Tube-Amp Question

mesaphlin · #1 05-05-2011, 04:17 PM

Hello ya'all!!!...

I wanna ask you something about the plan I have been making in my head for some quite a long time...

I have a Fender 75 RI Passive Jazz Bass and also a Markbass Classic 300 Amp but I connect the amp into the mixer instead of a cabinet and the mixer goes out to the headphones so I play my bass via using the headphones.

Because of the Fender I have is a passive one I am thinking about using actually three different brands of outboard preamps.

A Sadowsky outboard preamp is the first step in my chain to boost up the frequencies

And an E.W.S. Tri-logic Bass preamp Ⅱis the second preamp which is in the middle of my chain of the preamps to give my bass a mid-range boost

And the third and last one is an Avalon U5 preamp to clarify the tones overall.

I know it sounds a little crazy but what I am concern about this is that when I hook them up into my Markbass Classic 300 Tube Amp, would there be a chance to destroy my tubes because of the outboard preamps that I am using are too-much?

Sartori · #2 05-05-2011, 04:23 PM

The preamps are not what you should be worried about.

The problem with your plan is that, if I read your post correctly, you're planning on connecting the amp to a mixer instead of a speaker cab. The Markbass Classic 300 has a tube output section. If it's like the vast majority of tube amps, to operate, it MUST have a speaker load connected. If it does not, things will fry.

As well, you might seriously damage the mixer. I don't know much about mixers, but I'm pretty sure that they're not designed to have 300 watts of power slammed into their inputs.

You should probably rethink your plan.

BurningSkies · #3 05-05-2011, 04:23 PM

The real question is CAN the MarkBass Classic 300 run without a cabinet load on it.

Most tube amps, that's a quick way to ruin your amp and turn it into a doorstop.

BurningSkies · #4 05-05-2011, 04:32 PM

Hey, the MB Classic 300 even has a special error code to let you known not to run the head without a cab:

Cabinet not connected!
Error (until you connect a
cabinet)
No cabinet is connected to your amplifier.

Right from the manual.

mesaphlin · #5 05-05-2011, 04:35 PM

So should I purchase a solid-state amp in order to run my plan? Or the classic 300 tube amp to a cabinet and the cabinet into the mixer? But I don't know if any cabinets have outs for mixer? Do they have the outs?

Sartori · #6 05-05-2011, 04:39 PM

Well, you still won't be able to connect the speaker output to a mixer. With a solid-state amp you'd just kill the mixer, instead of both the mixer and the amp. You need to use the DI output, or the preamp send output. Mixers are not speaker cabs, they're not designed to have a huge amount of power sent into them.

If you can find a tube amp with a separate DI volume, it could work, if you turn that up and turn the actual master volume down to zero.

BurningSkies · #7 05-05-2011, 04:44 PM

Not to mention if you're using several preamp stages to muddle your tone before it hits a U5, you're not going to clarify anything...you're just going to present that mucky mess in pristine fidelity.

If you're looking for a super nice clean DI sound, the U5 will be it, but putting that stuff in front of it is like pouring muddy water into a clean glass then being surprised when you get chunks caught in your teeth when you drink from it.

Howzabout you put a Countryman between the amp and cab,

mesaphlin · #8 05-05-2011, 04:51 PM

Okay here is my problem then...

I reside in an apartment where there are neighbors up and down.

So, hooking my bass into a cabinet is impossible. The only way that I could play is through a headphone but also, I want to listen to some drum sample loops from my computer through my headphone while I play the bass so how am I gonna be able to manage that?

Any ideas?

Or what I could think of is that hooking up my bass into the Sadowsky, E.W.S. Tri-logic Bass preamp Ⅱand the Avalon U5 Preamps and from Avalon U5 into the mixer... Is that possible?

mesaphlin · #9 05-05-2011, 04:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BurningSkies

Howzabout you put a Countryman between the amp and cab,

Countryman is better than the Avalon U5 tonally?

Alex1984 · #10 05-05-2011, 05:00 PM

Too many pre-amps. Not a problem as long as you mind your levels, but why go through such a long chain when you could just use the U5 on its own into the mixer.

BurningSkies · #11 05-05-2011, 05:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mesaphlin

Countryman is better than the Avalon U5 tonally?

No, just different. Its one of the industry standards for a DI...and one that can take speaker level signal.

If you're looking to get a tool to practice at home in a headphone setting, there are a whole bunch of great little units out there. I happen to like the Korg Pandora and I plug it into my computer and run iTunes from it or my ipod as well as using it for some home demo effects and such.

mesaphlin · #12 05-05-2011, 05:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alex1984

Too many pre-amps. Not a problem as long as you mind your levels, but why go through such a long chain when you could just use the U5 on its own into the mixer.

So, it would be better like this?...

The BASS --> The Avalon U5 --> The Mixer --> The Headphones

With this chain, you say that there will be no problem at all?

BurningSkies · #13 05-05-2011, 05:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alex1984

Too many pre-amps. Not a problem as long as you mind your levels, but why go through such a long chain when you could just use the U5 on its own into the mixer.

A U5 is an awesome piece of kit. Its also a fairly expensive, rarified and specific piece of gear. There are plenty of really nice sounding DI's that would make 99% of people happy and not cost you an arm and a leg to own for modest home use and occasional gigging.

Unless you're just looking to spend as much as you can...

mesaphlin · #14 05-05-2011, 05:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BurningSkies

A U5 is an awesome piece of kit. Its also a fairly expensive, rarified and specific piece of gear. There are plenty of really nice sounding DI's that would make 99% of people happy and not cost you an arm and a leg to own for modest home use and occasional gigging.

Unless you're just looking to spend as much as you can...

Would it be dangerous for my mixer if I hook up the bass to an Avalon U5 and then U5 to mixer?

charlie monroe · #15 05-05-2011, 05:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mesaphlin

... I want to listen to some drum sample loops from my computer through my headphone while I play the bass so how am I gonna be able to manage that?

USB / Firewire Interface?

If the computer is already hosting the drums, it should be monster simple to mix the bass in as well.

Don't think you need the MarkBass, or the mixer.

mesaphlin · #16 05-05-2011, 05:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by charlie monroe

USB / Firewire Interface?

If the computer is already hosting the drums, it should be monster simple to mix the bass in as well.

Don't think you need the MarkBass, or the mixer.

I don't get it sorry...

Could you explain it how I am gonna be able to manage that please?

BurningSkies · #17 05-05-2011, 05:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mesaphlin

Would it be dangerous for my mixer if I hook up the bass to an Avalon U5 and then U5 to mixer?

It would not harm the mixer at all. That's what a DI does...it takes an instrument signal and transforms it into a line level signal for things like a mixing board.

seamonkey · #18 05-05-2011, 05:20 PM

Got an iPod or iPhone?
AmpliTube iRig

Peavey and Alesis make iPod interfaces also.
You can walk around, play along, and record - along with the songs you're learning.

BurningSkies · #19 05-05-2011, 05:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mesaphlin

I don't get it sorry...

Could you explain it how I am gonna be able to manage that please?

Theoretically, what he's getting at is if you have an audio interface, you could input the bass by way of firewire or USBII into a program like Cubase, or Reaper and then you could run drum tracks on one or multiple channels and run your bass into another virtual channel, the same way most recording is done these days.

Otherwise you could just get a practice/personal/headphone amp that has an aux. input for your canned drums or music to play along with.

charlie monroe · #20 05-05-2011, 05:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mesaphlin

I don't get it sorry...

Could you explain it how I am gonna be able to manage that please?

The way I have my signal at home is :

Bass (1/4") into
Effects (1/4") into
USB Interface (USB) into
MacBook
Garageband works as drum looper and drum/bass mixer (I layer a guitar rythym or two sometimes as well)
Headphones out of laptop or USB interface

Any USB interface you buy will have some kind of software, it doesn't have to be Mac

I only use an amp to play with other people, or if my neighbor downstairs is out.