Another fretless thread.. Sunbeams, TIs, Nylons....?

wateroftyne · #1 08-12-2009, 10:31 AM

Hi all

I'm doing a bit of research for my next string purchase. I've read every thread there is, and I still can't decide...!

I have a fretless P with an ebony board. I usually use La Bella FL flats on all my basses, but I find myself wanting a little more life & definition on the fretless.

It sounds great solo'd and at low volumes, but when the mix gets busy it can get a little lost. I don't need zing or sparkle.. just definition and growl.

Here's an example of my tone:

http://www.jollybeggars.co.uk/stuff/motrr.mp3

I really like it, but you can see how the character could get lost when the mix is a little denser.

So, which of the following shall I try?

1) TIs
2) Sunbeams (which gauge?)
3) Lighter-gauge LaBellas
4) Tapewounds
5) None of the above?

Thanks in advance!

Billnc · #2 08-12-2009, 10:37 AM

I like TIJF's. They may sound a bit more upright like than you want. Others seem to swear by Chromes. I also like DR Flats but have not put them on the FL yet. They've been described to me as in between Chromes and TI's. I'd forget tape unless you're really after tubby sounding. I think Gilmour used a combination of P bass and Rotosound flats for PF stuff (Roger didn't play fretless)

jibreel · #3 08-12-2009, 12:27 PM

TI jazz rounds are great also. More of a subtle round wound.

Way low on the zing but more than flats.

john-boro · #4 08-12-2009, 12:55 PM

Frankly, I love your tone as it is!

Nylon's are not the place to go for definition on a fretless.

I use TI flats on my corvette fretless (different pickup config may come into play) but I find I have even more of a getting lost in the mix problem than you seem to have. I wouldn't go for those from what you're saying.

Rounds are what you want for definition and bite on a fretless, and of those I'd say TI jazz rounds would be the softest sounding and least noisy - retaining a fretless character with just a bit more of an assertive sound. They're what I'm going to try next anyway. The stainless steel warwick's my corvette came with are not good.

BigOldHarry · #5 08-12-2009, 01:07 PM

I have never used flats on a fretless... okay, not since my very first fretless that CAME with flats... but I just prefer the feel of roundwounds, and you can always turn the tone down to deaden the sound...

Mastermold · #6 08-13-2009, 01:04 AM

I thought I'd love TI flats on my fretless since I loved them on my fretted basses, but after a few months I wasn't diggin it so I pulled them off and tried DR Sunbeams. The Sunbeams gave more growl off the fretboard, and I've had them on ever since. But you may not want the same tone I did so as they say, YMMV.

wateroftyne · #7 08-13-2009, 01:24 AM

Thanks all.

At the moment, I'm tempted by the Sunbeams. My tone is more URBy than Jaco, but then there's no point having an URBy tone if it's lost in the mix..

I think the Sunbeams are where it's at...

kesslari · #8 08-13-2009, 01:35 AM

Sunbeams work nicely on my Gary Willis fretless.

bongomania · #9 08-13-2009, 01:38 AM

I like Elixirs for fretless with growl. I'm about to try some SIT Silencers, I'll let you know how that goes.

cripula · #10 08-13-2009, 01:50 AM

I just tried TI JRs on my 5 string Sadowsky fretless (alder/ebony/nordy fat stacks). I had high hopes as I love them on an old Jazz of mine.

Weren't happening. The G and D sounded really nice, the other 3 didn't make it. The bass wasn't speaking, and the B was especially not good at all.

Off they came and on went a set of DR Sunbeams, 40-125. Major improvement, bass sounds amazing. Once the newness wears off they'll be even better.

Try the Sunbeams first...

JTE · #11 08-13-2009, 10:34 AM

WOT!!!

This is John Evans (formerly) from FDP!!

Hey, I like that sound on the recording, but I understand your concern for getting lost in a bigger mix. I keep trying different strings on my fretless basses, having used DR Hi-Beams, TI flats, TI rounds, D'Addario nickles, etc. I keep coming back to DR Sunbeams, but I just put a broken-in set of GHS Precision Flats on my Fender mongrel fretless, and they work very well too (they came on my Lakland fretless so I swapped 'em when I put the Sunbeams on the Lakland).

What I like about the GHS (same as the Lakland Joe Osborn set) is that they have a definite note in them, which I always felt lacking in most flats, specifically the LaBellas I've used decades ago. LaBella flats had a great thump, but the note definition could get lost. TI's have a great note, and a nice thump, but not really that traditional flatwound character in the low mids.

So, I'd suggest you try a set of DR Sunbeams to see if the rounds work for you, and if you still are seeking the flatwound character, then try a set of GHS Precision Flats.

wateroftyne · #12 08-14-2009, 03:42 AM

Hello John!

How are you? Nice to hear from you, and thanks for the advice (everyone else, too).

I love the sound of the La Bellas FLs, but when the mix gets busy all those great characteristics and nuances get lost.

The Sunbeams are tempting, and top of the list, but I think I'd really miss the flatwound character.

I'm beginning to wonder wether lighter gauge La Bella flats might do it...

Ryan Mohr · #13 08-15-2009, 08:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wateroftyne

Hello John!

How are you? Nice to hear from you, and thanks for the advice (everyone else, too).

I love the sound of the La Bellas FLs, but when the mix gets busy all those great characteristics and nuances get lost.

The Sunbeams are tempting, and top of the list, but I think I'd really miss the flatwound character.

I'm beginning to wonder wether lighter gauge La Bella flats might do it...

Have you considered GHS Pressurewounds? Those and La Bella black nylon tapewounds are at the top of my list. Check out this video: http://www.ghsstrings.com/ Stay at the home page, click on bass beneath the videos, the scroll down to pressurewound overview. He plays a fretless L-2000 halfway through the video.

wateroftyne · #14 08-16-2009, 06:53 AM

Thanks, Ryan.. I'll take a look at that!

Just out of interest, here's a few MP3 clips of the tone I'm going for. The bass player is using a fretless P, and it's one of the greatest bass tones ever, IMO. It sounds great on headphones.

Clip 1

Clip 2

Clip 3

I'm thinking this is more 'flat' than 'round'.. would you all agree?

Ryan Mohr · #15 08-16-2009, 07:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wateroftyne

Thanks, Ryan.. I'll take a look at that!

Just out of interest, here's a few MP3 clips of the tone I'm going for. The bass player is using a fretless P, and it's one of the greatest bass tones ever, IMO. It sounds great on headphones.

Clip 1

Clip 2

Clip 3

I'm thinking this is more 'flat' than 'round'.. would you all agree?

That bass tone is great. It sounds like flats to me, but there is still a lot of mwah going on.

MarkusBass · #16 08-16-2009, 07:29 PM

Sunbeams! I have them on my Lakland JOCS fretless, and love em! I think they're 105-50

TomB · #17 08-16-2009, 09:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wateroftyne

Thanks, Ryan.. I'll take a look at that!

Just out of interest, here's a few MP3 clips of the tone I'm going for. The bass player is using a fretless P, and it's one of the greatest bass tones ever, IMO. It sounds great on headphones.

Clip 1

Clip 2

Clip 3

I'm thinking this is more 'flat' than 'round'.. would you all agree?

Yes, I would agree. But isn't that a pick at work? If so, that seems to make a big difference in the attack. Beyond that I think it's a high-mid heavy EQ and very up-front in the mix. Try those 3 changes to your own setup and see what you get (assuming you have any interest in using a pick).

wateroftyne · #18 08-17-2009, 06:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TomB

Yes, I would agree. But isn't that a pick at work? If so, that seems to make a big difference in the attack. Beyond that I think it's a high-mid heavy EQ and very up-front in the mix. Try those 3 changes to your own setup and see what you get (assuming you have any interest in using a pick).

Cheers, Tom.. he's actually using his fingers!

I'll try the EQ thing a bit, too.

BassBod · #19 08-18-2009, 06:07 AM

I'd suggest TI's (if you can get on with the relaxed feel/guage) or Sunbeams (let them die down for a month). The other great string is the Labella black plastic flat - odd heavyish guage..bit harder to play on but a very very good sound which stays consistent for years. They are far better than the Roto version..and the heavier guage stops them wobbling around too much.

Good luck

jasper383 · #20 08-18-2009, 10:07 AM

How about flats with a little more brightness. In my experience, La Bellas tend toward the dark end of the flats spectrum.

How about Chromes or Sadowsky flats. Both have more upper mids amd a bit more brightness to my ears than La Bellas.