What makes an 8x10 do what it does?

[hardtwister]

Originally Posted by BigEarl

Of all the cabs I own, have owned or played through, by far the most memorable was the Ampeg SVT 810 that was on the backline at the ROT rally last year in Austin ....being driven by Eden WT800. Wow, what a sound and feeling!

Awesome! Yeah when it works it works huh? I just think there's something special about an 8x10.. What is it?!!

[Mastermold]

Originally Posted by meatwad

8x10s? I thought it was all about the 2x12s these days. Last time I saw an Ampeg 8x10, I spilled a Bartles & James into my Atari 5200..

212s are cool too and I got by for years without an 810. Nothing I've tried sounds as good as this rig however:



Edit: appropriate venue size of course. I still use smaller rigs all the time that sound great. Mesa's WA 112 is one of the best sounding amps I'v ever heard and handles a lot of venues.

[Got2SadowskyNYC]

So carring around a 130lb single cabnet that you have to tote every is better than carring around a 165 lbs split over 2 cabs that you don't have to carry to ever show.

If you do the smart thing you get the 2x10 and the 18 sub that drops you done to 139lbs split over to cabs.

Makes perfect sense.

[iualum]

Originally Posted by hardtwister

Awesome! Yeah when it works it works huh? I just think there's something special about an 8x10.. What is it?!!

If you like 810s, if you think they're special, that's great & good on you. Pick up an Ampeg fridge (or 2) & enjoy.

[slyjoe]

Originally Posted by iualum

Surface area only begins to tell the story, & your surface area calculations are incorrect as well. Also, 10s don't necessarily move quicker, nor are they inherently "punchier." Old wives tales.

And not knowing how to calculate area doesn't help.

[RS66LB]

Originally Posted by Bass_Pounder

Just about everything here is wrong

lol, well don't keep us in suspense, tell us why

[hardtwister]

Originally Posted by Got2SadowskyNYC

So carring around a 130lb single cabnet that you have to tote every is better than carring around a 165 lbs split over 2 cabs that you don't have to carry to ever show.

If you do the smart thing you get the 2x10 and the 18 sub that drops you done to 139lbs split over to cabs.

Makes perfect sense.

Great question? What's wrong with an 18"? We're talking bass right? Low frequency.. the bigger speaker should produce better lows right? Wrong I think.. The 8x10 kills

[vishuddha]

Nothing about 810s is special... it's really a pretty average setup. I'll stick with a 215 any day.

Also, comparing an 810 to a 410+115 setup is pretty ridiculous... apples and rotten oranges. 410+115 is inferior to 810s OR 215s in almost every imaginable scenario.

[iualum]

Originally Posted by Got2SadowskyNYC

So carring around a 130lb single cabnet that you have to tote every is better than carring around a 165 lbs split over 2 cabs that you don't have to carry to ever show.

If you do the smart thing you get the 2x10 and the 18 sub that drops you done to 139lbs split over to cabs.

Makes perfect sense.

Nope, nope, & nope.

215/2x6.5 (3015LFs/6ND410s), 70-75 lbs. Freakish monster box.

[hardtwister]

Originally Posted by iualum

If you like 810s, if you think they're special, that's great & good on you. Pick up an Ampeg fridge (or 2) & enjoy.

So weight is your only issue? If weight was not a factor?

[Bass_Pounder]

Originally Posted by RS66LB

lol, well don't keep us in suspense, tell us why

Lets see:

Improper calculation of "surface area"

Surface area means NOTHING - it's displacement and sensitivity that matter

10's don't move/respond faster then 15's

If you had to go 20 - 30 feet out to hear bass waves develop, headphones would not work

[whitedk57]

It moves masses quantities of air...

[mindwell]

Originally Posted by hardtwister

Awesome! Yeah when it works it works huh? I just think there's something special about an 8x10.. What is it?!!

Taking all of this with the appropriate caveats (FWIW/IME/IMO), having owned one and having played through it for twenty-five years, I think it's a number of things:

-having eight drivers all doing the same thing, with no frequency gaps needing to be crossed over, creates a very uniform response;

-the sealed chambers and pairing of the speakers makes for a very "tight" and responsive feel

-the low-end roll-off. The cabinet does NOT produce any lows below (I think) 40hz. What it does produce are lots and lots of thick low-mid frequencies, and these tend to cut through best when one is fairly close; within 15' or so. Beyond that distance, the absent low end becomes quite apparent.

810's are great because they can cut through high stage volumes without interfering with the low end coming from the subs. With an 810, you always can hear yourself. You'll occupy a distinct frequency spectrum that works beautifully against high-volume guitars, but is nonetheless manageable for the sound person.

That's my $.02. They do something other designs do not.

[Bass_Pounder]

Originally Posted by hardtwister

So weight is your only issue? If weight was not a factor?

Weight is not a factor for me as I use Mesa RR cabs that weigh a ton.

I'll take my Mesa 2X15 loaded with Emi 3015's over a 8X10 anyday.

[hardtwister]

Originally Posted by vishuddha

Nothing about 810s is special... it's really a pretty average setup. I'll stick with a 215 any day.

Also, comparing an 810 to a 410+115 setup is pretty ridiculous... apples and rotten oranges. 410+115 is inferior to 810s OR 215s in almost every imaginable scenario.

Apples and rotten oranges? Rotten oranges??? Lotta guys like/run the 1x15 & 4x10 setup. Lotta guys that can play..

[hardtwister]

Originally Posted by Bass_Pounder

Weight is not a factor for me as I use Mesa RR cabs that weigh a ton.

I'll take my Mesa 2X15 loaded with Emi 3015's over a 8X10 anyday.

Hmmm.. I am curious about that rig. What are Emi 3015's?

[dhsierra1]

Originally Posted by RS66LB

lol, well don't keep us in suspense, tell us why

it's not about surface area, it's about displacement when it comes to generating low frequencies for a given volume.

Also, 10s are not inherently "faster" or have better highs than 15s, the speed of sound is the speed of sound.

Compare the displacement an Eminence BP102 (10") to an Electro Voice EVM-15L, not to mention their respective bandwidths. Exactly the opposite of what you'd expect.


As far as cone diameters go, that matters more in beaming above a frequency that's a function of their diameter. The smaller the diameter, the higher the frequency beaming begins.

Lots of information here in the stickies about the subject, it's basic physics.

[iualum]

Originally Posted by Bass_Pounder

Lets see:

Improper calculation of "surface area"

Surface area means NOTHING - it's displacement and sensitivity that matter

10's don't move/respond faster then 15's

If you had to go 20 - 30 feet out to hear bass waves develop, headphones would not work

Yepper. Sd is a component of Vd, but you need the actual Sd from the driver manufacturer.

[Jimmy Stump]

Originally Posted by Got2SadowskyNYC

8 10 inch speakers gives you 80 inches of surface area moving air.

4 10s and a 15 gives you 55 inches of surface area.

10's react faster than a 15 so they sound punchier at close range. 15s being slower to respond sound woffier at close range.

Move your ear out about 20 - 30 feet and the waves have had time to fully develope and they will sound almost the same.

Originally Posted by Bass_Pounder

Just about everything here is wrong

And we're off!

[Bass_Pounder]

Originally Posted by hardtwister

Apples and rotten oranges? Rotten oranges??? Lotta guys like/run the 1x15 & 4x10 setup. Lotta guys that can play..

It's all bad marketing.

I bet you think it is because you get the "best of both world's" - the boom of the 15 with the punch of the tens ? ALL BS

Being able to play does not make them audio engineers with an understanding of: phase issues, comb filtering, improper power distibution, etc (most of which you will find with that mixed setup).