SVT blow my Eden cab?

Clayboy5000 · #1 09-30-2011, 04:01 AM

Hey there, new to the forum. I've got a vintage Ampeg SVT and been running it through an Ampeg 410 HLF for many years with no problem. Recently got an Eden 210 XLS cab ratted at 500 watts at 4 ohms (the exact same rating as the Ampeg Cab). Got it mostly because its more portable (though the SVT is still not). Took the setup on a short tour and it seemed to do fine. Got home and played a show where another band used my setup. Got it home and the speakers are farting and distorting. Took a closer look and they are wrinkled and creased and have imprints of the grill on them, presumably from popping out so far (EEK!). I think the bassist in the other band most likely turned up more than I usually do.

I know its a small cab, paired with one of the most powerful bass amps ever, but I got that cab specifically because it was rated high enough.

The SVT is 300 watts at 4 ohms (with a peak from what I've heard of about 700 watts). The Eden cab is 500 watts RMS at 4 ohms which would put it about 700 watts peak. So what gives? The 410 HLF is rated at 500 watts RMS and I've NEVER blown a speaker.

Can anyone provide some insight?

coreyfyfe · #2 09-30-2011, 04:20 AM

Thermal ratings are pretty much meaningless. That rating really says that over 500 watts at 4 ohms you could damage the voice coil, but if you've hit the limit for excursion before that it doesn't matter, and it sounds like you may have.

Son of Bovril · #3 09-30-2011, 04:29 AM

That is unfortunately the risk of lending out your rig

One Drop · #4 09-30-2011, 04:39 AM

I feel for you. The guy owes you a cab.

AlexanderB · #5 09-30-2011, 04:42 AM

Sorry about the blown 15s.

The Ampeg SVT-410HLF is one of few cabinets that actually allow for that kind of power even in the lower frequencies without bottoming out or breaking up.

I use one channel from a QSC PLX 3602 (rated at 1100W per channel into 4 Ohms and "slightly" more powerful than that Ampeg head...) and that cabinet stays clean sounding at any level I have yet dared to use... (Loud rock band.)

Clayboy5000 · #6 09-30-2011, 11:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by coreyfyfe

Thermal ratings are pretty much meaningless. That rating really says that over 500 watts at 4 ohms you could damage the voice coil, but if you've hit the limit for excursion before that it doesn't matter, and it sounds like you may have.

Ok so the voicecoils didn't blow, just the cones? What is the limit of excursion and is it measurable?

lethargytartare · #7 09-30-2011, 11:37 AM

Did you listen to the other band play? It may not be a sheer volume issue as a clipping issue -- if he was sending a clipped signal to the amp (or if his signal was causing the amp to clip), THAT would be damaging to the speakers, regardless of their power ratings. IIRC that's why UNDERpowered amps are more often the culprits behind blown speakers -- because people want to get louder, so they crank the amp past the clipping point, and then, even though the speakers can "handle" the rated power of the amp, the clipped signal frys the speaker (it keeps the cone pushed out continuously, I think).

Bass_Pounder · #8 09-30-2011, 11:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lethargytartare

Did you listen to the other band play? It may not be a sheer volume issue as a clipping issue -- if he was sending a clipped signal to the amp (or if his signal was causing the amp to clip), THAT would be damaging to the speakers, regardless of their power ratings. IIRC that's why UNDERpowered amps are more often the culprits behind blown speakers -- because people want to get louder, so they crank the amp past the clipping point, and then, even though the speakers can "handle" the rated power of the amp, the clipped signal frys the speaker (it keeps the cone pushed out continuously, I think).

The OP already stated that there is creasing and damage to the cones (over excursion) - therefore, your theory is out the window.

anonymous02282011 · #9 09-30-2011, 11:42 AM

underpowering is a myth

only way to know excursion limit is if the drivers are off the shelf, in which case the manufacturer will state it. If the drivers are proprietary for Eden, then they most likely don't publish. I'd call Eden and see if they can replace the drivers for you. That's your best bet. Otherwise, you can take internal measure of the box and use a program to see what off the shelf drivers will perform well in a box of that volume.