Schroeder BMF 215 who has one?

[Drifta]

Wasn't able to come up with much in the search i did here on talk bass.

Was looking at it on bass central's website (haven't had a chance to go in and try it out if they got it in stock)

The specs, price, and the reputation (of the brand) has me seriously intrigued.

right now my setup is a 2x10 ampeg, and a 1x12 aguilar and i'm not TOO happy with it. I'm going to keep the little ampeg for the apartment.. but wanted to sell the 1x12 and upgrade to a single 4 ohm cab (rather carry one cab than two) for band situations.


800 Watts RMS

35hz – 16khz

104db SPL @ 1W/1M

47 lbs.

36”Hx17”Wx15”D


theres the stats. Sounds like it will fit into my civic.

Think this is a good match for my shuttle 6.0? it doesn't say the ohmage, but i assume it is available in 4 or 8?

I think 2x15 @ 600 watt from my shuttle would move some serious air. Thats what i'm after, my current rig sounds great and is loud, but now i'm doing a lot more club/dancehall type music and i really need to pound it (alot of just drum/bass) and move the low freq with the low B.


if you have tried or have this cab -- or know of anything thats close to it, any advice or information is greatly appreciated. Thanks.



- Sam

[KJung]

I had the 115 version of this cab for quite a while. Really nice box... super lightweight, very high sensitivity (loud per watt). However, it achieved that high sensitivity by being very mid present and a bit attenuated down low. The voicing is quite even from the upper bass through the lower treble... no big peaks and valleys like the 'baffle' versions of the Schroeders, but it is a 'tight and a bit bright and grindy' voicing.

So, more like a super loud 10" loaded box (for lack of a better description) than what most would think of as a '215' sound.

I dug it... sounded good in the mix. I assume the Shuttle 6 with the 'bass boost' engaged would sound quite good through that cab, but it will be 'tight and bright'... much more 'punchy' than 'pillowy', if that makes any sense.

The tweeter is very smooth and actually quite subtle. Most of the treble actually comes out of those very aggressively voiced drivers (I believe Celestion Neo's).

IMO and IME... and again the BIG assumption I'm making is that the 215 version is similarly voiced to the 115. Given the similar dimensions of the cab (i.e., seems roughly double the 115), and the same driver, it is probably a pretty good assumption.

[Drifta]

Originally Posted by KJung

I had the 115 version of this cab for quite a while. Really nice box... super lightweight, very high sensitivity (loud per watt). However, it achieved that high sensitivity by being very mid present and a bit attenuated down low. The voicing is quite even from the upper bass through the lower treble... no big peaks and valleys like the 'baffle' versions of the Schroeders, but it is a 'tight and a bit brighte and grindy' voicing.

So, more like a super loud 10" loaded box (for lack of a better description) than what most would think of as a '215' sound.

I dug it... sounded good in the mix. I assume the Shuttle 6 with the 'bass boost' engaged would sound quite good through that cab, but it will be 'tight and bright'... much more 'punchy' than 'pillowy', if that makes any sense.

The tweeter is very smooth and actually quite subtle. Most of the treble actually comes out of those very aggressively voiced drivers (I believe Celestion Neo's).

IMO and IME... and again the BIG assumption I'm making is that the 215 version is similarly voiced to the 115. Given the similar dimensions of the cab (i.e., seems roughly double the 115), and the same driver, it is probably a pretty good assumption.

Well it goes down to the 30's frequency and that is what the LF boost does (30-60 hz~ around there). I'm not looking for a muddy sound. but thats what I need, a really loud cab that can be moved easily. my current rig gets loud - but doesn't have the low's i'm looking for which makes me boost way more than I want to eating up all my headroom, I don't want to have to push my amp and cabs that hard.


I mean it's not super bright right? I mean i'm used to 10s and 12's so unless it sounds like a guitar cab it's fine by me. Punch is a great thing too.. so maybe it's what I need. surely it's got to move more air than my current rig (and goes to lower hertz).

[KJung]

Originally Posted by Drifta

Well it goes down to the 30's frequency and that is what the LF boost does (30-60 hz~ around there). I'm not looking for a muddy sound.


I mean it's not super bright right? I mean i'm used to 10s and 12's so unless it sounds like a guitar cab it's fine by me.

Like most published frequency ratings, that low frequency is fantasy... ignore it.

Again, given my experience with the 115 version, running the Shuttle 6 without the bass boost into that cab will result in virtually no true low end at all. My guess is, the -3db point on that cab is more like 80hz or so. Nice and tight if that is your thing, and it will take a bit of EQ to widen it a bit. I had VERY good luck using the VPF (enhance control) on my Markbass heads, which extended the low end, softened the low mids, and extended the top end of the 115 version... pretty nice sounding.

The BMF cabs are the opposite of muddy... they are grindy, aggressive, loud beasts IMO and IME.

Again, hopefully someone who has this version of the cab will verify (or correct) my assumption that the 215 is similarly voiced to the 115.

If you are looking for a relatively lightweight cab that has a nice full low end and is a bit more relaxed in the midrange, the Bergantino AE212 is a thing of beauty, and a good match for the Genz heads. However, if you want it as light as you can get it, and dig the 'punch and grind', the 15 versions of the front mounted Schro's are pretty cool.

[Drifta]

Originally Posted by KJung

Like most published frequency ratings, that low frequency is fantasy... ignore it.

Again, given my experience with the 115 version, running the Shuttle 6 without the bass boost into that cab will result in virtually no true low end at all. My guess is, the -3db point on that cab is more like 80hz or so. Nice and tight if that is your thing, and it will take a bit of EQ to widen it a bit. I had VERY good luck using the VPF (enhance control) on my Markbass heads, which extended the low end, softened the low mids, and extended the top end of the 115 version... pretty nice sounding.

The BMF cabs are the opposite of muddy... they are grindy, aggressive, loud beasts IMO and IME.

Again, hopefully someone who has this version of the cab will verify (or correct) my assumption that the 215 is similarly voiced to the 115.

Oh man, buzzkill. I have a hard time believing any cab can't push good lows. Hopefully someone with this cab chimes in.

Is there any comparable 2x12 or similar cabs, that would do the job with similar specs? I'd really love to have a single 4 ohm cab that can handle A LOT. anything more and i'll be in the PA.

I live 20 minutes away from bass central so if they got one on the floor or in stock maybe i'll go try it out and some other stuff too. I used to love the idea of having a lightweight modular gig rig, but really just seems easier to carry one cab, maybe even with casters..

[KJung]

Originally Posted by Drifta

Oh man, buzzkill. I have a hard time believing any cab can't push good lows. Hopefully someone with this cab chimes in.

Is there any comparable 2x12 or similar cabs, that would do the job with similar specs? I'd really love to have a single 4 ohm cab that can handle A LOT. anything more and i'll be in the PA.

I edited my post above to suggest you at least consider the Bergantino AE212... 55 pounds, and a full, fat, beautiful thing. It sells for about $1,000, so my guess is, not that much more than the BMF215... not sure of Jorg's pricing on that one.

And again, to be clear, you can dial some nice upper bass into that cab, and it sounds very good, just trying to make clear that most looking for a 215 cab have a certain 'classic' low end in mind, and I don't think this particular Schro will get you there.

[Drifta]

Originally Posted by KJung

I edited my post above to suggest you at least consider the Bergantino AE212... 55 pounds, and a full, fat, beautiful thing. It sells for about $1,000, so my guess is, not that much more than the BMF215... not sure of Jorg's pricing on that one.

And again, to be clear, you can dial some nice upper bass into that cab, and it sounds very good, just trying to make clear that most looking for a 215 cab have a certain 'classic' low end in mind, and I don't think this particular Schro will get you there.

Yeah I get you. Will certainly look into the berg, have read lots about them over the years so I know they got a nice reputation.


yeah 700-1000 is roughly my budget. I get you on that 15's mindset. i'm not set on 15's, hell i'll grab a cab loaded with 10's but it just can't be in an awkward box shape that i can't load into the civic.

[Sundogue]

Originally Posted by Drifta

Oh man, buzzkill. I have a hard time believing any cab can't push good lows. Hopefully someone with this cab chimes in.

Very few cabs do push good (true) lows. By that, and what KJung was referring to is that the Schroeder isn't going to be strong with anything sub 100Hz (true lows).

However, it doesn't mean it has to be a buzzkill for you as most other commercial cabs don't push true lows either. Almost all of the offerings out there accentuate the second harmonics higher up...so instead of a true low E fundamental (41Hz) the second harmonic (82Hz) is what you hear much stronger.

That isn't a bas thing at all, and in fact it's what most bass players assume to be "low end" because it's rare they hear anything lower anyway out of many other cabs.

Schroeders are designed to be super loud in the upper bass/lo-mids but they do so at the expense of the low end, as most other cabs do.

[KJung]

Originally Posted by Sundogue

Schroeders are designed to be super loud in the upper bass/lo-mids but they do so at the expense of the low end, as most other cabs do.

I guess I agree with your general comment, but again, the BMF15 takes your example to the extreme... really high sensitivity in the midrange, and not nearly as much low end as many cabs out there (freak of nature regarding absolute volume per watt though).

Again, not doggin' it (gigged my Schro 115 a lot), it just 'is what it is'.... a super high SPL, punchy, small, super lightweight box, voiced to really punch out the midrange versus most other cab lines I've played (Epi, Berg, etc.).

[Drifta]

Originally Posted by KJung

I guess I agree with your general comment, but again, the BMF15 takes your example to the extreme... really high sensitivity in the midrange, and not nearly as much low end as many cabs out there (freak of nature regarding absolute volume per watt though).

Again, not doggin' it (gigged my Schro 115 a lot), it just 'is what it is'.... a super high SPL, punchy, small, super lightweight box, voiced to really punch out the midrange versus most other cab lines I've played (Epi, Berg, etc.).

Other than that berg ae212 What should I look into? The berg is intriguing because it looks rather vertical.

I'd like the cab to be more vertical (rectangular) than box-shaped. I looked at the genz benz 212 online and it looks more like a 410.

[KJung]

Originally Posted by Drifta

Other than that berg ae212 What should I look into? The berg is intriguing because it looks rather vertical.

I'd like the cab to be more vertical (rectangular) than box-shaped. I looked at the genz benz 212 online and it looks more like a 410.

That Genz NeoX212 is a nice one also... vertical orientation. I think you are looking at the Uber 212. Haven't heard that one.

The new GK Neo212 (not the super light cheap model, but the standard GK neo gets very good reviews also).

And, give your thread a few days to see if others who actually own the BMF215 verify (or not) the tonal similarity to the 115L

[Drifta]

Originally Posted by KJung

That Genz NeoX212 is a nice one also... vertical orientation. I think you are looking at the Uber 212. Haven't heard that one.

The new GK Neo212 (not the super light cheap model, but the standard GK neo gets very good reviews also).

And, give your thread a few days to see if others who actually own the BMF215 verify (or not) the tonal similarity to the 115L

Cool. I'm going to try to get over to bass central this week and snoop around. Really appreciate the help.

any more suggestions are appreciated.

[Sundogue]

Originally Posted by KJung

I guess I agree with your general comment, but again, the BMF15 takes your example to the extreme... really high sensitivity in the midrange, and not nearly as much low end as many cabs out there (freak of nature regarding absolute volume per watt though).

Again, not doggin' it (gigged my Schro 115 a lot), it just 'is what it is'.... a super high SPL, punchy, small, super lightweight box, voiced to really punch out the midrange versus most other cab lines I've played (Epi, Berg, etc.).

No doubt, taking the concept to the extreme is what the Schroeders are all about. You pack drivers into too small a space and you get all the benefits of volume from using two drivers, but alas, there's no room for both of them to get down low. Just the way it works.

And for the record, that is certainly not a complaint nor is it me being critical of the Schroeders in any way at all. In fact, I built a very small 215 similar to a Schroeder just to see what it does. And it does kick some serious booty volume wise and IMO has plenty of what most would think of low end (that upper bass/lo-mid content). And as you say...it does so to the extreme!

If the OP is looking for a ton of volume in a small box, a Schroeder is very hard to beat. Tone wise...I found that my Schroeder-esque 215 was pretty easy to EQ to taste, although you can only boost the deep lows so much because (as all cabs are) they are displacement limited.

In a full band context I think it would be difficult to even notice a lack of low end with a Schroeder 215. Perhaps it would be more noticeable playing it alone, but it should rock in a band setting.

[KJung]

Originally Posted by Sundogue

No doubt, taking the concept to the extreme is what the Schroeders are all about. You pack drivers into too small a space and you get all the benefits of volume from using two drivers, but alas, there's no room for both of them to get down low. Just the way it works.

And for the record, that is certainly not a complaint nor is it me being critical of the Schroeders in any way at all. In fact, I built a very small 215 similar to a Schroeder just to see what it does. And it does kick some serious booty volume wise and IMO has plenty of what most would think of low end (that upper bass/lo-mid content). And as you say...it does so to the extreme!

If the OP is looking for a ton of volume in a small box, a Schroeder is very hard to beat. Tone wise...I found that my Schroeder-esque 215 was pretty easy to EQ to taste, although you can only boost the deep lows so much because (as all cabs are) they are displacement limited.

In a full band context I think it would be difficult to even notice a lack of low end with a Schroeder 215. Perhaps it would be more noticeable playing it alone, but it should rock in a band setting.

+1 Nicely said!

[Drifta]

So i think i'm widening my choices : Berg Ae212 , GB neox 212 , maybe try that Schroeder out ..

I see there is the Schroeder 1212, looks interesting... is it voiced similarly to the BMF cabs? I saw BurningSkies had one and we play the same genre (reggae) so I sent him a PM.

[gmarcus]

I've been gigging the 1515L for 2 years now. This is the old style box with 2 15's and no tweeter. It works great in a Roots Rock - Blues type setting with the full band. On its own it sounds like a cardboard box, but in the mix it just works. It seems to pack all of the amps power into the frequencies that the band needs to sound good.

I see from your sig that you are into Reggae. It might work for that. If I roll off all of the treble on My P-bass I can get a pretty good dub tone. The best I can describe it is very solid, but not ultra deep. Its good for Sly and Robbie grooves with that harder edge.

I also have an Aguilar GS112. I've A/B'd them side by side. The 1515L is much louder than the GS112 and it sounds much much fuller and deeper (the deeper is probably psycho acoustic because of all of first harmonic content), but that is what it sounds like to me. I stacked both cabinets and it actually seemed to get softer and really boomy with the band. I unplugged the GS112 and the tone cleared up and got solid again. This was all done in the band mix context.

[lomo]

I have a BMF 215. Moderately forward in the mids, with better lows than my old 1212L, however. Very loud and light, with an amazingly small footprint. It's FS BTW, as I am a nEarful convert :-)

[Mike Shevlin]

For what it's worth, I tried the Schroeder 1515+L at NAMM a few years ago & it was spectacular~ the best cab I had heard all day. Very full and articulate & goes plenty deep~ Jorge told me a year later that the BMF sounds similar to it.

[rpsands]

Neox 212T is how I'd roll if you're looking to buy a production cabinet that sounds great with a Shuttle 6.0