

Quote:

Originally Posted by rpsands

Building a cabinet akin to the Barefaced Super Twelve with 3012HOs would be a fantastic exercise...I made one kinda like his Midget and it sounded great. Lots of work to do yourself on tuning there though, and if you want a crossover.

rpsands 3012HO build

The Kappalites can take a lot of power, but you pay more $ for that. The Basslites are about as sensitive, so if you don't plan to dump more than 250 watts into the cab, they'll probably be the better value. As with the 3012HO, you'd probably have to come up with your own cab design. Many threads here about using WinISD for that purpose.

You should also have a look at the BFM Jack 12, particularly if you're going only with 12s.

rpsands · #14 08-20-2010, 04:24 PM

The Jack 12 is a great way to roll with 12s. I own two, and they're super crazy loud. The built in tone profile is just about perfect for rock and roll bass tone -- lots of mids, super clear, and crazy loud.

If you're more of a warmer country or blues type of tone, unless you've got pretty solid eq (3 band parametric or 7 band graphic at minimum IMHO) I'd steer clear of the Jack 12.

Bmorefoozler · #15 08-20-2010, 05:10 PM

I believe there is a vertical 2xBasslite 12 cabinet floating around here somewhere that Don at LDS made for a bss builder if memory serves me. 1 way, no tweets, vintage sounding cab. He loved it. Sorry memory doesn't serve me bette as to whom it was.

JMac4strngr · #16 08-21-2010, 08:56 AM

That BFM Jack cab looks very interesting. The jack 12 seems like it could do what I am looking for. I will look into it further, but that may be the best direction to go if decide on the 3012HO. I am learning a lot more than I anticipated from my research on enclosures, very cool.

1n3 · #17 08-21-2010, 12:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JMac4strngr

That BFM Jack cab looks very interesting. The jack 12 seems like it could do what I am looking for. I will look into it further, but that may be the best direction to go if decide on the 3012HO.

Speaker and cab choices should be influenced by 1) the amp you will use, 2) your tonal preferences, and 3) how loud you want to be. Can you fill in the blanks?

JMac4strngr · #18 08-21-2010, 02:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1n3

Speaker and cab choices should be influenced by 1) the amp you will use, 2) your tonal preferences, and 3) how loud you want to be. Can you fill in the blanks?

Yes, My current rig set-up has the potential to be very loud. I am the kind of guy who'd rather have and not need, than need and not have as far as my rig goes. My current gig-rig is a Hartke LH1000, and an Ampeg SVT 810 cab. What I am hoping to accomplish with building this cab would be a compact replacement for the 8-10 cab. Being that this current setup will level small buildings, if I am trying to build a cab to match it volume-wise it is gonna have to be on the heavy duty end of things. Hence the reason I was originally interested in building the 4-12.

So My answers to the questions would be:
1) Hartke LH 1000

2) Overall I like to be tonally flexible with a rig, however I know most of the time I like a fairly clean tone with a little gain to give it some grit, with nice defined lows(not too boomy or muddy), a good bit of mid, and just enough high end to give it a little brightness or sizzle(too much high end makes things way to clanky sounding for me). All this sounds like some kind of cooking recipe.....

3) I Play mostly traditional loud rock music. With my band I have to compete with a loud drummer, guitar player with a cranked jcm800 half stack, and most of the time the venues we play do not supply PA support for the guitar or bass. So I would think that I'd need it to be pretty loud.

1n3 · #19 08-21-2010, 04:50 PM

Thanks, JMac4strngr. That adds a lot to the picture. Followup question: how do you usually set the tone controls on your LH1000 with the 810?

JMac4strngr · #20 08-21-2010, 06:59 PM

OK, on the LH1000 I have the eq set as follows: Bass 4, Mid 8, Treb 3. When I first got the amp that seemed a bit odd, but after I read up on how the tone stack runs (which is like an old fender bassman) it is actually tweaked a little above flat. Also I rotate back and forth between a 2 and 3 band stingrays, and a p bass every now and then. I basically set my eq to sound pretty good with any of my basses, so I can dial on it a bit with the eq on each of the instruments to get what I want.
BTW: I certainly appreciate all your help.