Go Back   TalkBass Forums > Bass Guitar Forums > Bass Guitar Forums > Amps [BG]
Register Rules/FAQ/CUP Members List Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read



Supporting Membership
Thank You

Latest Supporting Member
Donate to Upgrade Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
  #1  
Old 01-31-2014, 08:35 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Arlington TX
So how come you do that...?

Hey guys.

I'm feeling a little bored. So I decided to stir the pot a little bit. So I'm starting a thread with questions about stuff that people on here will say " It's bad to do _____________." or "It's pretty much necessary to _________________." and asking them "Why do those things?

For example: The one I'll put in is that nowadays it seems that the accepted wisdom is that if using a multiple cab rig, you should use all the same type of speakers or it is somehow bad.

But forever, back in the day, a REAL bass big show rig would generally be a high powered amp into a 4x10 and a 1x15. And my longest term rig was a 360W head, into a 400W powered 2x10 cab and an un-powered 2x15 cab.

Even now. The rig I'm contemplating moving on from is 2x10 + tweeter over 1x15,1x10, + tweeter.

So how come when I mentioned that the combination I was considering recreating was a 1x15 cab and a 1x12 cab, several people chimed in with "That's a bad idea. You should use two 1x12 cabs, or two 1x15 cabs. But not mix them. That's awful."

Why is it awful. I've done it for thirty three years and never thought it was awful back then.

Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand GO!



edit: Also, add your own things you may have wondered about.
__________________
If my posts can possibly be taken as bitterly cynical, horribly sarcastic, deeply contemptuous of my fellow human, and maybe somewhat humorous, then that's your safest bet.
  #2  
Old 01-31-2014, 08:53 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Virginia
I think people get carried away with looking for the best speaker placement/size, bi-amping, so on and so forth and forget to just listen to it and go by what they think sounds good.
Just my opinion.
  #3  
Old 01-31-2014, 09:03 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Arlington TX
But now you've got to throw in some vague question too, to keep the thread going.

I actually still prefer the mixed tone/frequency spread that I always got with multiple driver sizes. But then again, it's what I've been used to for about forever.

So I'll give you a throwaway question to keep it going: "Why don't people use stereo rigs with widely separated cabs any more?" This one should be easy. That fad died FAST back in the '80's.
__________________
If my posts can possibly be taken as bitterly cynical, horribly sarcastic, deeply contemptuous of my fellow human, and maybe somewhat humorous, then that's your safest bet.
  #4  
Old 01-31-2014, 09:07 PM
SactoBass's Avatar
There are some who call me.......Sactobass
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Sacramento California
Supporting Member
Bard: rock whatever you wanna rock!

Somewhere around my early 40's, I completely stopped worrying about what others think. I finally realized that other humans just aren't important enough to me to concern myself with what they think. I now (at age 57) do what I want, when I want, and I don't bother seeking the approval of others. It is incredibly liberating!

Of course, it is completely true that mixing a 410 and 115 is a no-no for a plethora of reasons that have been explained googolplex times here on TB so I won't regurgitate those reasons.

Just do whatever you want!
__________________
"Too much of a good thing.......can be wonderful!" - Mae West
  #5  
Old 01-31-2014, 09:13 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: NC, USA
Q. Why not mix driver sizes?
A. Because BFM said so.
  #6  
Old 01-31-2014, 09:18 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Houston, TX
The mixing speakers thing isn't really that it's always bad, it's that it has a very high potential for being less than the sum of its parts due to differences in power handling, phase shift, dispersion, etc.

Certainly there are many excellent speaker systems that have mixed drivers, but those systems were usually carefully designed and matched by a single design team.

Taking one speaker cab from company A and pairing it up with a very different cab from company B has very high odds for poor results. Doesn't mean it will always be bad, but it is very much a crap shoot.
__________________
"It is true that the rules of civil discourse demand that reason wear a veil whenever she ventures out in public. But the rules of civil discourse must change."
  #7  
Old 01-31-2014, 09:21 PM
mrb327's Avatar
Just say No to Tort
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Colorado
Supporting Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by BruceWane View Post
The mixing speakers thing isn't really that it's always bad, it's that it has a very high potential for being less than the sum of its parts due to differences in power handling, phase shift, dispersion, etc.

Certainly there are many excellent speaker systems that have mixed drivers, but those systems were usually carefully designed and matched by a single design team.

Taking one speaker cab from company A and pairing it up with a very different cab from company B has very high odds for poor results. Doesn't mean it will always be bad, but it is very much a crap shoot.
Mixing Cabinets and Phase Response.

I think this explains most of that you said. But as always, do what works for you
__________________
Jazz #1200 / Precision #1131/ Colorado #327/ Hartke 376
Wanted: Maple/Maple Precision neck, Squier or Fender 4 string
  #8  
Old 01-31-2014, 09:26 PM
JimmyM's Avatar
Registered User

Endorsing: Ampeg Amps, EMG Pickups
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Apopka, FL
Supporting Member
Here's the thing...is it better to know what can or will happen if you do certain things or is it better just to forget all about it and live in blissful ignorance? Personally, I'd rather know.
__________________
Ampeg Portaflex Club #1
Quote:
Originally Posted by beans-on-toast View Post
Tweeters are for the birds.
  #9  
Old 01-31-2014, 09:30 PM
Passinwind's Avatar
Charlie Escher
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Columbia River Gorge, WA.
Supporting Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bard2dbone View Post
Why is it awful. I've done it for thirty three years and never thought it was awful back then.
Everything was awful sounding back then.

Why do you think otherwise?
  #10  
Old 01-31-2014, 09:32 PM
SactoBass's Avatar
There are some who call me.......Sactobass
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Sacramento California
Supporting Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Passinwind View Post
Everything was awful sounding back then.
...except a blueline SVT into a flatback sealed 8x10! (IMO)
__________________
"Too much of a good thing.......can be wonderful!" - Mae West
  #11  
Old 01-31-2014, 10:04 PM
philvanv's Avatar
Gerbil Turds, Kitsap County Turd Core
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Supporting Member
"Everything was awful sounding back then.

Why do you think otherwise? "

Because SUNN was alive and killing the scene, the drugs were better and the speeds at that time helped us function incase one was to consume to much alcohol or a lewd....updownupdownuppassout.
Seriously , i think most of us mixed and matched back then because of financial problems, and it always seemed to workout. Its not like we played arenas, but we did play nice sized clubs..
__________________
http://www.reverbnation.com/gerbilturds

Last edited by philvanv : 01-31-2014 at 10:07 PM.
  #12  
Old 01-31-2014, 10:07 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Glen Cove, New York
Did we really need another mixed driver/mixed cab thread? There's a ton on here already, and they rehash the same opposing opinions every time!
  #13  
Old 01-31-2014, 10:37 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Arlington TX
Quote:
Originally Posted by spz8 View Post
Did we really need another mixed driver/mixed cab thread? There's a ton on here already, and they rehash the same opposing opinions every time!
We do if I'm using it to fight boredom.

But I was actually hoping to get a bunch of different stuff along those same lines. In stead of one long endless rehashing of an old argument, I wanted a series of short summaries of many old arguments.

But what can you do?

And I'm actually going to end up with the 1x12 + 1x15 because I like that.
__________________
If my posts can possibly be taken as bitterly cynical, horribly sarcastic, deeply contemptuous of my fellow human, and maybe somewhat humorous, then that's your safest bet.
  #14  
Old 01-31-2014, 10:43 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Brooklyn, NY
Quote:
Originally Posted by SactoBass View Post
...except a blueline SVT into a flatback sealed 8x10! (IMO)
Sactobass shoots.... and scores!
__________________
"People don't realize it, but the bass player holds the whole thing up like Atlas." -Some wino who talked to me on the subway on my way to a gig
  #15  
Old 01-31-2014, 10:51 PM
philvanv's Avatar
Gerbil Turds, Kitsap County Turd Core
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Supporting Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bard2dbone View Post
We do if I'm using it to fight boredom.

But I was actually hoping to get a bunch of different stuff along those same lines. In stead of one long endless rehashing of an old argument, I wanted a series of short summaries of many old arguments.

But what can you do?

And I'm actually going to end up with the 1x12 + 1x15 because I like that.
You are being serious, i' love to see a pic with the head and speaker covers removed!
__________________
http://www.reverbnation.com/gerbilturds
  #16  
Old 01-31-2014, 10:54 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
So how come you do that...?

Here's the question you should answer: how do you know it really sounds good? Have you compared, on the gig, what a matched driver rig sounds like? Maybe you really are missing he party? Sometimes something sounds fine until you hear something else that shows you how much better it could have been all along.

But in reality mixing driver sizes doesn't always sound bad. I am not sure it sounds bad even most of the time. But it can sound really bad (which you'd know) or it can just be a little flat and less punchy, which you might not realize without comparing.
__________________
Fender Jazz Bass Club #742; Source Audio Sorcerers #70; Maryland/Virginia/DC Bassists Club #40; PhilZone #21; 3Leaf Audio #66; John Paul Jones Fan Club #7; Pedal Breeders #6
  #17  
Old 01-31-2014, 11:03 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Arlington TX
Quote:
Originally Posted by HolmeBass View Post
Here's the question you should answer: how do you know it really sounds good? Have you compared, on the gig, what a matched driver rig sounds like? Maybe you really are missing he party? Sometimes something sounds fine until you hear something else that shows you how much better it could have been all along.

But in reality mixing driver sizes doesn't always sound bad. I am not sure it sounds bad even most of the time. But it can sound really bad (which you'd know) or it can just be a little flat and less punchy, which you might not realize without comparing.
This is actually fairly valid. I could just be used to it. But I guess it's because I really am used to it.

I had had bad pairs back in the day. But sometimes two from the same company would suck and two others of identical models would be awesome. And some of the bad ones were two of the exact same model cab. For examples, see the Hartke thread. I always assumed the problem was variability between individual cabs, not that the types of cabs/drivers were the problems.
__________________
If my posts can possibly be taken as bitterly cynical, horribly sarcastic, deeply contemptuous of my fellow human, and maybe somewhat humorous, then that's your safest bet.

Last edited by Bard2dbone : 01-31-2014 at 11:16 PM.
  #18  
Old 01-31-2014, 11:06 PM
Passinwind's Avatar
Charlie Escher
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Columbia River Gorge, WA.
Supporting Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bard2dbone View Post
So I'll give you a throwaway question to keep it going: "Why don't people use stereo rigs with widely separated cabs any more?" This one should be easy.
Yep: because back then no one had figured out that you need a high pass filter on the secondary cab if you're using the rig for bass.

Why do people play fretted basses?
  #19  
Old 01-31-2014, 11:15 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Arlington TX
Quote:
Originally Posted by Passinwind View Post
Yep: because back then no one had figured out that you need a high pass filter on the secondary cab if you're using the rig for bass.

Why do people play fretted basses?
Yes! Thank you, Passinwind for getting the game going!

Now everybody else, GO!
__________________
If my posts can possibly be taken as bitterly cynical, horribly sarcastic, deeply contemptuous of my fellow human, and maybe somewhat humorous, then that's your safest bet.
  #20  
Old 01-31-2014, 11:20 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Nesconset, N.Y.
I've read numerous posts about how P&J pickups should have never been combined & especially with a volume, volume, tone layout. Passive pickups apparently are the worst possible combination with unpredictable results. Yet I've been happily playing & seem to prefer basses setup like this since my 1st bass an Ibanez Roadstar 2 & many others like it since then. I don't get it, there doesn't to be any more trouble balancing the pickups to get a desirable tone than a typical jazz bass. If I'm wrong I don't want to be right.
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off

Visit TalkBass on Facebook   Download our iOS app   Download our Android app

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 11:03 PM.




2012 Talk Music Group Inc. All rights reserved.
Play guitar too? Visit TalkGuitar.com
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.12
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.