Detuning on a Dingwall?!?!?

Entonem · #1 05-24-2007, 11:25 AM

OK Im about to get my new Dingawall Afterburner I either today or tomorrow. My band plays in two tunings, drop A (b down to A) and Drop C (CGCF for the four string config) How should I best go about getting good playability, while keeping clear tone (not muddy and not all finger noise) and at the same time not compromising playability (no extra high action) at normal tunings. I know that sounds like a lot to ask, currently my spector euro 5 has high gauge strings on it with high action which is harder to play (exept the low b is where I want it for drop A) and the notes sound muddier all fundamental). My hope is that with the fanned fret system (allowing the 37" B string) I will be able to get what I want, at least with the drop A tuning without compromising. Any suggestions on what I can do to achieve my goals?

BruceWane · #2 05-24-2007, 12:34 PM

If your main concern is to have an open A or an open C available, I think I'd put a Hipshot de-tuner on the B string and set it up to switch between A an C. Leave the other strings in standard tuning and just work out your fretting. But that's just 'cause I can't stand bands that take a few minutes between songs to get their tuning-of-the-moment together - it's incredibly unprofessional.

Entonem · #3 05-24-2007, 04:02 PM

I have thought of the hipshot for the low b to move to an A, but that really doesn't solve any of the questions of setup that I put out there. As for my bands tunings, I am fully capable of working out how to play songs in standard tuning, however that is neither practical nor relevant as I am using these tunings to achieve the tonal qualities that are only achieved using alternate tunings. If you want you can listen to my band to get a better idea of what I'm talking about. I'm sure your basing your opinion on your past experience but how does putting my band down help me?

fullrangebass · #4 05-24-2007, 04:07 PM

In few of the bands I play with I tune half a step down and the Dingwall(s) hold their tone. Sometimes I even use the de-tuner and I hit a low Ab (below B) and still it's not muddy (you need cabs that go low to reproduce those frequencies. So low A is no problem. For the rest of the songs (Drop C tuning) you have 2 options: either get a 4 string Dingwall to play on (paying attention to the string gauges, not using the standard 4 string set) or (even better) learn the songs in Dropped A; the latter should be no problem considering a Dingwall 5 string

greenboy · #5 05-24-2007, 07:27 PM

You have multiple scale lengths in your favor. Check this thread out that's right here in the neighborhood:

Heavy Gauge for Drop C# Aggressive Player

You'll see on page 1 there a link to the D'Addario string tension guide, and discussion of what it means to any brand of strings. The same link has my spreadsheet which does the math for various scale lengths - which is essentially what the Dingwall has, yes no?

Page 2 of that discussion has a help post on how to use the spreadsheet if you don't understand it.

Roland777 · #6 05-25-2007, 05:20 AM

My "35 BTB555 works just fine with a .130 tuned to A, in my opinion. You just have to learn to play with a lighter touch. Once you do that, it's all green. Thus, in my opinion, you can use anything from .130 and above to tune to A on your Dingwall!

Entonem · #7 05-25-2007, 07:44 AM

my current bass has .130 for the low b, and actually (youd never know it by listening to our recordings) but I do have a very light touch, the problem is we play a lot of fast notes in drop A and it can EASILY become mud central. To be honest it what Im looking for may be impossible but im hoping that it is with my dingwall. Thanks for everyones help, Ill go look at those pages now.

Roland777 · #8 05-25-2007, 08:12 AM

Ahahaha, you bulbasaur. No really, just go up to a .135 or .145 if you're having issues with the .130. That should be fine. Note that the .145 loses some dynamics.

XansNiceSweater · #9 05-25-2007, 08:46 AM

FYI, I've played a Dingwall with a De-Tuner on it. Sounded and felt fine.

Entonem · #10 05-25-2007, 01:34 PM

roland you are the first person to recognize my band on this forum, I think I might cry...the problem with getting such thick gauge strings is that it cuts out a lot of the harmonics and can make going from the low B to upper strings awkward.

BruceWane · #11 05-25-2007, 02:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Entonem

I have thought of the hipshot for the low b to move to an A, but that really doesn't solve any of the questions of setup that I put out there. As for my bands tunings, I am fully capable of working out how to play songs in standard tuning, however that is neither practical nor relevant as I am using these tunings to achieve the tonal qualities that are only achieved using alternate tunings. If you want you can listen to my band to get a better idea of what I'm talking about. I'm sure your basing your opinion on your past experience but how does putting my band down help me?

Geez, a little moody aren't we?

Dude, I'm not "putting your band down". And I didn't suggest that you couldn't work out fretting in standard tuning. If you can't accept a little constructive criticism, I'd suggest you abandon the music business ASAP.

I was just suggesting a solution that would achieve what you need, in a professional manner (i.e. quickly), as cheaply as possible. The only other way to switch tunings quickly is to have two basses, and even if you've got a roadie helping you switch, that's still going to take more time than flicking a Hipshot. And it's a hell of a lot more expensive.

As far as achieving your tonal qualities.......I understand doing that when you're recording. When you're recording, you have the luxury of taking all the time you want to tune and adjust your setup. But playing live, I seriously doubt that anyone is going to notice the subtle difference in tone between a note played on an open string and a fretted one. But they're definitely going to notice a lot of silence between songs while you're tuning.

Edited to add - since your Dingwall is going to have a zero fret, the difference in tonality between an open note and a fretted one is going to be practically nil.

BruceWane · #12 05-25-2007, 02:30 PM

....and FWIW, I've got an Afterburner I, and it'll do drop A beautifully with a .125 gauge string. In fact, it'll probably do all dropped tunings better than any other bass out there, since the scale lengths of all the strings except the G are longer.

Also, I can tell you that you definitely can put a Hipshot on the B string tuner, but not on the E - the layout of the tuners on the headstock won't allow it.

Roland777 · #13 05-26-2007, 05:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Entonem

roland you are the first person to recognize my band on this forum, I think I might cry...the problem with getting such thick gauge strings is that it cuts out a lot of the harmonics and can make going from the low B to upper strings awkward.

True about stringskipping and harmonics on the .145, but the .135 should work just fine. Seriously. I'm getting a .135 for my low A on the "35 right now, and the .130 worked just fine before! You should try it.