Consequences of NOT cutting

[giacomini]

I have a bad OCD case everytime I see a pic of a headstock with strings badly wrapped or over wrapped around the posts...



No problem to have 6, 7, 8 turns around the post, just give the strings a few pulls so it won't get out of tune right after you set them up and get them to pitch.

[danomite64]

Originally Posted by SBassman

Most baffling thread ever.

How can you possibly not cut the strings to proper length?

It should go In the hole of the tuner post, with then a few winds, with winds never ever overlapping.

That can Only be achieved by cutting the strings.

You are wrong. Here's my bass with uncut Rotosounds on it.

[walterw]

Originally Posted by danomite64

You are wrong. Here's my bass with uncut Rotosounds on it.

huh.

well, those uncut rotos just happen to be a good length for fenders (i almost wish the G was longer for a few more wraps, and the E could get by with one or two fewer) but more to the point, your pic is textbook of what it should look like either way, which often means cutting the strings to get them to the right lengths to wind like you have so nicely done.

[khutch]

Originally Posted by danomite64

Yeah, I think one picture is worth how ever many words are in this post so far.

Ken

[Handyman]

Originally Posted by danomite64

You are wrong. Here's my bass with uncut Rotosounds on it.

Glad it works out for you. All four strings look pretty neatly wrapped. Really pretty piece of wood, too.

With some combinations of basses and particular strings, there just isn't enough room vertically on the tuning post to fit all the wraps of an uncut string without the overlapping. Think of the smaller diameter posts you find with some of the sealed tuners, like you'd find on a Carvin for example.

Even with cutting the strings, the low B on my Carvins often come pretty close to running out of room on the post. Never been an issue on my G&L with enormous diameter posts, though.

[Baird6869]

No idea why anyone wouldn't cut the strings to fit. Takes likely less time than not cutting (and dealing with extra string), sounds no different, looks better, is safe and doesn't change the stability of the string.

[Chico16]

I agree that it looks unprofessional. The times I've seen a bass player with a long piece of extra string length shooting out of the headstock I've either thought they were rookies, they had no idea how to restring a bass, or just that they looked unprofessional. Before I knew how to switch my own strings, I had some guy at a music store do it for me and he did it without cutting the string but he wrapped all of it around the tuning pegs. My E string was BARELY able to get in tune at the point where the tuners wouldn't turn anymore, so if the string would've been 1 or 2 centimeters longer I would've never been able to have a standard tuned E string! But of course in that time I didn't know any better!

[Ezmar]

Man, this thread has opened my eyes so much. When I burst strung a bass, I just assumed that that hole was there to stick the string into so there was no loose end. You stick it in there, wind up to pitch, bam, that's it. I had no idea that people somehow left string sticking out even with this GENIUS system (I came from guitar, by the way). And as far as overlapping wraps went, I figured that as long as it wasn't slipping (which I've never had happen), it was fine. I never thought of cutting it before winding, I guess I just figured that the pegs were designed so that it didn't matter how long the string was since the end was taken care of anyway.

The more you know, I guess.

[BawanaRik]

Safety. Your odds of putting some ones eye out with strings hanging is much higher than with Red Ryder.

And maybe consideration. How many guitards use flying string ends as a weapon

[Smilodon]

I always cut down strings. One of my basses is a headless so no choice there, but I also like to have fairly even amounts of string on each post.

But then again, I also align the ball ends so that they face the same way...

[khutch]

Originally Posted by danomite64

You are wrong. Here's my bass with uncut Rotosounds on it.

Originally Posted by BawanaRik

Safety. Your odds of putting some ones eye out with strings hanging is much higher than with Red Ryder.

And maybe consideration. How many guitards use flying string ends as a weapon

Take a look at danomite64's picture above of uncut strings on a Warmoth bass. What do you find to be unsafe or inconsiderate about this picture?!

Ken

[hoketus]

Originally Posted by joelb79

A local Jazz Professor with a masters in Jazz teaches players to put as much string on the E and A posts of the 4-in-line headstocks so that the break angle is harder against the nut. I would not argue with him at all to this point, that a good angle on the nut helps the string tone and pitch. So are you saying that this Master of Jazz looks like a lazy bass tard? I'm not so sure about that. his posts look neat and his finger dexterity is amazing.. he's not gonna look lazy at all.

I have never seen pitch issues with more string on the post. Perhaps when there is a temperature variance because the more mass means longer warming times (going cold to warm). But I've also never left a set on long enough to see them stretched to the bone so perhaps my string changing times have something to do with this.

A few years back, there was a major debate about this. The argument being that 'greater break angle = punchier tone'. Seems nitpicky, no?

[BawanaRik]

Originally Posted by khutch

Take a look at danomite64's picture above of uncut strings on a Warmoth bass. What do you find to be unsafe or inconsiderate about this picture?!

Ken

This pic, nothing. Hundreds of others, plenty. If this guys whole life is like that I envy his sense of order.

[62Jazzbass]

Originally Posted by walterw

cut and wrap neatly, 3 or 4 wraps down the post with no overlap (or on a fender A string as many as will fit neatly, so as to increase the angle over the nut).

anything else is amateur hour.

This.

[4dog]

Cut em

[SoVeryTired]

Originally Posted by khutch

Take a look at danomite64's picture above of uncut strings on a Warmoth bass. What do you find to be unsafe or inconsiderate about this picture?!

Ken

I think there's two issues getting crossed here - cutting strings, and not putting the ends in the holes. The Warmoth bass is uncut but neatly finished. I think the 'safety issue' is where people are thinking of loose string ends sticking out from the headstock.

[khutch]

Originally Posted by SoVeryTired

I think there's two issues getting crossed here - cutting strings, and not putting the ends in the holes. The Warmoth bass is uncut but neatly finished. I think the 'safety issue' is where people are thinking of loose string ends sticking out from the headstock.

Yes, you are right and that was my point, perhaps too subtly made. Many who have commented here are assuming that uncut strings mean ends not stowed properly with the result that the bass headstock looks like a cat o' nine tails - less 4 or 5 tails! And with good reason since many guitarists do that and we've all seen plenty of pictures here of bass headstocks done that way too. I think that BawanaRik may have missed the fact that the pictured Warmoth headstock had uncut strings. So the issue is string dress, not whether you trim them or not.

If the comments about break angles at the nut hold water (I've no opinion on that) then the untrimmed string is the best string because the "E" and "A" strings benefit from the extra windings and the other two clearly are in no great need of trimming anyway. On an inline headstock anyway....

Ken

[danomite64]

Originally Posted by BawanaRik

This pic, nothing. Hundreds of others, plenty. If this guys whole life is like that I envy his sense of order.

Heh, my life is WAY messier than my headstocks ever will be!

[walterw]

Originally Posted by khutch

If the comments about break angles at the nut hold water (I've no opinion on that) then the untrimmed string is the best string because the "E" and "A" strings benefit from the extra windings and the other two clearly are in no great need of trimming anyway. On an inline headstock anyway....

y'know, there's a guy selling tuners that have threaded grooves on the posts to ensure the wraps go all the way down; whether you buy that idea or not, he posted a youtube clip that showed how wrapping styles actually change the twisting of the headstock!
he rigged up a bass to a dial indicator that showed the slightest movement or twisting of the headstock, then restrung different ways; when string with the strings leaving from the middle of the posts, the headstock had a lot of twist from the extra leverage, and when he plucked a string it flapped back and forth like a diving board!

he maintains that this twisting and flapping is a big cause of dead spots.

using his new keys which forced the strings right to the bottom of the posts, there was much less twisting and much less excess headstock vibration.

the upshot is that while the warmoth headstock in the picture is nicely done, we'd be better off making sure that all 4 strings made it to the very bottom of the posts! in this case it would just mean loosening the strings a little and pushing the wraps down to the bottom.

(edit: found it!

this guy obviously knows what he's talking about, but his videos are terrible! anyway he's really on to something; check my first link at 2:39. unfortunately for him, what he's trying to sell can be accomplished with any straight-post tuner by ensuring that the last wrap is at the very bottom of the post.)

[4dog]

Ok cut em then poke em.