Are Stacks A Waste Of Money?

[GeneralElectric]

Originally Posted by Sundogue

Bottom line is, if one wants to bring whatever they want, even if it's huge, then why not? Ain't hurting nobody.

Amps have what's called a "volume" control.

Honestly, I just can't understand why anyone would even try to assume what size rig someone else should be bringing to a gig.

Stage space can sometimes be a factor.

[Sundogue]

Originally Posted by GeneralElectric

Stage space can sometimes be a factor.

Hmmm, I have yet to play on even the tiniest stages that could only accommodate something like a vertical 210, but not an 810 SVT fridge.

We're talking about what, maybe 8" in footprint difference?

I could bring my two little 110/6 cabs to a gig, or I could bring those and put my fEARful 15/6 on top of them, yet all of it wouldn't take up any more space.

If I ever play on a stage that the ceiling is so low an 810 cab won't fit, I doubt I would either.

[Sartori]

Originally Posted by aborgman

Money.

Fame.

Prestige.

Groupies.

But we're bassists.

[Sartori]

Originally Posted by aborgman

No - pretty much every commercial bass cabinet.

Those nice efficiency numbers they quote are at 1KHz. They're WAY less efficient than the published numbers down low.

Good thing I don't need those frequencies, then.

[flyingfinbar]

Originally Posted by Sundogue

Hmmm, I have yet to play on even the tiniest stages that could only accommodate something like a vertical 210, but not an 810 SVT fridge.

We're talking about what, maybe 8" in footprint difference?

I could bring my two little 110/6 cabs to a gig, or I could bring those and put my fEARful 15/6 on top of them, yet all of it wouldn't take up any more space.

If I ever play on a stage that the ceiling is so low an 810 cab won't fit, I doubt I would either.

Haha, excellent point.

All that really matters (within reason) on a stage is footprint, and the fact remains that an 8x10 simply doesn't take up a huge amount of room more than a "smaller" rig.

[georgestrings]

Originally Posted by Sundogue

Bottom line is, if one wants to bring whatever they want, even if it's huge, then why not? Ain't hurting nobody.

Amps have what's called a "volume" control.

Honestly, I just can't understand why anyone would even try to assume what size rig someone else should be bringing to a gig.

Well said... I play in a loud 2 guitar modern rock/hard rock/metal band that plays mostly large clubs with occasional outdoor stuff - it's pretty idiotic for someone else to presume what *I* need/want to get my job done...

I have learned over the years that I'm better off bringing more than enough rig - that way, I always sound good, can hear myself well, and don't ever have to push my gear hard... The benefits of such an approach are reliability and consistancy - and since our backline is trucked, I don't see how it affects any other bass players that I prefer to play thru an 810...


- georgestrings

[georgestrings]

Originally Posted by richielowb

I bring my 8x10 to every show regardless. It has the same stage footprint as a 4x10 so I figure what the heck. My band does not have monitors, and every time I've been promised backline or PA access I can't hear myself. If for nothing else, it serves as a huge monitor for me and my drummer. If there is a backline I generally bring my rig anyway and many times it ends up being the backline b/c what they planned on using as backline was a total POS. I don't think your money is EVER wasted on a big rig. You're a bass player and if the audience can't hear you, they can't feel your band. I've bought many many speaker cabs and I've never sold a one. Never will. There's always a use.

My experiences are similar - most provided backlines aren't nearly as good as what I'm accustomed to playing thru - at best... and even though we always have monitors, they're rarely very useful to me as a bassist - mostly just vocals...



- georgestrings

[GeneralElectric]

Originally Posted by Sundogue

Hmmm, I have yet to play on even the tiniest stages that could only accommodate something like a vertical 210, but not an 810 SVT fridge.

We're talking about what, maybe 8" in footprint difference?

I could bring my two little 110/6 cabs to a gig, or I could bring those and put my fEARful 15/6 on top of them, yet all of it wouldn't take up any more space.

If I ever play on a stage that the ceiling is so low an 810 cab won't fit, I doubt I would either.

When you're bringing a huge amp, chances are your guitarists are doing the same. When you have to have large foot print amps for everyone on a tiny stage, you run out of room really quick. Try fitting a large bass amp, 2 marshall half stacks, and drums on a stage where its all laid out relatively even.

What do I know? I'm from NYC. Half the time at shows the amps and drums are on the stage and the band is pushed out onto the floor with everyone else.

[Joe Louvar]

Originally Posted by Blues Bass 2

Like jimmy says , I care too .

I like having my amp and speakers because it's my onstage tone . If it's enough for the gig and they don't have to put me through the house that's fine , I still have my onstage tone . If they need to put me through the front of house that's fine too because I still have the same on stage tone . Take away my amp and speakers and what I hear onstage is out of my hands .

I really care - so I always have my own equipment . . . bass, amps, etc.

[Sartori]

Originally Posted by GeneralElectric

When you're bringing a huge amp, chances are your guitarists are doing the same. When you have to have large foot print amps for everyone on a tiny stage, you run out of room really quick. Try fitting a large bass amp, 2 marshall half stacks, and drums on a stage where its all laid out relatively even.

What do I know? I'm from NYC. Half the time at shows the amps and drums are on the stage and the band is pushed out onto the floor with everyone else.

An 8x10 usually has about the same footprint as a 4x10. So in terms of stage space, you don't really save anything by using a 4x10 over an 8x10.

My 1x15 takes up a slightly smaller footprint than my 2x15, with a bit different dimensions. The only reason I don't use the 2x15 for everything is transportation.

[staindbass]

your amp is a monitor for you, the pa is for the audience. im not concerned if the audience hears it. i guess the people right in front of me might but that is of no concern unless its a no-pa gig. the only way to really know is to experience it for yourself. playing a gig in front of a massive amp is awesome, i call it a bass bath. you feel it over your entire body. your vision blurrs differently with every note, without hurting your ears. thats what big low end does for me. there is no guessing where a note starts and stops.

[Sundogue]

Originally Posted by GeneralElectric

When you're bringing a huge amp, chances are your guitarists are doing the same. When you have to have large foot print amps for everyone on a tiny stage, you run out of room really quick. Try fitting a large bass amp, 2 marshall half stacks, and drums on a stage where its all laid out relatively even.

What do I know? I'm from NYC. Half the time at shows the amps and drums are on the stage and the band is pushed out onto the floor with everyone else.

I'm bringing my full rig to a blues gig tonight. Three guitar players and a drummer. Very little stage room. Not very loud gig at all and my little rig could easily handle it volume-wise, but it wouldn't matter whether I brought my little rig or my big one...doesn't take up any more space (well...it does, vertically) so it doesn't matter.

So why would I haul my big rig instead of my small one? Because I use a lot of sub 100Hz in my sound (because unlike a lot of cabs, mine can actually produce it audibly). Even at low volume it sounds full and deep. something my little rig can't do, regardless of volume. Makes a huge difference to the band and the crowd.

And the PA will only handle the vocals and I have to carry the room, even though my little rig would carry the room by itself volume-wise. The tone is what matters to me, and the band really digs the tone too, which means we'll play better so the crowd will dig it too. Even though it's right in downtown with terrible parking and a VERY small club...I'm bringing the big guns. Why? Because I can.

[Muziekschuur]

The SWR REDHEAD has been for years the gigging musician standard. If you bring that to any gig, they think you care. And with an additional 1x15 you can play any gig you need.

[Doctor Dirt]

SundogUe has it right especially for uptempo Blues. If the bass can't warm up the womens seats he may as well stay home. The bassman gets the joint wet with low down sound and the kick drum turns into Joe Frazier left hook!!! The audiance needs to FEEL the groove along with hearing it and FEELIING it doesn't always mean loud!!! Doc

[Clammy]

Originally Posted by TomB

No, it is not a waste, it is a requirement, IMO. If you want to be a pro bass player, the ability to be self-sufficient in any situation from a coffee house to an outside venue w/out PA is likely to arise and is expected of you. The right bass amp for the venue is as essential a tool to have on hand as a bass. You might not always need to use your own amp, and working without an amp can be just fine, especially with the better pro sound companies, but IMO you should be prepared to provide it whenever you do need it ...and that will be plenty often, regardless of what the rider might have said about backline.

Speaking form a personal perspective, and as a Metal player, I'd like to add that you can't discount the visual aspect either. Part of playing live is the visual performance, and part of that is the amps (unless you run an Iron Maiden type stage setup with lots of props, etc...). Even in smaller clubs, a few stacks on stage is a great visual. Of course in a tiny place without stage, or with a very small stage, the practicality won't allow it. That said, I've played very tiny stages where both the guitarist and I ran full stacks. Of course, like everything else: YMMV.

Cheers!

[RickenBoogie]

One thing that hasn't been mentioned, is playing in a non-gig environment- like in a garage or basement. If you don't have a good bass rig, you have nothing. It's great to play on a big stage with a big PA system that includes good monitors and side fills, but even then, a good rig can still be useful. But a backyard party, or a million other possibilities, a good sized bass rig is a must.

[Sartori]

Last show I played with my folk rock band, I brought the 2x15. Necessary? Probably not, but the sound was glorious.

I think I might bring it more often.

[s_mcsleazy]

as bass players were usually the level headed members of the band. were the ones who drive the band around most times. were the ones who usually know about impedences. we can usually set up the rest of the bands gear when they're too drunk. most bass players are like that. we're more behind the scenes. we dont get too much chance to show off so when we can we use it. for most bass players this means there rig. i use a 72 bassman with 2 2x10's. most times i dont get to use it and have to go into the pa insted. ya know what however. if you treat it like owning a classic car like a old ferrari 275 you'll enjoy when you can use it all the more.

[jmattbassplaya]

As someone who use to own a 6x10, I can say with good certainty that the most a person will almost ever need is a 2x12 or a 4x10. Anything more than that is a bit overkill for most gigs.

[SBsoundguy]

When I was in my teens every party we played had no PA support, so amps and a couple of powered speakers were all we had to work with.