Yet Another (2) x 112 Thread

[brothernewt]

No new info to add, but I have a pair of the GK Neo's, and dig 'em. I'd say we have similar tone goals/tastes. I use a Tone Hammer pre/Walkabout rig and have the horns off. They're not too bright or sizzly to my ears (the way most other GK stuff is). Maybe oddly, they sound bigger on the bottom when not stacked on end (tall) but I still do that on cramped stages.

[JEDBass]

I have been using my HT/EX112ER syack with both a Walkabout and a M6 Carbine for a while now, and I just love these cabs. Both heads sound very different from each other, and these cabs let the amp's inherent voice shine right through, but I wouldn't say it's in a PA-cab type way at all, if that makes sense. The cabs can handle a good amount of power and while they're a bit heavier than some other 12's out there, the recessed handle is a lot better than the spring handle on the Aggies GS's for example (I've owned those before and agree 100% that they're at least a little mid-scooped). Also, the tweeter on the HT's is just about perfect for what I like. I haven't heard another tweeter in any cab quite like it. It's too bad Jim couldn't get them anymore, which is why you see the horn (I think it's from his AE line) on the newer HD series.

[nostatic]

Originally Posted by GRoberts

So I keep coming back to three options: Bergantino HD112, Baer ML112, Gk Neo II 1x12's. The Aguilar DB's are a bit big and deep and the SL112's just don't do it for me based on reports from a feller TB'er who has very very similar basses, and tonal goals.

I owned all of those mentioned except for the DBs (too much of a pita to carry). I sold the SL112 as it ran out of gas when pushed earlier than I would have liked. I liked my Berg AE210 over the HD112 (at least back when I had both - my ears and goals have changed a little) but the HD112 is a nice cab. The GK is great bang for the buck but on some level you get what you pay for.

In shorthand, my criteria and differences:

HD112 - 44 lbs, 15" deep so fits on tight stages, more cube than vertical. Has extended highs from the tweeter.

SL112 - 25 lbs, 18" deep and a little awkward to carry. Typical strap handle (hate them) and no feet on the "side" so you only run it in one orientation. Single cab not enough for louder situations.

GK 112 mk2 - 30 lbs, 15.5" deep, vertical form factor and corners allow any orientation. Flush fit speak on connector and tweeter control iirc - not the best design. A bit edgy sounding to me.

ML112 - 37 lbs, 16.5" deep, vertical form factor. Strap handle but is form fitted and hinged, not a cheap plastic strap. Actually comfortable. Vertical form factor and feet on sides and bottom.

Out of those I think it comes down to ML112 or HD112 (at least for me). And you have some tradeoffs. The ML112 is lighter, the HD112 is shallower. The ML112 has a more vertical form factor (if you want it). The HD112 has tweeter extended highs. The ML112 has a bit more mid detail I think.

Hard to lose between those two. If you want to sound like Marcus Miller, go Berg due to the tweeter. The Baer has plenty of highs, but not that super extended stuff. If you can live without that (and frankly I think most player probably should ), then Baer is a great choice.

[GRoberts]

Originally Posted by nostatic

I owned all of those mentioned except for the DBs (too much of a pita to carry). I sold the SL112 as it ran out of gas when pushed earlier than I would have liked. I liked my Berg AE210 over the HD112 (at least back when I had both - my ears and goals have changed a little) but the HD112 is a nice cab. The GK is great bang for the buck but on some level you get what you pay for.

In shorthand, my criteria and differences:

HD112 - 44 lbs, 15" deep so fits on tight stages, more cube than vertical. Has extended highs from the tweeter.

SL112 - 25 lbs, 18" deep and a little awkward to carry. Typical strap handle (hate them) and no feet on the "side" so you only run it in one orientation. Single cab not enough for louder situations.

GK 112 mk2 - 30 lbs, 15.5" deep, vertical form factor and corners allow any orientation. Flush fit speak on connector and tweeter control iirc - not the best design. A bit edgy sounding to me.

ML112 - 37 lbs, 16.5" deep, vertical form factor. Strap handle but is form fitted and hinged, not a cheap plastic strap. Actually comfortable. Vertical form factor and feet on sides and bottom.

Out of those I think it comes down to ML112 or HD112 (at least for me). And you have some tradeoffs. The ML112 is lighter, the HD112 is shallower. The ML112 has a more vertical form factor (if you want it). The HD112 has tweeter extended highs. The ML112 has a bit more mid detail I think.

Hard to lose between those two. If you want to sound like Marcus Miller, go Berg due to the tweeter. The Baer has plenty of highs, but not that super extended stuff. If you can live without that (and frankly I think most player probably should ), then Baer is a great choice.

AWESOME post!! Thx Nostatic! Very helpful. And yes, of the three on my short list, its pretty much down to the Baer or Berg. Then again, maybe I just need to keep my eyes open for a used AE210. Hmmm. Kinda like the stacked 1x12 form factor. Baer's are looking very enticing. :-)

[DrumsAndBass]

I'm using this new stack made for me by JHawk Customs in AZ. The price for the pair was reasonable. A quote is simply a phone call away. There is a clear description of my 2 cabs on the bottom of the web page where it says, built for "dubbass" in this link:

http://www.jhawkcustoms.com/finished.htm

They sound great with my Tone Hammer 500 and give me lots of tone options. Here's my new modular rig:

[GRoberts]

Originally Posted by DrumsAndBass

I'm using this new stack made for me by JHawk Customs in AZ. The price for the pair was reasonable. A quote is simply a phone call away. There is a clear description of my 2 cabs on the bottom of the web page where it says, built for "dubbass" in this link:

http://www.jhawkcustoms.com/finished.htm

They sound great with my Tone Hammer 500 and give me lots of tone options. Here's my new modular rig:

That stack looks awesome!

[Chef]

That'd be fEARful stuff.
Yet another flavor for you G.

Pick something already, you're makin' me crazy!

[KJung]

Originally Posted by GRoberts

AWESOME post!! Thx Nostatic! Very helpful. And yes, of the three on my short list, its pretty much down to the Baer or Berg. Then again, maybe I just need to keep my eyes open for a used AE210. Hmmm. Kinda like the stacked 1x12 form factor. Baer's are looking very enticing. :-)

I'm with Chef, these cabs all sound very different, and Nostatic's description is very good. Shouldn't be that hard of a choice.

If you are moving more toward the 'tube growl and grind' of the Orange heads, of those, the Baer would be a no brainer, since a tweeter usually sounds like dog with that sort of tone. The AE210 is quite similar to the ML112, with the AE210 being a little tighter down low, and a little more extended and smooth (if you find a vertical one) or extended and rough (if you find the original).

The GK 112's are in the category of 'great for the price', so if you aren't on a budget, I would take them off the list.

The Bergs are, of course awesome, and will be deeper, smoother, and more crisp, with a much more relaxed upper mid response than the Baer (or the AE210)... just what IMO you wouldn't really want with the Orange or Aguilar type heads.

IMO!

[MysticMichael]

Originally Posted by SpinyNorman

I'll scout the used market for a single Berg/Aguilar/Baer/Hartke/GK/Avatar/GB, and play musical cabinets until I find the "perfect" cab.

Sure, go ahead. Do it the hard way. If you really must...

MM

[nostatic]

If you look used, my original AE210 was in the extended and rough category (towards the highs). Some rooms and nights it sounded great. Other nights it would drive me nuts. I finally moved away from them when I switched to Tecamp heads and found that I wanted a bit more low end (and a tad less upper mid grind). The downside to the revised AE210 is that they changed the handle placement. The original "horizontal" had the handles on the sides. I put feet on one side and ran it vertical, and I could one-hand carry it vertically. When they changed the orientation they changed the handles iirc, so you could no longer carry it vertically. Yeah, small details but loading in/out 100+ times a year small things add up to big things.

Clearly the sane thing to do is order on HD112 and one ML112. Gig them both for a month, then sell the one you like the least on TB and buy a second of the one you like better. Or maybe it would make a killer stack, and you'd have different flavors for different gigs. That's one reason I have a TC and Big E on order - 5 different bands means I should have at least two different brands of cabinets. And I'm still pining for a Blue Soul to give me two different brands of heads

[SpinyNorman]

Originally Posted by MysticMichael

Sure, go ahead. Do it the hard way. If you really must... MM

Lol. I took the first two steps. First, I received my Aguilar Tone Hammer 500 from Amazon last week. You should be seeing an Ampeg SVT-CL in the classified section at some point in the near future.

Second, I just purchased a pair of Genz Benz Focus 112's. At $440 shipped, the price was right.

I'm still on the lookout for a used GK-Neo112/Baer-ML112/Aggie-DB112/Berg-HT112ER. I think I may have to take a pass on the Aggie GS112, as reading the reviews on the DB112's seems to point to this cab as being a better fits for my tonal needs.

[BobaFret]

Thanks guys, I usually follow threads instead of creating my own. I've been looking for another 112 and this has been a great read. They have some of the Berg HD112 at a local store so I can check that out.

I must admit, I kinda like the Baer just because nobody will know what it is. I'm just too poor to be buying stuff I can't try out first.

[SpinyNorman]

Originally Posted by BobaFret

I'm just too poor to be buying stuff I can't try out first.

That's one of the benefits of buying used gear. Your dollar travels a lot further, and if you stick with the reputable brands, it's usually not much effort to flip the gear if it's not exactly what you wanted.

[GRoberts]

Originally Posted by KJung

...The Bergs are, of course awesome, and will be deeper, smoother, and more crisp, with a much more relaxed upper mid response than the Baer (or the AE210)... just what IMO you wouldn't really want with the Orange or Aguilar type heads.IMO!

Ken, I did a 500 person corporate show Saturday night using the Orange TB500 amp and my Berg AE410. Never in my life have I ever had better bass sound. That simple.

But my shows typically do not require ther Berg AE410, nor do I want to lift it when its way overkill. So I am wanting a 1x12 cab (pair) that gives me modular portability ands sound great when I play small, but steps UP when the band gets kicking and keeps me just as happy.

PS: buying one of each and trying them out and selling the one that doesn't win ...that actually makes sense ...if i had that kind of discretionary cash. But the holidays take a toll and I am funding a big 50th BDay bash for my woman in early January. Need some high dollar corporate shows to come along!

[KJung]

Originally Posted by GRoberts

Ken, I did a 500 person corporate show Saturday night using the Orange TB500 amp and my Berg AE410. Never in my life have I ever had better bass sound. That simple.

But my shows typically do not require ther Berg AE410, nor do I want to lift it when its way overkill. So I am wanting a 1x12 cab (pair) that gives me modular portability ands sound great when I play small, but steps UP when the band gets kicking and keeps me just as happy.

If you want a 112 that gives you a similar vibe to the AE410, it would be the Baer ML112 all the way.

I too simply LOVED the tone of my AE410 and Streamliner900 with my VP5. Simply wonderful, but got tired of schelpping the 410, and was looking for a bit more true, open low end (even with the wallup of the Streamliner, the AE410 'is what it is' down low0. IMO, the Bear stack will give you all that you loved about the AE410 (punchy, articulate, loud) and none of the bad (a bit attenuated deep down low, somewhat heavy for a neo410, and a bit 'low' for those who like to hear some mids pounding in their ear when standing close to the cab)

The Berg HD210 would have very little in common with the AE410 IMO. Of course, two of the original 'horizontal' AE210's (if you can find them) give you 90% of the wallup of the AE410 in a modular package.

[GRoberts]

Originally Posted by KJung

If you want a 112 that gives you a similar vibe to the AE410, it would be the Baer ML112 all the way.

I too simply LOVED the tone of my AE410 and Streamliner900 with my VP5. Simply wonderful, but got tired of schelpping the 410, and was looking for a bit more true, open low end (even with the wallup of the Streamliner, the AE410 'is what it is' down low0. IMO, the Bear stack will give you all that you loved about the AE410 (punchy, articulate, loud) and none of the bad (a bit attenuated deep down low, somewhat heavy for a neo410, and a bit 'low' for those who like to hear some mids pounding in their ear when standing close to the cab)

The Berg HD210 would have very little in common with the AE410 IMO. Of course, two of the original 'horizontal' AE210's (if you can find them) give you 90% of the wallup of the AE410 in a modular package.

Very quickly narrowing it down to the Baer then! Thanks Ken! Maybe I'll try one Baer ML112 first and use it on my small gigs to break it in. My AE410 isn't going anywhere. I like it too much. When the job calls for it, the AE410 is the right tool for the job.

[nordyboy]

Originally Posted by GRoberts

Very quickly narrowing it down to the Baer then! Thanks Ken! Maybe I'll try one Baer ML112 first and use it on my small gigs to break it in. My AE410 isn't going anywhere. I like it too much. When the job calls for it, the AE410 is the right tool for the job.

I sometimes think that I miss my AE 410 but everyone I crank those ml's I cannot stop smiling.
Being modular I now have the same consistent sound wherever I go, just on varying scales depending on how many cabs I take. Go on you know you want them, pick up the phone to Roger and give him your card details!

[KJung]

Originally Posted by nordyboy

I sometimes think that I miss my AE 410 but everyone I crank those ml's I cannot stop smiling.
Being modular I now have the same consistent sound wherever I go, just on varying scales depending on how many cabs I take. Go on you know you want them, pick up the phone to Roger and give him your card details!

While I eventually tired of the AE410 after many years of gigging it (my primary gigging cab is the wonderful AE212), I agree that the ML112 has much in common with that cab, and two of them would EASILY keep up with the kick of the AE410.

Again, if I didn't have my second generation AE210 (the more refined, vertical model), I'd definitely own a single ML112 (I'm not a fan of modular rigs myself... I have a small cab that I love for small gigs, and a larger cab I love for larger gigs!). The AE210(II) and ML112 have much in common. I slightly prefer the AE210, but could be quite happy with the ML112!

[baileyboy]

Originally Posted by SpinyNorman

Given that I primary play P-basses, and want a relatively "vintage" tone...

I mostly play a vintage P and love the deep, full sound when combined with 2112 Mesa Radiator Scouts, played through a Walkabout. I haven't tried the Powerhouse cabs, but have only heard great reviews. The Scouts have gotten me as close to vintage Ampeg sound as I can get without breaking my back.

[nordyboy]

Originally Posted by KJung

While I eventually tired of the AE410 after many years of gigging it, I agree that the ML112 has much in common with that cab, and two of them would EASILY keep up with the kick of the AE410.

Again, if I didn't have my second generation AE210 (the more refined, vertical model), I'd definitely own a single ML112 (I'm not a fan of modular rigs myself... I have a small cab that I love for small gigs, and a larger cab I love for larger gigs!). The AE210(II) and ML112 have much in common. I slightly prefer the AE210, but could be quite happy with the ML112!

I think that if I still had my vertical ae 210 then I would be looking for a second one, but now I have the ml's I am appreciating the extra lows that they provide.
The cab I miss most of all is the HD 212 which is slightly ahead of the HS 410 imho, unfortunately both of those cabs tip the scales the wrong way but sound amazing. I love the sound of ceramic but am torn away by the portability of neo, with a bit of high mid cut I am tonally right there though.
My music room is not as big as Toms! So I can't keep them all.