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-   -   Running a 1x12/Tube Head at 75-100 watts..... (http://www.talkbass.com/forum/f15/running-1x12-tube-head-75-100-watts-952265/)

duderus 01-25-2013 08:08 PM
Running a 1x12/Tube Head at 75-100 watts.....
 
Running a 1x12/Vintage Tube Head at 75-100 watts....

I Don't Have a PA to plug into. What are some tips (mixing amps, mic the cap to effects loop of another amp... etc..) way to amplify the tone louder

Simply put I want more watts from my gem. Thank u.

B-string 01-25-2013 08:21 PM
If you are just wanting more sound output....GET MORE SPEAKERS! :)
Seriously I am not joking. Watts are not the answer.

duderus 01-25-2013 08:42 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by B-string (Post 13778691)
If you are just wanting more sound output....GET MORE SPEAKERS! :)
Seriously I am not joking. Watts are not the answer.
I figured that all....

Just thought there would be another way...

What about Sending a DI with post tube tone? Do you know how that countrymen Type 85 works or something else? Pretty much sending a DI Post preamp, to board on a vintage amp?

Thanks for ur time.

chaosMK 01-25-2013 08:43 PM
Make sure you are using a loud 1x12. My Mesa PH is probably one of the louder/bigger sounding ones out there and there are other good ones. Sometimes a clean boost in the FX loop can give you more clean output if that is what you are looking for.

B-string 01-25-2013 08:59 PM
The 85 samples a signal from parallel jacks (select speaker to set the internal gain). This would be a good choice if you are happy with your stage volume and just want pre-colored signal from your amp (connected to a cab also) to a PA.

duderus 01-25-2013 09:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by B-string (Post 13778847)
The 85 samples a signal from parallel jacks (select speaker to set the internal gain). This would be a good choice if you are happy with your stage volume and just want pre-colored signal from your amp (connected to a cab also) to a PA.
So I would connect the speaker out to the 85, then to the cab? And your saying mic the cab?

Just trying to figure this out. I am a Novice to amps. I used solid state my whole life and I just fixed my bass tube amp and LOVE it. Thanks again.

duderus 01-25-2013 09:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by chaosMK (Post 13778790)
Make sure you are using a loud 1x12. My Mesa PH is probably one of the louder/bigger sounding ones out there and there are other good ones. Sometimes a clean boost in the FX loop can give you more clean output if that is what you are looking for.
I am using an UL1x12 epifani and it booms like my 2x12. So, I got that part.

Effects loop. Are you saying prior to the amp? There is no effects loop in back.

B-string 01-25-2013 09:13 PM
Yes amp to the 85, 85 to your speaker cab. No need to mike the cab unless you want to. XLR from the 85 will go to the mixer (cable it just like a mike, the 85 will replace the mike on the cable).

two fingers 01-25-2013 09:16 PM
What kind of amp (brand and model)? That would probably help the experts here answer your questions.

But if you are wanting to hear more volume on stage, more speaker surface area is about the only thing that will get it done. If you are only concerned about the FOH, then the options are as varied as the people who will give you the advice. Speaker level DI (but which one), line level DI (but, again, which one), and mic (did I mention which one). Of course, there will be the endless combinations of those options suggested as well. Good luck sorting through it! It's a bit overwhelming but fun stuff to learn.

two fingers 01-25-2013 09:18 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by B-string (Post 13778897)
Yes amp to the 85, 85 to your speaker cab. No need to mike the cab unless you want to. XLR from the 85 will go to the mixer (cable it just like a mike, the 85 will replace the mike on the cable).
I'm probably going to give one of these a try, and start with a SM57 on the front to see if micing is my thing. (not both at the same time, but either or for experiments) Maybe try a couple of different mics that I can borrow from other sound guys.

B-string 01-25-2013 09:21 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by two fingers (Post 13778917)
I'm probably going to give one of these a try, and start with a SM57 on the front to see if micing is my thing. (not both at the same time, but either or for experiments) Maybe try a couple of different mics that I can borrow from other sound guys.
Use the 85 to one channel strip and the mike(s) to a different channel strip so you can compare very easily. :)

duderus 01-25-2013 09:24 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by two fingers (Post 13778910)
What kind of amp (brand and model)? That would probably help the experts here answer your questions.

But if you are wanting to hear more volume on stage, more speaker surface area is about the only thing that will get it done. If you are only concerned about the FOH, then the options are as varied as the people who will give you the advice. Speaker level DI (but which one), line level DI (but, again, which one), and mic (did I mention which one). Of course, there will be the endless combinations of those options suggested as well. Good luck sorting through it! It's a bit overwhelming but fun stuff to learn.
It's a yorkville yba2 amp. Sounds wicked through my cab. Warmer than my epi head. 1969 simple with new killer tubes.

duderus 01-25-2013 09:26 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by two fingers (Post 13778917)
I'm probably going to give one of these a try, and start with a SM57 on the front to see if micing is my thing. (not both at the same time, but either or for experiments) Maybe try a couple of different mics that I can borrow from other sound guys.
R u saying the using the 85 to mic to a di? I am lost on this post. Ha

B-string 01-25-2013 09:29 PM
No the 85 replaces a mike input to the mixer. He wants to A/B it with a miked cab sound input to the mixer.

duderus 01-25-2013 09:44 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by B-string (Post 13778962)
No the 85 replaces a mike input to the mixer. He wants to A/B it with a miked cab sound input to the mixer.
Great thanx.

I may try one. I like the idea of the ground lift too.

two fingers 01-25-2013 09:46 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by B-string (Post 13778962)
No the 85 replaces a mike input to the mixer. He wants to A/B it with a miked cab sound input to the mixer.
Exactly. I too have come back to tube amps live after a long break from them. And I am just wanting to experiment, but without having to buy 15 DIs and mics! That's where the experience we are surrounded by here comes in handy.

T-Bird 01-25-2013 10:34 PM
Hi.

More speakers.

Preferably with a higher sensitivity than the average = horn loaded or a whole bunch of them if direct radiators are your thing.

IME 410 is perfectly adequate for smaller gigs with 100ish "tube" watts but the more, the merrier ;).

Quote:
Originally Posted by duderus (Post 13778628)
I Don't Have a PA to plug into.
Then You have no use for a DI either in this particular case.
Handy to have in the future though in case there's PA support, and You can't go wrong with the Countryman.

If it's the stage volume You're concerned with, elevate the cab.
You will notice a percieved loss of lows, but the audience won't.
Simply because You actually won't lose any lows, but will hear mids and highs better.

Slaving onto another MI amp can be done with a DI or a mic, but only if the said amp has a mic-level input.
Otherwise it's just waste of time and money.

Running two different amps/rigs at the same time amplifying the same frequency range won't most likely sound very good either.

Regards
Sam

duderus 01-27-2013 06:50 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by T-Bird (Post 13779130)
Hi.

More speakers.

Preferably with a higher sensitivity than the average = horn loaded or a whole bunch of them if direct radiators are your thing.

IME 410 is perfectly adequate for smaller gigs with 100ish "tube" watts but the more, the merrier ;).



Then You have no use for a DI either in this particular case.
Handy to have in the future though in case there's PA support, and You can't go wrong with the Countryman.

If it's the stage volume You're concerned with, elevate the cab.
You will notice a percieved loss of lows, but the audience won't.
Simply because You actually won't lose any lows, but will hear mids and highs better.

Slaving onto another MI amp can be done with a DI or a mic, but only if the said amp has a mic-level input.
Otherwise it's just waste of time and money.

Running two different amps/rigs at the same time amplifying the same frequency range won't most likely sound very good either.

Regards
Sam
If I put the countryman in between the amp head and cab does it cut tone?

Downunderwonder 01-27-2013 07:02 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by duderus (Post 13787604)
If I put the countryman in between the amp head and cab does it cut tone?
JimmyM reckons it cuts some zing, I've not had a chance to check the few times one has been used that way on me but Jimmy has good ears.

T-Bird 01-27-2013 08:44 PM
Hi.

Quote:
Originally Posted by duderus (Post 13787604)
If I put the countryman in between the amp head and cab does it cut tone?
I haven't used 'em enough to know, but the safe bet is that they all do.
To a degree anyway.
I for one wouldn't probably use the word cut to describe what's happening.


It's irrelevant in the studio though, since the cab is most likely miked, not DI'ed.

It's irrelevant in the live situation as well because the onstage rigs subtle tonal variations because of the DI can be adjusted if they're noticed.
The FOH engineer OTOH works with the signal going to his/her desk, and treats/tweaks it accordingly.

Regards
Sam


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