SUNN 200s & 2000s

[Lonesomedave]

Hi, guys,

just a quick question (or actually, questions):

what are the main differences in the Sunn 200S amp & the Sunn 2000s amp?

how much can I expect to pay for each (if I can find them)?

do they use KT 88 power tubes?

thanks,

/s/ Dave

[Lonesomedave]

johnk 10

how much power do they each have?

thanks,

/s/ Dave

[robgrow]

The Sunn 200S was rated at 60 watts and used two KT88's or 6550's. The Sunn 2000S was rated at 120 watts and used four KT88's or 6550's. The 2000S was wider and substantially heavier than the 200S. They sounded fairly similar as I recall. The 2000S had a lot more headroom of course. Both were great amps.

[Sartori]

They were paired with different cabs as well. The 200s and 2000s cabs are similar, but as one might expect, the 2000s cab is substantially larger.

[Lonesomedave]

sartori;

i presume that since they were "back in the day" amps, the 2000s used 2 15's? what is the impedance of the 2 amps.

thanks,

/s/ Dave

[Sartori]

Both of them used two 15" speakers. Not sure about impedance. I think the 2000s can go down to 4 ohms, but I'm not sure.

I would ask a TBer named "edbass" about Sunn 2000s related stuff.

[D.M.N.]

The Sunn 2000s has 16, 8, and 4 ohm taps off the transformers. All 2000s and 350B (later version) have the three taps, but only two can be wired up at once, so they left the factory as either 16 & 8, or 8 & 4. However, a tech can easily swap them about for your needs.

The impedance of the cab depended on the speakers in there. The typical JBL D140s came in both 16 and 8 ohm versions, but other speakers were sometimes put in there as well (especially later), so there is no set impedance for the cabinet.

The cabs, 200s and 2000s, both used a similar baffle design, but the 2000s measures 48x30x15 and the 200s measures 42x24x15.

Regarding power, as Robgrow stated, the 200s is 60w, and the 2000s was 120w, but later 2000s, when SS rectified, were rerated at 150w, and that's fairly conservative. Sunns were essentially Dynaco circuits, and had very oversized transformers, and so that 60w for the 200s is when the volume knob is on "4", no distortion. I know Edbass has a 2000s that had it's power supply optimized and was measured to put out RMS 190w clean, and 260w peak.

Price wise......it varies some. I've seen really clean 2000s go for as low as $700, and as high as $1500 on the eBay. I bought mine with original RCA 6550s and Mullard GZ34s last year for $850, and it's pretty much dead clean except for a small mark in the face plate. 200s will go for cheaper, but even those I've seen creeping towards $600. Ed would probably have a better handle on pricing, these are just what I've seen recently.

[WhoDidTheElf]

Originally Posted by robgrow

The Sunn 200S was rated at 60 watts and used two KT88's or 6550's. The Sunn 2000S was rated at 120 watts and used four KT88's or 6550's. The 2000S was wider and substantially heavier than the 200S. They sounded fairly similar as I recall. The 2000S had a lot more headroom of course. Both were great amps.

That seems pretty conservative rating wise.

Don't the 6550's put out around 50 watts each? (assuming proper bias) Which would put those closer to 100 and 200.

Though I have no clue to be honest, just going off what I've read.

[Sartori]

When they originally came out they were rated somewhat conservatively, I've heard.

[Lonesomedave]

anybody know how much they each weigh?

and, assuming that sunn 2000s cabinets are really rare, what would be a good cabinet to use? I could get a pair of JBL D140F speakers (re-coned if necessary) and have them put in a good cabinet.

/s/ Dave

[90k]

This is really good information for me as an old guy. I build a copy of my 200s cab back in the day and when I started reading on the internet about the 2000's I thought I was loosing my mind. I never knew there was a 2000's. See what not having the internet can do to your realizations.

[Sartori]

How much do they weigh? The 2000s cab weighs quite a bit. Mine has heavier than stock castors, and probably weighs at least 150 lbs. I would expect the head, with its large transformers, to also be somewhat heavy. If weight is a huge concern, not sure that the 2000s rig would be the right choice. The 200s I would expect not to be quite as heavy.

[Mike M.]

Seeing this thread brings an off the wall question here. Just something I've wondered about.

Back in the day I had a two friends who were bass players and they both had a Sunn 200S head and a 2X15 cabinet. The speakers were (I believe) JBL's with the aluminum (?) cones and you could see these speakers moving all over the place when being played thru. Not just in and out but it looked like they were moving in all directions. Almost like they were bouncing. Hard to explain but I remember it quite clearly because it was so odd looking.

What was up with that?

[JxBass]

Originally Posted by Mike M.

Seeing this thread brings an off the wall question here. Just something I've wondered about.

Back in the day I had a two friends who were bass players and they both had a Sunn 200S head and a 2X15 cabinet. The speakers were (I believe) JBL's with the aluminum (?) cones and you could see these speakers moving all over the place when being played thru. Not just in and out but it looked like they were moving in all directions. Almost like they were bouncing. Hard to explain but I remember it quite clearly because it was so odd looking.

What was up with that?

I had a 200S with the 2x15 aluminum cones cab "back in the day". Yes, the cones vibrated like all speakers do at low frequencies but I don't recall them moving in all directions.

[Stumbo]

The aluminum that you see on the speakers is the dust cover.

My 2000s head weighs in at about 65lbs. The cab IIRC about 131.

Here are a few links on the topic:
What do ya'll know about the SUNN 2000S?
http://sunn.ampage.org
A Question for Sunn 2000S Afficianados:
http://music-electronics-forum.com/t4171/

[D.M.N.]

Weight: Head-60-70lbs (noticeably lighter than my Bassman 300 at 75lbs)
Cab with K140s- easily 140+, probably 150lbs or so.

My cab, as well as the original cabs, used really high quality ply wood, mines baltic birch, and that stuff is heavy. If you want more portability, you are not going to be schlepping around 2000s cabs.

For cab recommendations, maybe TL606s? Loaded with some JBLs or something else.

[Sartori]

Get the original cab. They're glorious.

[Lonesomedave]

sartori,

right, I will... where do you suggest I get one...?

/s/ Dave

[Lowbrow]

2000S sell sheet from the Sunn catalog:



I used to own a 2000S head paired with two 200S cabs - mine were originally part of Mountain's backline! This is the only photo I still have of the setup; a spare 200S head sits on top of the heap:

[D.M.N.]

Originally Posted by Lonesomedave

sartori,

right, I will... where do you suggest I get one...?

/s/ Dave

Well, you either build one, or get very lucky and find one for sale. Probably locally, because they're a bit of a pig to ship, and it's not often sellers seem to be willing to ship them.

Alternatively, Mammouth Loudspeakers of Oregon make a clone of the 2000s, yo could contact them possibly.

And yeah, I'm with Sartori here. I know I recommended the TL606, which if you're looking for portability is better, but there is NOTHING like a 2000s cabinet pushed by a 2000s head. They are simply incredible. If you're alright moving them, get them. Sartori could comment on how his EV loaded one is, I'll just say that mine (JBL K140 loaded) is very sweet and full sounding. Not a flabby low end, nice highs, not too piercing, and a very present midrange. Running a P-bass with Swing 66s into the bright channel with the volume on 7+ is just the greatest overdriven, raunchy sound on the planet. Very Live at Leeds. The speakers handle it fine, and move plenty of air.