Tuner advice...Rack vs. Pedal

[streetknight]

Sorry if the wrong section guys. Most of you recommended me to rack mount my new GK 700RBII that I bought...I thought I may try to get a tuner while I was at it. Haven't been able to find any besides strobe ones that are out of my price range.

Or would I be better off with a good ole Boss pedal tuner and call it a day?

[BurningSkies]

Originally Posted by streetknight

Sorry if the wrong section guys. Most of you recommended me to rack mount my new GK 700RBII that I bought...I thought I may try to get a tuner while I was at it. Haven't been able to find any besides strobe ones that are out of my price range.

Or would I be better off with a good ole Boss pedal tuner and call it a day?

The boss tuner is decent, but I've really been loving the TC Electronics Polytune way more than even my Korg rack tuner.

TC Electronic | PolyTune - Still tuning one string at a time?

[Phalex]

Love my Turbo Tuner!

[KJung]

While I am a turbotuner fan (by far, the 'top of the heap' in pedal based tuners on almost any criterion you look at), it is a bit expensive.

For me, the 'best bang for the buck' is the Pitchblack. Fast tracking, 'good enough' accuracy, the all important true bypass if you keep your tuner in line, small, and while not cheap, it won't break the bank.

Rack tuners are mostly less accurate and track slower than the new batch of high end pedal tuners (TC, Turbotuner, and Pitchblack), and the ability to keep the tuner in line without any impact on your high frequency response results in the bonus of having a foot operated mute switch in line.

Also, and I could be wrong here, I believe the GK amp you have has top cooling vents that you don't want to cover up with another rack mounted unit sitting right on top of it (other GK owners can verify this... been a while since I've seen the 700).

So, pitchblack would be the way I would go, for price value reasons.

[georgestrings]

*If* you're going to use a pedalboard fulltime, I think the pedal type is probably the way to go - it not, I prefer racked for ease of setup... For pedal types, it's hard to go wrong with the TurboTuner, Polytune, or Pitchblack - all 3 work great... I have a Strobostomp, and really like it, but other than it's ability to be easily seen in bright sunlight(think outdoor fest-type shows), it doesn't offer much advantage over those 3...

*If* - like me, you know you're not going to use a pedalboard, and *if* you're using a racked amp like the 700rb-II, IMO a racked tuner makes the most sense - a used Korg DTR-1000 is a great value, IMO... I have the DTR-2000, and although it works great, I really don't need the additional bells and whistles it has over the 1000 - I bought it because I got a good deal on it, but haven't regretted the purchase... I can literally be set up in less than one minute: roll my cab into place, set the rack on top of it, pop off the covers, plug in my surge strip, speaker cable, then fire it up - you can't do that with a pedalboard...


Here's a pic from when I had a pair of 700rb-IIs, and one was racked up with a tuner and wireless:




- georgestrings

[georgestrings]

Originally Posted by KJung

While I am a turbotuner fan (by far, the 'top of the heap' in pedal based tuners on almost any criterion you look at), it is a bit expensive.

For me, the 'best bang for the buck' is the Pitchblack. Fast tracking, 'good enough' accuracy, the all important true bypass if you keep your tuner in line, small, and while not cheap, it won't break the bank.

Rack tuners are mostly less accurate and track slower than the new batch of high end pedal tuners (TC, Turbotuner, and Pitchblack), and the ability to keep the tuner in line without any impact on your high frequency response results in the bonus of having a foot operated mute switch in line.

Also, and I could be wrong here, I believe the GK amp you have has top cooling vents that you don't want to cover up with another rack mounted unit sitting right on top of it (other GK owners can verify this... been a while since I've seen the 700).

So, pitchblack would be the way I would go, for price value reasons.

Will respectfully disagree, in *some* cases - for example, a used DTR-1000 can be had for $100, tracks as fast and is as accurate as the Pitchblack - I have both a Pitchblack and a DTR-2000, FWIW... Sure, the Polytune and TurboTuner track a tiny bit faster, and are marginally more accurate, but it isn't enough of a difference for any practical purposes... Also, both those racked tuners can be run from a tuner out, have a built-in mute switch, and can be used as footswitchable mute - so, any signal loss is a non-issue...

Lastly, those Korg Tuners are shallow enough so that that don't cause any venting problems with G-K's 700rb-II or 1001rb-II, IME - I did tons of gigs that way, in temps over 95F, and never had an issue...

No argument that today's pedal tuners are fantastic - but for convenience's sake, in some situations the right rack tuner makes sense, IMO...


- georgestrings

[georgestrings]

Originally Posted by BurningSkies

The boss tuner is decent, but I've really been loving the TC Electronics Polytune way more than even my Korg rack tuner.

TC Electronic | PolyTune - Still tuning one string at a time?

Yeah, both my guitarists are using the Polytune, and it's proven to be an excellent piece of gear - and a great value... IMO, even the new Boss TU-3 isn't in the same league as the other tuners mentioned in this thread, and the TU-2 is a piece of junk compared to them...


- georgestrings

[Liam Wald]

I have a Peterson StroboRack. It was kind of expensive but it is very quick , super accurate (accurate enough to set instrument calibration), and I can see it from 25 feet away. I like it a lot better than I liked my old Korg DTR Rack.

[jnewmark]

Originally Posted by KJung

While I am a turbotuner fan (by far, the 'top of the heap' in pedal based tuners on almost any criterion you look at), it is a bit expensive.

For me, the 'best bang for the buck' is the Pitchblack. Fast tracking, 'good enough' accuracy, the all important true bypass if you keep your tuner in line, small, and while not cheap, it won't break the bank.

Rack tuners are mostly less accurate and track slower than the new batch of high end pedal tuners (TC, Turbotuner, and Pitchblack), and the ability to keep the tuner in line without any impact on your high frequency response results in the bonus of having a foot operated mute switch in line.

Also, and I could be wrong here, I believe the GK amp you have has top cooling vents that you don't want to cover up with another rack mounted unit sitting right on top of it (other GK owners can verify this... been a while since I've seen the 700).

So, pitchblack would be the way I would go, for price value reasons.

+1. I switched to the Pitchblack, mainly because I can see it on dark stages, and yes, it does track very fast. I keep it on all the time.

[KJung]

Originally Posted by georgestrings

Will respectfully disagree, in *some* cases - for example, a used DTR-1000 can be had for $100, tracks as fast and is as accurate as the Pitchblack - I have both a Pitchblack and a DTR-2000, FWIW... Sure, the Polytune and TurboTuner track a tiny bit faster, and are marginally more accurate, but it isn't enough of a difference for any practical purposes... Also, both those racked tuners can be run from a tuner out, have a built-in mute switch, and can be used as footswitchable mute - so, any signal loss is a non-issue...

Lastly, those Korg Tuners are shallow enough so that that don't cause any venting problems with G-K's 700rb-II or 1001rb-II, IME - I did tons of gigs that way, in temps over 95F, and never had an issue...

No argument that today's pedal tuners are fantastic - but for convenience's sake, in some situations the right rack tuner makes sense, IMO...


- georgestrings

+1, and thanks for the clarification on the top vent of the 700. I wasn't sure if that would be an issue or not.

Of course, if you run a tuner from the tuner out, then the mute switch won't have any impact, whether it is a rack mount or a pedal.

I agree though, as long as the rack tuner is true bypass, and tracks reasonably quickly, then it is just a matter of form factor and individual preference.

[BurningSkies]

Originally Posted by georgestrings

Yeah, both my guitarists are using the Polytune, and it's proven to be an excellent piece of gear - and a great value... IMO, even the new Boss TU-3 isn't in the same league as the other tuners mentioned in this thread, and the TU-2 is a piece of junk compared to them...


- georgestrings

I have one of the Korg rack tuners from back before they renamed them in the thousands...I think mine's a DTR-2? I can't remember. It was in my rack for about 10 years without failure. I liked that that wide LED display is visible across the stage and that you can leave it in your side chain without needing to futz with anything. I also liked the graduated-brightness LEDs, but IIRC it wasn't the quickest to grab notes.

The pedals are working for me mostly because I tune before the set then hand it off to our singer/guitar player who needs a tuner way more than I do, and uses it in his stage setup. I can tune with it in just a few seconds (literally under a minute), but I judge the Polytune on ease of use for him, since he's extremely non-tech savvy...being from a part of Africa that doesn't have power or running water. You should see us discussing his amp settings! I've also migrated him to a single pickup guitar with a single vol/tone knob set up...

[KJung]

Originally Posted by BurningSkies

The pedals are working for me mostly because I tune before the set then hand it off to our singer/guitar player who needs a tuner way more than I do, and uses it in his stage setup. I can tune with it in just a few seconds (literally under a minute), but I judge the Polytune on ease of use for him, since he's extremely non-tech savvy...being from a part of Africa that doesn't have power or running water. You should see us discussing his amp settings! I've also migrated him to a single pickup guitar with a single vol/tone knob set up...

One of the things that turned me off a bit on the polytune is that I got signficantly different readings from the poly mode versus tuning in the mono mode. The mono mode lined up 'pretty well' with my strobe-based tuner (close enough for stage use), and the tracking was good in mono mode. In Poly mode, the tuner was not consistent within itself, nor with my strobe reference tune.

Not sure what was going on there... maybe this doesn't happen with guitar. With bass, seems to be an issue.

[ehque]

Originally Posted by Phalex

Love my Turbo Tuner!

Me too. It's not marginally more accurate than the Pitchblack, it's 50 times more accurate.

I can actually tell if the room temperature has changed by the shift in tuning on the SRTT. (of course, you'll need a really good bass to do this)

[BurningSkies]

Originally Posted by KJung

One of the things that turned me off a bit on the polytune is that I got signficantly different readings from the poly mode versus tuning in the mono mode. The mono mode lined up 'pretty well' with my strobe-based tuner (close enough for stage use), and the tracking was good in mono mode. In Poly mode, the tuner was not consistent within itself, nor with my strobe reference tune.

Not sure what was going on there... maybe this doesn't happen with guitar. With bass, seems to be an issue.

Its pretty good with guitar, not perfect but good enough to peg which string is off if you're not adept at that kind of thing, and use mono mode from there. The trick is that you have to hit those open strings very lightly...then it's more accurate in poly mode. For me I don't poly tune my bass. It's so quick and easy and my Dingwalls stay in tune so well that once at the beginning of the night is all it takes and it's very minor.

[KJung]

Originally Posted by BurningSkies

Its pretty good with guitar, not perfect but good enough to peg which string is off if you're not adept at that kind of thing, and use mono mode from there. The trick is that you have to hit those open strings very lightly...then it's more accurate in poly mode. For me I don't poly tune my bass. It's so quick and easy and my Dingwalls stay in tune so well that once at the beginning of the night is all it takes and it's very minor.

Makes sense. Seems a bit of a design problem, since there is no way the user will know if the 'in tune' readings in poly mode are 'really in tune' other than listening closely.

And yes, any well made instrument should pretty much stay in tune. I do like to check mine at the beginning of each set.... just stomp on the button for automute, and tweak if needed. Sometimes, in these stupidly over air conditioned rooms, it is actually a string issue more than a neck/bass issue, with the strings (and horns!) all going similarly sharp over time.

[BurningSkies]

Originally Posted by KJung

Makes sense. Seems a bit of a design problem, since there is no way the user will know if the 'in tune' readings in poly mode are 'really in tune' other than listening closely.

And yes, any well made instrument should pretty much stay in tune. I do like to check mine at the beginning of each set.... just stomp on the button for automute, and tweak if needed. Sometimes, in these stupidly over air conditioned rooms, it is actually a string issue more than a neck/bass issue, with the strings (and horns!) all going similarly sharp over time.

I always rub my strings down with my hands before tuning or playing to bring them up to playing temperature...then it stays accurate for the set. Usually, during set break they go up in pitch slightly but right back down once I do the same for set two.

[KJung]

Originally Posted by BurningSkies

I always rub my strings down with my hands before tuning or playing to bring them up to playing temperature...then it stays accurate for the set. Usually, during set break they go up in pitch slightly but right back down once I do the same for set two.

+1 Minor issue, and you can get into a 'its sharp, now its flat, now its sharp' sort of loop over the duration of the gig in some situations.

[mattplaysdabass]

Originally Posted by KJung

Makes sense. Seems a bit of a design problem, since there is no way the user will know if the 'in tune' readings in poly mode are 'really in tune' other than listening closely.

And yes, any well made instrument should pretty much stay in tune. I do like to check mine at the beginning of each set.... just stomp on the button for automute, and tweak if needed. Sometimes, in these stupidly over air conditioned rooms, it is actually a string issue more than a neck/bass issue, with the strings (and horns!) all going similarly sharp over time.

Strings go sharp in a cool room, horns will go sharp in a hot room.

[BurningSkies]

Originally Posted by mattplaysdabass

Strings go sharp in a cool room, horns will go sharp in a hot room.

Metal is a wonderful material...

[KJung]

Originally Posted by mattplaysdabass

Strings go sharp in a cool room, horns will go sharp in a hot room.

Thanks. I just know things get very wonky in those overly cooled rooms (and of course, on those 90 degree summer days outside).