Someone talk me out of gettting a Genz Benz 212t NX2 !!!

[Chef]

It would appear that he has.

Originally Posted by Ncognito

I had a fearful 12/6/1 and a fearful 15/6/1. Liked the clarity and attack of the 12. Not really at all with the 15. The 12/6/1 just couldn't get me the volume I needed. The 15/6/1 was loud enough, but I didn't like it's sound. In both cases the 3 way design didn't really agree with my ear, and even less with a 15.

Originally Posted by rpsands

The OP needs to hear some of the high end 15 single drivers, but just this man's opinion

[rpsands]

A 15/6 is going to be quite a bit different sounding than a 15PR400 or a 3015. Like..completely different.

The latter two will be noticeably louder too.

* for the record, Duke's hathor 1544 (15PR400) is pretty close in sensitivity to my 1515/66. Lot less going on down low and a lot less power handling of course.

[Musicman20]

Sounds like he wants a traditional, well made and readily available cabinet with good customer service.

Get the latest Genz NX2 212

[guy n. cognito]

Originally Posted by rpsands

A 15/6 is going to be quite a bit different sounding than a 15PR400 or a 3015. Like..completely different.

The latter two will be noticeably louder too.

* for the record, Duke's hathor 1544 (15PR400) is pretty close in sensitivity to my 1515/66. Lot less going on down low and a lot less power handling of course.

Wait, you lost me. A single 3015 is louder than a 15/6??

One of the limitations of suggesting these types of cabs in this situation is the lack of availability for testing and evaluation.

[rpsands]

Originally Posted by guy n. cognito

Wait, you lost me. A single 3015 is louder than a 15/6??

One of the limitations of suggesting these types of cabs in this situation is the lack of availability for testing and evaluation.

Yes, the broadband sensitivity is higher. The 3015LF is a different speaker than the 3015, and it gives up some sensitivity to get lower extension.

The 3015 starts getting quite a bit louder starting at about 80hz and getting as much as 2-3db louder overall.

It's all about where your ear is tuned though--different people have different loudness cues.

The 15PR400, probably isn't more than a hair louder by the numbers...but distortion cues, etc, may make some differences. It could be Duke's hathor implementation that sounded so much louder


* If you look at calculated sensitivity numbers it tells most of the story; the 15PR400 is right around the same sensitivity as the 3015LF, but the 3015 is 1.5db louder than either. The 15PR400 being available in 4 ohms can be a draw if you're using a 500w micro.

** So if you sat a 15/6 next to a 4 ohm 15PR400, with a ~500 watt @ 4 ohm micro, the 15PR400 would sound 3db louder until you hit its mechanical limits.

[Ncognito]

Thanks rpsands

I will have to do some more research into single 15" cabinets, although I used a SWR Goliath II in the early 90's and then an Eden 410T after that and I've experienced the profound performance difference with front slot ported cabinets compared to rear porting. Don't ever see myself using or considering any rear ported cabinet.

[Syco_bass]

Originally Posted by Ncognito

Help! GAS is after me. I've used Eden 410XLT's since 1995. About 2,000 gigs give or take. I'm not getting any younger and saving 50 pounds for every load-in would be great. Both cabs are about the same footprint, so that's a moot point. I like the new tolex version and it's lighter too. Anybody been down this road and willing to give me their insight and experience good or bad??

I've got gigs this weekend, so I'm gonna pull the trigger tomorrow to have it here by Friday. C'mon gang talk some sense into me and convince me to NOT do it.

Thanks in advance!!!

Having been in the same room with and comparing that cab to a lot of others in it's class, I wouldn't try to talk you out of that cab. I say "if the cab fits your needs, and you like how it sounds, go for it".
There isn't anything wrong with that cab. In fact there are a lot of things "right" with it. It's sounds great, looks great, it's light weight, it's plenty loud for most gigs, and GB has the best customer service in the industry. I don't think anyone here would try to talk you out of it.

Good luck.

[Ncognito]

Thanks everyone. Placed an order for one today!

I'll report back.

[guy n. cognito]

Originally Posted by Ncognito

Thanks everyone. Placed an order for one today!

I'll report back.

Awesome. You'll love it.

[Ncognito]

I hpoe so. Just now hearing about the Glasstone Lil G. a 2x12 cabinet that is the size of a single 12 cabinet. Can this thing really deliver??

[Brad Johnson]

Originally Posted by Ncognito

I hpoe so. Just now hearing about the Glasstone Lil G. a 2x12 cabinet that is the size of a single 12 cabinet. Can this thing really deliver??

Absolutely. I've been gigging mine as a fulltime musician for several months. I don't come out and recommend it very often here anymore, got tired of the flack I received from folks with no experience with it. OTOH I've answered a lot of PMs.


Here's my setup:


I use it with an Acoustic Image Clarus 2 Series 4 (600w@4 ohms), a Genz Benz Shuttle 9.0 (900w@4 ohms) and a Kustom KXB500 (500w@4 ohms), all around 5 lb. No affiliation with the amp manufacturers and the Lil G builder is a good friend.


The Lil G was designed around a pair of Faital Pro 12PR300 12" drivers.

[guy n. cognito]

Well, maybe a little affiliation,

I only see one speaker. Passive radiator?

Well, I do like the magna cart!!!

[Ncognito]

I used to endorse Tech Soundsystems and their CT2000. That's the box Schroeder pretty much just copied. It also had 2 twelves in it. Pretty honky and boxy sounding to me, but at the time it was kind of revolutionary. With today's drivers maybe it sounds great. The Tech had 2 pretty cheesy stamped 12's. I'm very intrigued by the Glasstone I must say.

The Genz Benz is on the way, but I'm going to find one of these Lil G's to try. I can make most any cabinet sound acceptable fingerstyle, but I use a pick 50% of the time and that's the challenge.

[Brad Johnson]

Originally Posted by guy n. cognito

Well, maybe a little affiliation,

I only see one speaker. Passive radiator?

Well, I do like the magna cart!!!

If being a friend is an affiliation I have a lot more "affiliations" to disclose. I have several friends in the MI business.


I don't receive any compensation for owning, using or recommending his products.

How's that?

[KJung]

Originally Posted by guy n. cognito

Well, maybe a little affiliation,

Has a downfiring 12. Looks like a cool little box. Kind of a different take on the Schroeders (side angle firing 12) and the Orange cabs (one driver behind the other).

The Schroeder design resulted in VERY high SPL in the lower midrange, which sounded great for some applications. The Orange design results (from what I understand) in no increase in overall SPL over a single 12, but more true, open low end, emulating a single 12 in a much bigger box.

Not sure what the impact of this configuration would be, but I'd love to hear one sometime.

[Brad Johnson]

Originally Posted by Ncognito

I used to endorse Tech Soundsystems and their CT2000. That's the box Schroeder pretty much just copied. It also had 2 twelves in it. Pretty honky and boxy sounding to me, but at the time it was kind of revolutionary. With today's drivers maybe it sounds great. The Tech had 2 pretty cheesy stamped 12's. I'm very intrigued by the Glasstone I must say.

The Genz Benz is on the way, but I'm going to find one of these Lil G's to try. I can make most any cabinet sound acceptable fingerstyle, but I use a pick 50% of the time and that's the challenge.

I actually own an older Tech Soundsystems 2-12 that the PO loaded with neo drivers (I haven't looked to see which brand/model yet). I also own a Shroeder 1210L and have played most of the other Schroeder cabs. The Lil G doesn't sound like those cabs.

Where both of those style cabs had the second driver on an angled baffle, the Lil G has the second Faital Pro 12PR300 mounted perpendicular to the front firing driver, using the top plate of the bottom port as a baffle. Not exactly a standard layout. And yes, 90 degrees is also an angle.

That layout along with the relatively tiny magnets on the Neos allows for the abnormally small enclosure. Took a lot of experimentation to get to this point.

So no, the second driver is not a passive radiator

[Brad Johnson]

Originally Posted by KJung

Has a downfiring 12. Looks like a cool little box. Kind of a different take on the Schroeders (side angle firing 12) and the Orange cabs (one driver behind the other).

The Schroeder design resulted in VERY high SPL in the lower midrange, which sounded great for some applications. The Orange design results (from what I understand) in no increase in overall SPL over a single 12, but more true, open low end, emulating a single 12 in a much bigger box.

Not sure what the impact of this configuration would be, but I'd love to hear one sometime.

So far the cab has pretty much shocked everyone who's heard it IRL including me. Surprisingly large, full range sound. It's sounded great amplifying anything we've thrown at it... bass, guitars (acoustic and electric), keys, voice, recorded music, horns. I let a pro guitarist friend of mine check my rig out at a soundcheck, he bought the identical setup (AI and Lil G) a couple of days later. Honestly the closest thing I've heard to it was playing through Meyer Sound powered monitors... which were triple to quadruple or more the weight of the Lil G. Like them, the Lil G isn't voiced for bass, it's voiced for accurate sound reproduction. That's why I love it.

For full range sound I'd give the nod to an amp like my Acoustic Image Clarus 2 S4 over a dedicated bass amp. No affiliation there either other than loving their products, which I use for electric bass (another surprise for me).

The Faital Pro 12PR300 is a very cool driver IMO. Sammie also loaded a Lil G with a single 12PR300, added a 3 channel 250w plate amp and it made for a pretty amazing keyboard amp, particularly compared to the industry standard Roland. We tested it out with a newer Motif, a drum patch and electric bass simultaneously... pretty trippy hearing all of those coming out of that little box with the depth, clarity and sonic separation that it had.

BTW Sammie did try other neos, they didn't come close to the overall sound quality of the Faital Pros.

[KJung]

Originally Posted by Brad Johnson

So far the cab has pretty much shocked everyone who's heard it IRL including me. Surprisingly large, full range sound. It's sounded great amplifying anything we've thrown at it... bass, guitars (acoustic and electric), keys, voice, recorded music, horns. I let a pro guitarist friend of mine check my rig out at a soundcheck, he bought the identical setup (AI and Lil G) a couple of days later. Honestly the closest thing I've heard to it was playing through Meyer Sound powered monitors... which were triple to quadruple or more the weight of the Lil G. Like them, the Lil G isn't voiced for bass, it's voiced for accurate sound reproduction. That's why I love it.

For full range sound I'd give the nod to an amp like my Acoustic Image Clarus 2 S4 over a dedicated bass amp. No affiliation there either other than loving their products, which I use for electric bass (another surprise for me).

The Faital Pro 12PR300 is a very cool driver IMO. Sammie also loaded a Lil G with a single 12PR300, added a 3 channel 250w plate amp and it made for a pretty amazing keyboard amp, particularly compared to the industry standard Roland. We tested it out with a newer Motif, a drum patch and electric bass simultaneously... pretty trippy hearing all of those coming out of that little box with the depth, clarity and sonic separation that it had.

BTW Sammie did try other neos, they didn't come close to the overall sound quality of the Faital Pros.

Faital is really coming into their own. I know Don at LDS prefers the 12's and especially the 15's over their Eminence counterparts. Punchy and articulate, with good mechanical specs. I believe Genz has gone to Faital drivers in their cabs (or at least some of them) and they sound great also (the new little Shutte 112 is KILLER).

[Brad Johnson]

Originally Posted by KJung

Faital is really coming into their own. I know Don at LDS prefers the 12's and especially the 15's over their Eminence counterparts. Punchy and articulate, with good mechanical specs. I believe Genz has gone to Faital drivers in their cabs (or at least some of them) and they sound great also (the new little Shutte 112 is KILLER).

That's a smart move on their part. My first experience with them was swapping out ceramic Delta Pro and Kappa Pro drivers for a 12PR300 (Sammie recommended the driver) and Eminence 3015 in my 1-12/1-15 Nahas stack. The difference in the 1-12 cab was pretty eye-opening... must stronger and present lower and upper mids, much fuller sound overall. Took a pretty good stand alone 1-12 up several notches. Took a setup I already loved and made it even better IMO. Hard to imagine at the time.

So I wasn't looking, I didn't think I'd find anything appreciably nicer. Then I went to my friend Preach's gig and heard his prototype. Done.


I imagine at some point I'll take the Nahas stack or Bag Ends out again... I haven't used anything else live since I got the Lil G. It's overkill in a small package.

[Sav'nBass]

Uhh .. sorry man..

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