TC RH450 with Bergantino HT112ER

[icemangee]

Hi all ,
I have a Markbass F500 & a Bergantino HT112ER+EX112ER.

My basses are Fender Jazz (Fretless Jaco relic custom shop&Fretted 62 Reissue) & a Roscoe LG3000.

I like the F500 but there is something missing for me.
I had a Glockenklang Soul&Space Delux before that & I liked it better.

I'm thinking about buying the TC Electronic RH450.

My question is : how does it (RH450)matches with the Bergantino HT's (not the AE ones).

Can it be on the level of a Glock Soul & Space Deluxe ?
The Glock had amazing dynamics & clarity(I sold it because I wanted to go for a light gear, But I regret it)

I'm playing Funk/JAzz/Fusion , Marcus slap sound to Jaco fingers sound.

The idea of having the presets , tuner & compression all in 1 is giving me G.A.S.

What do you think?

Other options that I have are:

1) Buy a Glockenklang Soul II & a Space Delux cab
2) Buy a Glock Soul II & keep my Bergantino
3) Buy a AER Basic Performer combo

Thanks in advance:-)

[Jefe]

I also have a RH450 HT-ER/EX-ER stack. It certainly sounds good, but I'm not sure it's a match made in heaven.
Marcus Miller sound - The RH 450 just won't do it. Period. The cabs will, but not with that head.
Jaco - Yes, you can get that sound with that combo.
Based on your description, it sounds to me that maybe the Staccato '51 would be better suited to your tone goals. It's hard to get away from the warm, slightly woolly voicing of the RH450. It's better suited for rock (IMO).

[babebambi]

Tecamp Puma

[loopee]

What is the Staccato 51 best suited for?

I play Blues/Rock

Originally Posted by Jefe

I also have a RH450 HT-ER/EX-ER stack. It certainly sounds good, but I'm not sure it's a match made in heaven.
Marcus Miller sound - The RH 450 just won't do it. Period. The cabs will, but not with that head.
Jaco - Yes, you can get that sound with that combo.
Based on your description, it sounds to me that maybe the Staccato '51 would be better suited to your tone goals. It's hard to get away from the warm, slightly woolly voicing of the RH450. It's better suited for rock (IMO).

[KJung]

Originally Posted by icemangee

Hi all ,
I have a Markbass F500 & a Bergantino HT112ER+EX112ER.

My basses are Fender Jazz (Fretless Jaco relic custom shop&Fretted 62 Reissue) & a Roscoe LG3000.

I like the F500 but there is something missing for me.
I had a Glockenklang Soul&Space Delux before that & I liked it better.

I'm thinking about buying the TC Electronic RH450.

My question is : how does it (RH450)matches with the Bergantino HT's (not the AE ones).

Can it be on the level of a Glock Soul & Space Deluxe ?
The Glock had amazing dynamics & clarity(I sold it because I wanted to go for a light gear, But I regret it)

I'm playing Funk/JAzz/Fusion , Marcus slap sound to Jaco fingers sound.

The idea of having the presets , tuner & compression all in 1 is giving me G.A.S.

What do you think?

Other options that I have are:

1) Buy a Glockenklang Soul II & a Space Delux cab
2) Buy a Glock Soul II & keep my Bergantino
3) Buy a AER Basic Performer combo

Thanks in advance:-)

The RH450 is VERY different sounding from the Glock, and IMO, not a particularly good match with the HT series of Berg cabs. The RH450 is very warm sounding, a bit vintage sounding, and voiced to the low mids.

If you like the Glock tone, and want to go lighter, the TecAmp Puma heads (the Puma500 would be the volume equivalent of the Soul II) is worth a look... similar big low end, warm tone, and that crystal clear top end... head is about 5 pounds.


I prefer the F500 to all of the above though... tight, punchy, articulate, clear, and quick. Another option would be to keep the F500 and replace the ER's with AE112's. THAT is a killer, lightweight rig, and will sound punchier and a bit brighter, grindier up top.
K

[KJung]

Originally Posted by loopee

What is the Staccato 51 best suited for?

I play Blues/Rock

Scooped, modern tone... sizzly top end, big bottom, polite mids. For your context, the RH450 would work a bit better.

[Bassflute]

Originally Posted by icemangee

Hi all ,
I have a Markbass F500 & a Bergantino HT112ER+EX112ER.

My basses are Fender Jazz (Fretless Jaco relic custom shop&Fretted 62 Reissue) & a Roscoe LG3000.

I like the F500 but there is something missing for me.
I had a Glockenklang Soul&Space Delux before that & I liked it better.

I'm thinking about buying the TC Electronic RH450.

My question is : how does it (RH450)matches with the Bergantino HT's (not the AE ones).

Can it be on the level of a Glock Soul & Space Deluxe ?
The Glock had amazing dynamics & clarity(I sold it because I wanted to go for a light gear, But I regret it)

I'm playing Funk/JAzz/Fusion , Marcus slap sound to Jaco fingers sound.

The idea of having the presets , tuner & compression all in 1 is giving me G.A.S.

What do you think?

Other options that I have are:

1) Buy a Glockenklang Soul II & a Space Delux cab
2) Buy a Glock Soul II & keep my Bergantino
3) Buy a AER Basic Performer combo

Thanks in advance:-)

Originally Posted by KJung

The RH450 is VERY different sounding from the Glock, and IMO, not a particularly good match with the HT series of Berg cabs. The RH450 is very warm sounding, a bit vintage sounding, and voiced to the low mids.

If you like the Glock tone, and want to go lighter, the TecAmp Puma heads (the Puma500 would be the volume equivalent of the Soul II) is worth a look... similar big low end, warm tone, and that crystal clear top end... head is about 5 pounds.


I prefer the F500 to all of the above though... tight, punchy, articulate, clear, and quick. Another option would be to keep the F500 and replace the ER's with AE112's. THAT is a killer, lightweight rig, and will sound punchier and a bit brighter, grindier up top.
K

I thought the tc worked and sounded just fine with the HT112ER....

just not as good as the IP112ER....!

Cheers,
Cameron

[loopee]

Originally Posted by KJung

Scooped, modern tone... sizzly top end, big bottom, polite mids. For your context, the RH450 would work a bit better.

Thanks Kjung.....I'm hoping to check out a RH 450 sometime this week.......I already have the LMII both in combo (CMD121P) and head and quite like it especially with my new DHA pedal but I'm gasing for the RH 450....I could always sell the combo.....BUT......now you've got me gasing for the Puma.....

Out of the three......1) LMII 2 RH 450 3) Puma

Which one would you pick for Blues/Rock?

[KJung]

Originally Posted by loopee

Thanks Kjung.....I'm hoping to check out a RH 450 sometime this week.......I already have the LMII both in combo (CMD121P) and head and quite like it especially with my new DHA pedal but I'm gasing for the RH 450....I could always sell the combo.....BUT......now you've got me gasing for the Puma.....

Out of the three......1) LMII 2 RH 450 3) Puma

Which one would you pick for Blues/Rock?

Puma is stupid expensive and very wide and pure.... great head, but for your context, the LMII or RH450 (depending on if you want it warm and flat and clean with the LMII versus a little more grindy and mid bumped with the RH450) would both be great IMO!

[loopee]

Well, Torin decided to keep his RH 450 for now so I guess I won't get to try it out afterall......I think I'm going to keep what I have and just try out different cabs to see if 2 x 112's are better than a 4 ohm Schro Mini 12L+ and just keep playing with that EQ...after all, I quite like my LMII, I can have it warm, fat and clean and with my DHA I can EQ it to just about anything I want and with tube goodness so why do I keep wanting? ......and this gasing is driving me nuts....I need to take a rest...only thing is I want to try everything.....

[KJung]

Originally Posted by loopee

Well, Torin decided to keep his RH 450 for now so I guess I won't get to try it out afterall......I think I'm going to keep what I have and just try out different cabs to see if 2 x 112's are better than a 4 ohm Schro Mini 12L+ and just keep playing with that EQ...after all, I quite like my LMII, I can have it warm, fat and clean and with my DHA I can EQ it to just about anything I want and with tube goodness so why do I keep wanting? ......and this gasing is driving me nuts....I need to take a rest...only thing is I want to try everything.....

FYI, the RH450 is not a good match with the low end attenuated and mid bumped Schroeder cabs IMO. Too much 'compressed lows and mid mids meets compressed lows and mid mids'. I would guess the Staccato would sound pretty good with your 12+, but it is VERY hard to beat the Markbass heads with the Schroeder cabs. The EQ points are lined up perfectly to widen the low end, soften the low mids, and plug the hole between the top of the driver and the tweeter (on the baffle cabs).

[Tumeni Notes]

I was using a RH450 with (2) Bergantino AE112 cabinets. The rig sounded good, except when I played with the band, I did not cut through. I tried many setting combinations, but was drowned out. Some TalkBass people told me to check out the Genz Benz Shuttle line, so I got the Shuttle 6.0. Huge difference!!! With my setting flat, I cut through the music like a hot knife going through butter.

[KJung]

Originally Posted by Tumeni Notes

I was using a RH450 with (2) Bergantino AE112 cabinets. The rig sounded good, except when I played with the band, I did not cut through. I tried many setting combinations, but was drowned out. Some TalkBass people told me to check out the Genz Benz Shuttle line, so I got the Shuttle 6.0. Huge difference!!! With my setting flat, I cut through the music like a hot knife going through butter.

I too am not a fan of the RH450 and the AE 12 cabs... the RH450 is a bit too warm and mellow for the voicing of that cab (with the AE410, it is a bit of a different story).

The Shuttle will REALLY bring out the brightness and grind of the AE 12's... I dig it. The Markbass LMII/III and F1/F500 also kill with the 12's... a little fatter and smoother than the Shuttle.

To the OP, I will have an HT112ER on loan today and will put up a clip of that cab with the RH450 and some other heads later today.

[Bass Junkie]

I'm on my 3rd set of 112ER's and have tried a lot of heads through those cabs looking for the best combination. The ER's are in my book the best portable cab on the market for its ability to produce great tone and a lot of sound, but it seeems to be very picky about what heads it likes. I tried every micro amp I could get my hands on without any results that satisfied me.
TC, Puma, WW, Genz Benz(I haven't tried the 9.0), Ibanez, Markbass, GK, and probably a couple of more I can't remember. All of these heads seemed to be lacking something that this cab requires to really open it up. After going through so many heads one would start to think that maybe it was the cab, but if you hear these cabs with a quality preamp and a CA9 pushing it you immediately realize the potential of the 112ER. I wasn't about to haul around a CA9 all the time, so I started checking out amp heads in the 25 lb or less weight category. The Thunderfunks were ok(although the TF750 totally sucked IMO) and the old Gibson GB440 sounded great, just not enough power. The Mesa M9 I didn't care for. The Ashdown Mark King sounded really good, just not enough power. Then I tried a Eden WT800B and things came together nicely. I have been totally happy with this setup until an unreal deal came along on an EA iAmp 800, an amp that I totally hated on previous attempts, and decided to try that out. WOAH!! That amp sounds awesome with the 112ER's. I'm able to dial in just about anything I want and it has plenty of power and punches like crazy.

Anyway, my conclusion on these cabs is that the micro heads are unable to deliver what this cab demands to make it perform. It wants real horsepower and a versatile EQ that can dial it in. You give it what it wants and the performance it will give you will make your jaw drop. I am a little disappointed that I was unable to get a micro head that sounded to my liking with these cabs because I like to move as little weight as possible, but the tone and amount of sound I am getting from this rig has spoiled me and I wouldn't be satisfied playing with anything less. One HT112ER and the iAmp 800 or WT800B will fill a room with big beautiful tone, take 2 cabs and look out. I want to try a DB750 next.

[KJung]

Here's my little stack of doom for a brief test of the HT112ER.

I'll play it a bit and then put up a clip with the three heads. I can tell already that the Puma is just MAGIC with this cab.... really nice match... kind of an Anthony Jackson thing.... fat, warm, smooth, but articulate and a bit hi fi. The other two heads sound fine, but that Puma just seems made for this cab.

NICE improvement over the HT112... similar tone, but no roll-off down low below the E on the B string, and a bit less forward in the mid mids.

I can see why those with a 'smooth, fat' tone goal rave about this cab as a stand-alone. Lot's of booty for a little cab.

[JFLbass]

Totally agree with Bass Junkie! I'm driving my HT112ER+EX112ER with a Demeter/Crest Audio CA6. That's awesome! I've tried lightweiht amp, and still not satisfied! But, sometime, my primary head is unavailable. So one of the best match I found is Gallien-Krueger head.Tried a GK 400 or 800 RB, or the 1001! That's killer!

[Bass Junkie]

Originally Posted by JFLbass

Totally agree with Bass Junkie! I'm driving my HT112ER+EX112ER with a Demeter/Crest Audio CA6. That's awesome! I've tried lightweiht amp, and still not satisfied! But, sometime, my primary head is unavailable. So one of the best match I found is Gallien-Krueger head.Tried a GK 400 or 800 RB, or the 1001! That's killer!

Only GK I tried was the MB5002. I may have to give the 1001RBII a try.

[DirtPoorRobins]

Do you guys agree about more power with the ae112's as well, like the er's that you say needs more power? I've been running my little mark with them, but would it sound better with an 800w head? Would the speakers still move as much as they do at high volume? I don't push them past gain at noon and master at 930-10 oclock.

[Bass Junkie]

Originally Posted by DirtPoorRobins

Do you guys agree about more power with the ae112's as well, like the er's that you say needs more power? I've been running my little mark with them, but would it sound better with an 800w head? Would the speakers still move as much as they do at high volume? I don't push them past gain at noon and master at 930-10 oclock.

I bought a pair of AE112's the same time I bought my first set or ER's. Totally different animals. I like the ER's so much better I sent the AE's back, so I have very limited experience with them.

[KJung]

Originally Posted by DirtPoorRobins

Do you guys agree about more power with the ae112's as well, like the er's that you say needs more power? I've been running my little mark with them, but would it sound better with an 800w head? Would the speakers still move as much as they do at high volume? I don't push them past gain at noon and master at 930-10 oclock.

I find the AE's very high SPL, and not in need of big power at all. Actually, I'm surprised at the max SPL of a single HT112ER with just the 300 watts of a micro head driving it.

However, it ALL has to do with your tone goal. If you dial up that bass knob, then you can really eat into the power of an amp quickly. If you are one who likes to rumble, than bit power into an ER stack would probably make you squishy and giggly. If, on the other hand, you are looking for a more 'punch through the mix' tone with some bright grind up top, 500 watts into an AE212 or 2 x 112 will IMO drive those cabs to stupid loud, uncompressed volume. IMO and IME.