Roscoe set-up and intonation

[Shiveringbass]

Originally Posted by Active Reasoner

Hey Shiveringbass,

Just a line to let you know you're not alone.
I've had my Roscoe for over 3 years,
and I too, have had to adjust my Roscoe's truss rod
every winter and spring.
My Roscoe lives in my basement,
and it gets really cold down there in the winter.
The cold makes the maple contract so much,
I can feel the ends of the frets along the edge of the neck.
But it only takes a quarter turn rod adjustment,
to get the action back where I have it set.
I don't consider the neck unstable,
it's just reacting to an extreme temperature change.

Hello Active Reasoner,

Thanks for your word. I had the same problem of fret hurting but it's OK now.

When I say unstable, it was not for those season adjustments.

Sometime, the neck will move with only 1 or 2 degres difference which arrives very often when you play in pubs or clubs.
You leave home with a perfectly set instrument and you finaly play with some important buzz or too much tension in the strings in the evening when the gig time comes.


Regards

[ThePerfectBass]

HAHAHA!!! Lightning DOES indeed strike, no?!

Ok, so I can't afford to send you a new Roscoe...even IF we win... But email me your t-shirt size and shipping address and I'll send you a free TPB t-shirt and PICTURE of a brand new Roscoe bass as a consolation prize today!

I'd hardly say that the game will be "easy"... Although OSU's schedule is highly questionable, they are still a good football team. They are healthy, and unfortunately we are not.

If we can get our starters healthy for the game, I think we'll be favored to win, but with a small spread...maybe 7-10 points.

I'm still a bit shocked that we made it!

To make it all better, our new Director of Sales, Sean Morrissey is from Cleveland and a OSU DIE-HARD! He's already talking smack!

Originally Posted by Gard

I told him that was a BAD IDEA...



...however, they still have to beat OSU (which they SHOULD easily do) for the deal to be sealed...

...any comment, James?

[Gard]

Originally Posted by ThePerfectBass

HAHAHA!!! Lightning DOES indeed strike, no?!

Ok, so I can't afford to send you a new Roscoe...even IF we win... But email me your t-shirt size and shipping address and I'll send you a free TPB t-shirt and PICTURE of a brand new Roscoe bass as a consolation prize today!

I'd hardly say that the game will be "easy"... Although OSU's schedule is highly questionable, they are still a good football team. They are healthy, and unfortunately we are not.

If we can get our starters healthy for the game, I think we'll be favored to win, but with a small spread...maybe 7-10 points.

I'm still a bit shocked that we made it!

To make it all better, our new Director of Sales, Sean Morrissey is from Cleveland and a OSU DIE-HARD! He's already talking smack!

I was watching the announcement show, and was totally shocked when LSU didn't show up in the Sugar Bowl, I had pegged them for that one. When they weren't there, I thought maybe they got passed over completely for a BCS berth! I'm utterly blown away.

That said, Sean is going to be one very sad boy the day after that game, if LSU is healthy on the field by then. I doubt they'll be within 10....

[CrashClint]

Originally Posted by ThePerfectBass

HAHAHA!!! Lightning DOES indeed strike, no?!

Ok, so I can't afford to send you a new Roscoe...even IF we win... But email me your t-shirt size and shipping address and I'll send you a free TPB t-shirt and PICTURE of a brand new Roscoe bass as a consolation prize today!

James, you are a good sport and I would love a T-shirt from "The Perfect Bass".

I guess making friends with that VooDoo woman named Phyllis during the Bourbon Bowl last year paid-off.

I guess there are two loves in my life, big city living and a voodoo woman named Phyllis, Cao - Roberto

from the classic Water Boy.

[ThePerfectBass]

On the way Clint!

Peace!

[Gtrslngr]

I've got all 5 saddles out as far as they will go on my LG3005 and its still a bit sharp when fretted on the 12th fret while the open string or 12th fret harmonic are tuned. Anyone else ever encounter this? It's only out a little and I thought about maybe trying shorter screws to pull saddles back more, but it just doesn't seem like I should have to do that. The spring on the saddle of B string is pulled back till its sqeezed flat between saddle and back of Bridge.

[JOME77]

Originally Posted by Gtrslngr

I've got all 5 saddles out as far as they will go on my LG3005 and its still a bit sharp when fretted on the 12th fret while the open string or 12th fret harmonic are tuned. Anyone else ever encounter this? It's only out a little and I thought about maybe trying shorter screws to pull saddles back more, but it just doesn't seem like I should have to do that. The spring on the saddle of B string is pulled back till its sqeezed flat between saddle and back of Bridge.

I've had to cut off the saddle screws several times for various basses that utilize the Hip Shot bridge (and other style bridges that don't thread all of the way thru the saddle).
Not a big deal. I typically put the screw into a vise, clamping down on the threaded portion of the screw that I'm removing. Make as clean a cut as you can and then clean up the end of the screw via a small file. I use a nut with the same threads as the saddle to help clean up the threads on the screw and prevent damaging the threads on the saddle.

[Gtrslngr]

Originally Posted by JOME77

I've had to cut off the saddle screws several times for various basses that utilize the Hip Shot bridge (and other style bridges that don't thread all of the way thru the saddle).
Not a big deal. I typically put the screw into a vise, clamping down on the threaded portion of the screw that I'm removing. Make as clean a cut as you can and then clean up the end of the screw via a small file. I use a nut with the same threads as the saddle to help clean up the threads on the screw and prevent damaging the threads on the saddle.

Thanks Joe,
Thats about what I expected but I'm a little paranoid about cutting screws that I can't seem to find replacements for. I looked at ACE and Home Depot yesterday and I could not find a match. I did stick some washers on a couple of them and that did make it possible to shorten screw length a little which eabled me to dial in intonation. I would perfer to not leave the washers. Any idea about the screw size??
Thanks,
Mike

[Gard]

Mike -

Joe's dead on the money. There are times here at the shop when we need to cut a screw down to fit for intonation. As for size, let me know if you need replacements, I will help you out with those.

[Gtrslngr]

Originally Posted by Gard

Mike -

Joe's dead on the money. There are times here at the shop when we need to cut a screw down to fit for intonation. As for size, let me know if you need replacements, I will help you out with those.

Cool. As you already know, I don't live to far away. I'm playing out this week and I would freak if I had to leave the Roscoe behind over a messed up screw. What hours are you guys typically open and entertaining visitors. I'm in Hendersonville now and lately I just stay too stinkin busy. I'll be driving through Greensboro again tomorrow, but I'm not sure I'll have time to stop. Even with making my own truss rod wrench and cuttin screws, my Roscoe is still amazing me beyond words.
Thanks,
Mike

[Gard]

Mike -

PM on the way....

[LO_bass]

i had the same issue with the same model (LG3005). I called Hipshot and they sent me replacement screws and springs free of charge right away.

Now its all perfect.

Good CS!

Originally Posted by Gtrslngr

I've got all 5 saddles out as far as they will go on my LG3005 and its still a bit sharp when fretted on the 12th fret while the open string or 12th fret harmonic are tuned. Anyone else ever encounter this? It's only out a little and I thought about maybe trying shorter screws to pull saddles back more, but it just doesn't seem like I should have to do that. The spring on the saddle of B string is pulled back till its sqeezed flat between saddle and back of Bridge.

[improvpwnd]

As some of you know I am a brand new Roscoe owner. I love my instrument, but its not perfect yet.

Since I got it, the high C has been quite a bit buzzy all over the fretboard.
The other strings could definitely have lower action and intonation is barely OK--notes are sharp 10-25 cents fretted at 12th and 24th frets.

I am experienced in performing setups. I do not want to mess with the bridge--at least just yet--but I have tightened the truss rod about a 1/4 turn (two 1/8 turns on different days). The action has gotten a bit better but the buzzing on the high C has worsened as well. I am thinking about putting on some D'Addarios EXL's (I don't know what I got from the factory, but the ball ends of the strings are gold, not colored like D'Addarios) and seeing if that helps or adjusting from there. Any advice specific to Roscoe SKB 3006's I should know about before going any further? Like I said, I am experienced performing set ups, but all of what I know is 12 years of trial & error, plus 8 years of reading Talkbass... I do not have any proper measuring tools--everything is done by sight and feel... Should I place a Stewart MacDonald order first?

[ThePerfectBass]

Hehe... Yes, if you are interested in setting up your own bass, I HIGHLY recommend Dan Erlewine's Repair Series that StewMac offers... I'd also invest in their basic setup kit. That will get you everything you need to have a good handle on what you are doing and the tools to do it properly.

Addressing your problem directly, by tightening the truss rod, you are effectively placing the strings closer to the frets. So if you're already having fret buzz, you are just making that worse by not adjusting the bridge at the same time. Remember tightening straightens and can even pull your neck into backbow. Loosening the truss allows the strings to take a better bite and gives you more relief in the neck.

Intonation is a simple adjustment on the bridge saddles... Move the saddle closer to the neck to make the note sharper and farther towards the tail of the bass to make it flatter.

While Keith and Co do a great job on their setups, I immediately adjusted the D and G strings on both all of the Roscoes that I've owned as they tend to put these 2 strings a little closer to the frets than I prefer. I like my strings to get just a tiny bit closer to the frets as you go from Low B to G. My preferece is 6-8 64ths of an inch of height at the 12th fret on the B and 4-6 64ths on the G at the 12th. You may just need to raise those up a little at the bridge...

Peace!

[improvpwnd]

Originally Posted by ThePerfectBass

Hehe... Yes, if you are interested in setting up your own bass, I HIGHLY recommend Dan Erlewine's Repair Series that StewMac offers... I'd also invest in their basic setup kit. That will get you everything you need to have a good handle on what you are doing and the tools to do it properly.

Addressing your problem directly, by tightening the truss rod, you are effectively placing the strings closer to the frets. So if you're already having fret buzz, you are just making that worse by not adjusting the bridge at the same time. Remember tightening straightens and can even pull your neck into backbow. Loosening the truss allows the strings to take a better bite and gives you more relief in the neck.

Intonation is a simple adjustment on the bridge saddles... Move the saddle closer to the neck to make the note sharper and farther towards the tail of the bass to make it flatter.

While Keith and Co do a great job on their setups, I immediately adjusted the D and G strings on both all of the Roscoes that I've owned as they tend to put these 2 strings a little closer to the frets than I prefer. I like my strings to get just a tiny bit closer to the frets as you go from Low B to G. My preferece is 6-8 64ths of an inch of height at the 12th fret on the B and 4-6 64ths on the G at the 12th. You may just need to raise those up a little at the bridge...

Peace!

Cool. Thanks for the info. I understand what tightening/loosening the truss rod does. I understand how to correct the intonation using the saddles. The ONLY string buzzing is the high C, so my plan is to tighten the truss rod until I get the action where I want it. By that time my high C should be VERY buzzy, but then I would raise it--alone--at the saddles.
Will adjusting the truss rod affect my intonation dramatically/a little/at all?

[Gard]

Sorry for the late arrival...

...OK, couple issues:

No, adjusting the trussrod won't have much of an effect on intonation (depending on how MUCH you adjust it....that is...).

Try lowering your neck pickup a bit, that may help. I'm finding that the Nords are very STRONG magnetically, and that can indeed affect the setup at times...they just pull the string closer to the fingerboard!

[improvpwnd]

Originally Posted by Gard

Try lowering your neck pickup a bit, that may help. I'm finding that the Nords are very STRONG magnetically, and that can indeed affect the setup at times...they just pull the string closer to the fingerboard!

Tried that. It went down a bit on the treble side, but it was pretty close to being bottomed out. It didn't make any noticeable difference to the action of the high C.

I've now got it very close to perfect intonation. Next, I'm going to try raising the saddles on the G and C strings since they are super buzzy from straightening the neck, but the other 4 strings seem to be just about right.

[improvpwnd]

I have noticed that there is slightly more relief in my neck on the low strings side than on the treble. When I 'sight' the neck for relief, the high C is very parallel to the neck, but I can see a slight back bow on the low B side. Is this normal? Would getting lighter strings on the low end, thus decreasing the tension on that side help?

[ThePerfectBass]

Judging relief by sight is tricky... Do you have a straight edge you can put on it? I'd make sure that what you are diagnosing is 100% accurate before changing strings up...especially if you are happy with the tone and feel of the gauges that you have on it now...

If you put a straight edge on it and you're getting different measurements on the treble and bass sides, you might want to give Roscoe a call... It probably won't be something we can diagnose on the forum and talking about it in person will be a little easier to troubleshooot.

Peace!

[improvpwnd]

Originally Posted by ThePerfectBass

Judging relief by sight is tricky... Do you have a straight edge you can put on it? I'd make sure that what you are diagnosing is 100% accurate before changing strings up...especially if you are happy with the tone and feel of the gauges that you have on it now...

If you put a straight edge on it and you're getting different measurements on the treble and bass sides, you might want to give Roscoe a call... It probably won't be something we can diagnose on the forum and talking about it in person will be a little easier to troubleshooot.

Peace!

OK, at second sight, I can barely tell a difference in relief when hold 1st and 24th fret. I will get access to my straight edge this weekend and will let you know. Thanks for the help!