Why don't more companies make three way cabs?

[Bob C]

I've been reading up on fEarful, LDS and Avatar threads, and wondering why more big name manufacturers aren't offering three-way bass cabinets.

I know a lot of it has to do with giving consumers what they think they want. For all the imagery of musicians being "open-minded free spirits", most are pretty set in their ways.

But there are also tons of bass players who are always in search of a better mousetrap or Holy Grail.

Decades ago, EV offered a 3-way cab, but I don't think it caught on. More recently, EA started out with 3-ways, but I'm pretty sure they switched to 2-way designs.

Same with Acme's Flatwound and their other new design. I know they still make the LowB series, but it seems to me that Andy has changed his philosophy as to what is required of a good cabinet design.

So, is it all about sales? Or is it just "YMMV"? Or maybe there are lots more 3-way cabs out there that I'm not aware of.

[lomo]

3 way cabs are more complicated to engineer (properly). But the real reason is that very few cab buyers know what the advantages of a great 3-way cab are.

[Ric5]

Why don't more companies make three way cabs?

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For lower volume you don't need it and for higher volume you just run through a pa system that has the right speakers, cabs and crossovers to reproduce the sound correctly.

[Sundogue]

Originally Posted by Ric5

Why don't more companies make three way cabs?

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For lower volume you don't need it and for higher volume you just run through a pa system that has the right speakers, cabs and crossovers to reproduce the sound correctly.

You mean for lower volume, you don't need it, and for higher volume, you just run through the PA.

Doesn't seem to be the case for lots of others though.

[shoot-r]

If this design becomes even more popular than it's already become, and proves to be as good as the players that already have went to these designs are reporting them to be, I think we'll see many bass cabinet manufacturer's release their version of this design in the near furture.

I hope so anyway!!!

[Jazz Ad]

I'd venture saying that manufacturers design for the long run and prefer to avoid hypes, prefering designs that will still sell in a few years.
If demand for 3-way cabs keeps (or starts?) increasing, you will find some at Peavey and Behringer.

[BassmanPaul]

Originally Posted by Bob C

Same with Acme's Flatwound and their other new design. I know they still make the LowB series, but it seems to me that Andy has changed his philosophy as to what is required of a good cabinet design.

The reason Andy used a midrange in the Low B series was that the woofer couldn't supply the mids needed.

The 12" driver in the Flatwound can and thus the mid is not required.

Andy has always designed for a full range cabinet and has succeeded with both designs. If you want more information there is a thread on the Flatwound that is quite informative.

[R Baer]

The 3 way cab is not a new concept and has been done in the past by various companies. For whatever reason, those cabs did not stand the test of time and deliver good enough sales to warrant keeping those cabs on the market. Manufacturers have to move a certain volume of any product to justify continuing the line.

I'm always of the belief that companies will provide products for which there is demand. It's simply quite possible that the bass community, as a whole, isn't demanding a 3 way design. For all the "flaws" the 410 cabinets has (and there are many positives), I'm sure most manufacturer will agree that it's is still the best selling cab in their line up. In other words, bassist still prefer this design over others. I'm not sure the interest of one particular design within the small TB community here truly represents the buying power of the worldwide market. Even among the TB crowd, I would bet ownership of 15" 3way designs pales in numbers compared to traditional 210/410/810 owners.

[rpsands]

All top quality Pa systems are 3-way or more (2-way tops and a sub) as far as I know. It's just good speaker design.

I predict an increase in demand for fidelity in bass cabinets as modeling gets better. It's going to be some time though

[4-string]

As good as these designs are, they probably aren't for everyone. Different strokes and all that.

[fdeck]

I think that until recently, there hasn't been much of an awareness of what a 3-way cab can do. It's only been brought to the attention of the BG world by a few dedicated DIY'ers and speaker experts within the past few years.

[Electricblue]

My guess is that today's speakers can produce a broader range than before, thus covering the range only needs 1 or 2 modern drivers.

Another speaker will add 20 pounds or so to the materials price, more labour to screw and wire the extra speaker, more wire and more components (therefore more labour too) in the crossover.

Could somebody varify this?

[Bob C]

Originally Posted by BassmanPaul

The reason Andy used a midrange in the Low B series was that the woofer couldn't supply the mids needed.

The 12" driver in the Flatwound can and thus the mid is not required.

Andy has always designed for a full range cabinet and has succeeded with both designs. If you want more information there is a thread on the Flatwound that is quite informative.

Paul,

I've followed that thread started by Bluesy Soul since its inception. The thing is, when Andy introduced the world to his 3-way systems he schooled us on his web site as to "why 2-way systems don't work". (I'm paraphrasing). Now he says that they do. Is it because of the neo drivers, which weren't being used in 1996? Doesn't that mean the Low B designs are now obsolete?

[Bob C]

Originally Posted by R Baer

The 3 way cab is not a new concept and has been done in the past by various companies. For whatever reason, those cabs did not stand the test of time and deliver good enough sales to warrant keeping those cabs on the market. Manufacturers have to move a certain volume of any product to justify continuing the line.

I'm always of the belief that companies will provide products for which there is demand. It's simply quite possible that the bass community, as a whole, isn't demanding a 3 way design. For all the "flaws" the 410 cabinets has (and there are many positives), I'm sure most manufacturer will agree that it's is still the best selling cab in their line up. In other words, bassist still prefer this design over others. I'm not sure the interest of one particular design within the small TB community here truly represents the buying power of the worldwide market. Even among the TB crowd, I would bet ownership of 15" 3way designs pales in numbers compared to traditional 210/410/810 owners.

R Baer,

I understand and agree with everything in your post. But proponents of the mid driver designs say that it is THE answer - filling in the hole in the spectrum between woofers and tweeters. So, I'm wondering if more companies will jump on the bandwagon. Or will this be looked back on as a passing fad.

[rpsands]

No one is saying it is THE answer. It is AN answer.


To the question:
"What do I do if I want relatively flat frequency response and a predictable radiation pattern in a bass cabinet?"

There are a few answers other than mid drivers too.

And a mid driver is only part of the answer--a properly designed crossover is vital, and gets grossly overlooked. People don't see what's in the box, sadly.

The difference between a fEarful and a TB153--it's more than the shape of the box

[faulknersj]

In time...the 3-way cab designs will be as standard as a 4x10 imo.

[dhomer]

A properly-engineered 3-way would simply cost too much to produce. Commercial mfg's could not make these cabs cost competitive in their marketing system. By the time everyone in the distribution system gets their cut, the retail price would be way too high in comparison to cabs already on the market. Why there is a niche market for DIY/authorized builders... really the only way to get one at a somewhat reasonable cost...

[will33]

Cost does have a lot to do with it when people keep buying stuff that's cheap and easy to produce. Some guys may not like the sound of them initially cause they're just not used to it. There's a lot of content in the 2k - 4k octave that the 3 way or woof/mid 2way brings out that they're just not used to hearing. Most "regular" bass cabs don't have much going on there and whatever is gets lost to beaming at knee level.

In short, a lot of people either haven't heard or don't like what a bass really sounds like.

[Caca de Kick]

Show me a local club soundman who's willing to mic a cab three times.

[rpsands]

Originally Posted by Caca de Kick

Show me a local club soundman who's willing to mic a cab three times.

Show me someone on the internet who doesn't understand how mic'ing things works.