Two way cab question

[M0ses]

This is just pure curiosity. I don't have a two way cab. Although I am thinking about my next cab maybe being a fEarful. I was just wondering, if you've got a woofer and a 6" driver in there, how do you mic that up? Wouldn't it require two mics? Is the sound man just gonna shake his head and hand me a DI?

[JimmyM]

Originally Posted by M0ses

This is just pure curiosity. I don't have a two way cab. Although I am thinking about my next cab maybe being a fEarful. I was just wondering, if you've got a woofer and a 6" driver in there, how do you mic that up? Wouldn't it require two mics? Is the sound man just gonna shake his head and hand me a DI?

the latter is the most likely scenario

this is a question i'm curious about, too. we had a thread a month ago on it, and nobody was real clear about how to mic one. but that's what i plan on doing when i get mine, so i'll be experimenting around with it.

[rpsands]

No point in mic'ing it since it's got no inherent character at all to speak of. Pretty smooth all over.

Send a post-eq DI.

[JimmyM]

Originally Posted by rpsands

No point in mic'ing it since it's got no inherent character at all to speak of. Pretty smooth all over.

Send a post-eq DI.

wuss.

[B-string]

Yes the sound man's going to say DI.

[JimmyM]

i dare a soundman to dictate to me.

[B-string]

Originally Posted by JimmyM

i dare a soundman to dictate to me.

Remember unless you are just playing to hear yourself.....they control the faders to the house!

[IronMaiden]

The point of the fEarful cabs are to produce flat non-colored sound so you can adjust your tone and it will come out of the speakers sounding like it should through the PA. So it would be a waste of time to mic it.

[johnk_10]

i see both points but kind of disagree. you can easily mic a two way cab. i just aim the mic mostly at the woofer's edge, but kinda between the two and about 8" off of the grill. you'll get most of the bass' thump, but the highs from the mid driver will get picked up too. it takes a little experimentation at home (i 'test' record it), but once you find the where you want it, you just set it up that way at the gig. IME, the moving air from a speaker exciting a mic's diaphram is i a whole different trip than feeding the house a direct line-level electronic signal.

[MysticMichael]

Originally Posted by johnk_10

i see both points but kind of disagree. you can easily mic a two way cab. i just aim the mic mostly at the woofer's edge, but kinda between the two and about 8" off of the grill. you'll get most of the bass' thump, but the highs from the mid driver will get picked up too. it takes a little experimentation at home (i 'test' record it), but once you find the where you want it, you just set it up that way at the gig. IME, the moving air from a speaker exciting a mic's diaphram is i a whole different trip than feeding the house a direct line-level electronic signal.

I agree entirely. A DI signal is rarely, if ever, equivalent to a miked amp signal...

That said, there are ways to catch both drivers with one mike - by experimenting with proper positioning. When in doubt, err on the side of the midrange driver, as the woofer will naturally project into the room much better on its own - and because if necessary, the woofer's low-frequency output will naturally be much closer in quality to the DI signal.

Personally, I prefer to run a DI and a miked cabinet simultaneously...

MM

[Mr. Foxen]

In my experience they point the mic at the woofer and declare all multi way cabs sound crap. If you have time for messing, point it between the two and fiddle as necessary with the relative distance till it is good, possibly biased toward the midrange, and let the DI deal with the low. Good micing takes time whatever, most sound men can sling a mic in roughly the right place on a guitar speaker cause they are much of a muchness for 50 years or so, takes time to catch up with the fancy new tech.

[johnk_10]

IMO, the worst is when they center it in front of the woofer on a two-way and put it right up to grill. it usually ends up being pure mud that way. i think that its actually simple to mic it if you use common sense (and your ears).

[CDweller]

Originally Posted by johnk_10

....IME, the moving air from a speaker exciting a mic's diaphram is i a whole different trip than feeding the house a direct line-level electronic signal.

Right on.

[James Judson]

Let the sound man worry about it. That's what he is getting paid to do. You can point that mike at any speaker. The woofer has all the frequencies (lows and to a lesser extent highs), the tweeter (same thing only backwards). If he chooses DI trust that he is making the wisest choice. If he makes you sound bad there is nothing you can do about it unless you have the power to fire him.

[billfitzmaurice]

Originally Posted by B-string

Yes the sound man's going to say DI.

Not if he knows what he's doing. If he does he'll run a DI through one channel for the low end, a mic through another for the mids and highs, and he'll actually take the time to adjust the mic position to get the best result.
If he doesn't know what he's doing he's going to screw your tone royally anyway, so what he uses for a source is the least of your concerns.

[KJung]

Originally Posted by IronMaiden

The point of the fEarful cabs are to produce flat non-colored sound so you can adjust your tone and it will come out of the speakers sounding like it should through the PA. So it would be a waste of time to mic it.

Actually, my experience with these cabs is they sound very little like a big front of house system (especially if they don't have tweeters). This idea of 'non colored' is silly. Changing the brand of mid driver very much changes the tone and feel of these cabs (I've heard a bunch of them). Also, every amp head has its own voicing, and some users of these (and other cabs) generate a distinct tone due to the distortion characteristics of different heads.

And, mic'ing a two way cab is not that big of a deal.

[rpsands]

I have never had an issue running with just a di. Plenty of mids and highs :P Most of the time I've used a di from my pedalboard right before the amp, however. My bass tone is not particularly complex though

I've also worked with several really quality sound guys with the fEarful and some have wanted to mic and some have not. My favorite was a guy who just used my Demeter's DI -- phenomenal sound FOH.

[JimmyM]

i am not a fan of di's, and do them only on fly dates when the tone of my rented cab isn't very good. yes, they work fine, but i like the sound of a mic'ed cab. so i will be micing my new audio kinesis cab when it comes in.

[B-string]

Originally Posted by billfitzmaurice

Not if he knows what he's doing. If he does he'll run a DI through one channel for the low end, a mic through another for the mids and highs, and he'll actually take the time to adjust the mic position to get the best result.
If he doesn't know what he's doing he's going to screw your tone royally anyway, so what he uses for a source is the least of your concerns.

Just IME only 20% really "know" what they are doing. Telling most of them to hang two mikes on one cab and sub mix three strips for just a "bass" is asking for trouble?

[rpsands]

Wonder if it'd be viable to use a personal mixer and your own mic to send a mixed Di and Mic yourself if you wanted to use the dual setup, and not have to worry about a sound guy messin with it