Single Driver Full Range Speakers

[zorf]

I've been curious about the full range single speaker ultra high efficiency thing that's big in a corner of the hi fi audio world.
No crossovers.
I was wondering if that might work for bass, and for me, as an all purpose PA/Bass speaker for all the different instruments I play.
I was looking at either a single 15 or one or 2 12's in a coax type speaker.
The fostex or lowthers would be overkill for me but maybe the audio Nirvanas?
I don't want to have separate subs and i'd like to avoid the cube on a stick deal.
Just like to have a box on the floor.
Why would you need efficient speakers in this era of cheap power?
Well, I want to drive it with my 20 watt tube PA, which I love, so it needs to be efficient.
This would be for performances in small spaces for maybe 100 people or less.
Im resigned to having a pretty large box for bass extension.
I;m ok if it rolls off after 15K.
The Hi Fi folks and the PA folks don't speak the same language,
So i'm trying to figure it out on my own.
Or maybe just a PA speaker with a 15 and a horn?
I have the skills to make my own cabs if needed.
Any thoughts?
thanks

[GrowlerBox]

That's pretty much what the BFM Jacks are for, and there are some newish plans for a 15"-driver design.

I would put this question to the forum over at

www.billfitzmaurice.info

and see how it flies.

I have no connection except for owning a cab built to his specs and I love it.

[JimmyM]

you would need some sort of tweeter if you want up to 15k. can't just do it with a single speaker and nothing else.

[zorf]

cool.
i had tried to join up at his forum, but got discouraged after 20 tries at the anti spam filter.
Also, a little intimidated by the number of posts, and not sure where to post my questions.
I was really intriged by the melded piezo thing i saw over there.
Also, dont want a separate sub, and was unclear which of the many speakers would fit my needs.
Also the frequency chart for the jacks on his site show a big drop off below 100 HZ.
I need more energy between 40 and 100HZ.
thanks

[zorf]

hey jimmy,
the audio nirvana 15 and 12 inch speakers are supposed to go that high.

[rpsands]

They're coaxial of course they will. Kinda the point. Some of them are phase plugged I think instead of coaxial.

However, with 50w thermal ratings and 1mm of xmax and so forth, you're not going to get any real bass out of them.

For single woofer or two-way cabs, the jacks are the king of full range and solid poalr response all the way up.

[JimmyM]

Originally Posted by rpsands

They're coaxial of course they will. Kinda the point. Some of them are phase plugged I think instead of coaxial.

However, with 50w thermal ratings and 1mm of xmax and so forth, you're not going to get any real bass out of them.

For single woofer or two-way cabs, the jacks are the king of full range and solid poalr response all the way up.

what he said. coax speakers are sometimes used in bass cabs, but mainly as a space saving feature. i'm not crazy about them for instrument cabs.

[zorf]

The frequency chart for BFM Omni 15 looks more like what i'm looking for.
maybe a tall boy would work for me.
The hight might be good for getting the sound farther out into the audiance.
Anybody here built one?
wondering about the weight.
I've never had a fridge style cab before.
always played 1x15s or 4x10's.

[JimmyM]

they're not the lightest cabs in the world, but superior building methods do keep the weight down to a bare minimum. as far as height getting the sound out to the audience better, absolutely.

[rpsands]

If that's what you're looking for, I'd build a fEarful. Easier, smaller, lighter. Just my tuppence from hearing folks do their Omni builds.

[GrowlerBox]

Of course, if you want taller, you could put it on something.

[EAdanikDG]

What about a fEarful style 15/6 cab? It's not a single driver, however, but the advantages may be worth it.

[GrowlerBox]

Originally Posted by rpsands

If that's what you're looking for, I'd build a fEarful. Easier, smaller, lighter. Just my tuppence from hearing folks do their Omni builds.

I don't think he'll drag as much out of his 20W tube amp with a fEarful as with a horn-based design.

[rpsands]

Originally Posted by GrowlerBox

I don't think he'll drag as much out of his 20W tube amp with a fEarful as with a horn-based design.

Note: I missed the 20w tube amp

If he's thinking a single audiophile speaker at 95db sensitivity is enough then I'm pretty sure the fEarful would be fine with 98-ish.

That said, since there's going to be zero bottom end, I think jacks would be a far better way to go...you just can't crank much bottom end out of 20w (fletcher munson curves are a biatch). Just accept that it's going to be distorted and settle for mids, is how I'd roll.

[JimmyM]

fletcher munson wasn't as good a catcher as manny sanguillen.



i agree. 20w is useless for low end. now 25, otoh, is perfect:

[rpsands]

There's not any bottom end coming out of that either Jimmy. Pure mid-upper bass.

[zorf]

i had a vintage b15 long time ago, and it killed me to sell it, but it was just to light sounding down low for me.
by the way, just wanted to thank all of you for your comments.
Very helpful and interesting.

[JimmyM]

buncha pussies!



the world's most perfect bass amp/cab rig does not not need 30hz.

[zorf]

I remember my B-15 seemed to just kind of go away on the last half octave of bass on my 4 string.

Maybe rpsands has the right idea; just get the mids happening
and let the ear reconstruct the bottom with physco-acoustics.

[rpsands]

Gotta decide if you can deal with an uneven tone profile or not. If you can't, it's a fEarful stack time. If you can, get an 8x10 or something (or a stack of Jack 10s).