discuss: do today's string options render scale length moot?

[wideyes]

I'm genuinely interested to hear what TBers have to say about this. I've heard so many opinions about scale length affecting tone, tension, harmonics, etc.

It seems to me that there has been an explosion of string options in the market lately, which is a *godsend* to us picky bassists. My impression is that many of the arguments related to scale length are becoming less relevant as manufacturers figure out how to make a greater variety of strings to suit short or long scale, downtuning, custom gauge sets etc.

What say you?

[knuckle_head]

There is no escaping physics, and string design will only take you so far.

What you will find is that the baby steps we are taking will not truly demonstrate fully the advantages scale length and thinner gauges do to tone and playability. I would suggest that we'll need to go beyond 35/36" - in fact beyond 39/40" - to really have an understanding.

If E is it we're done. There are enough options in instrumentation and strings that near-any personal nuance can be realized. B and beyond is where scale length and gauge will prove itself out.

My 39/40" scale lengths have proven to me, near-all of my customers, and most who have played them that thinner gauges have an advantage in that the strings do not fight the job they are to do as much as thicker gauges must.

That said, my Quake scale lengths really only amount to a step-and-a-half - that means at E I physically do at .095 what most do at .105, and at B (depending on your approach) I can get away with a .125 as opposed to a .135. These are not enough of a difference in my opinion to speak to the benefits, though it certainly demonstrates improved nuance.

I expect I will know more when I can use a .135 for F# and a .105 for B - in a year's time I will know. Whether or not I will be believed is irrelevant and not at all the point. I just need to know.

[fretlessguy]

That, as they say, depends. There will always be a difference in how the scale length effects tone. But, the characteristcs of the different types of strings are usually the same across the board regardless scale; A flatwound will sound like a flat, etc. But the scale length will make a difference, may it be so slight.
One good thing: While short scale strings may be hard to find at the local shops, You can find them in all string types and gauges on the internet. So, we short scale fans have as many options as the longer scale players have.

[wideyes]

Originally Posted by knuckle_head

I would suggest that we'll need to go beyond 35/36" - in fact beyond 39/40" - to really have an understanding.

If E is it we're done. There are enough options in instrumentation and strings that near-any personal nuance can be realized. B and beyond is where scale length and gauge will prove itself out.

You raise an interesting point! I was thinking inside the relatively small box of 30"-36"ish. I do indeed love the idea of a longer scale and wish it were feasible for me to feel comfortable on (maybe with improved technique down the line).

I do feel with my own experience of shorter scales that currently you don't necessarily sacrifice anything anymore. The number of string gauges/tensions available seem more than enough to suit most needs. I'm seeing more and more 5 and 6 string shorties hitting the market and I celebrate that - I don't think all those luthiers are wrong about the feasibility of such instruments. Especially when we've got lovely products like Circle K in the marketplace

Granted, there are subtleties of tone to take into account. There will always be differences. But are they as great as they used to be?

[knuckle_head]

Originally Posted by wideyes

Granted, there are subtleties of tone to take into account. There will always be differences. But are they as great as they used to be?

With shorties the approach is to straddle the bass and standard guitar - you don't need nor necessarily want traditional bass tensions - so the question to my mind becomes are we okay where we are, or is there room for improvement.

Standard tunings are addressed quite well, but in my opinion it starts to unravel at B. String construction barely addresses this, and rigs fall quite short. If there is a place for bass at or below 30.87 Hz I believe there is a ways to go.

[ixlramp]

My experience is that scale length has a profound effect on tone that cannot be replicated by choice of string.

Originally Posted by knuckle_head

I expect I will know more when I can use a .135 for F# and a .105 for B - in a year's time I will know.

Interesting ... you'll be adding 5 frets to 34"? that's roughly 45".

[knuckle_head]

5 frets to 39.55" actually . . .

[JimmyM]

I stop at E 99.99999% of the time, and stop at B the other .00001%. I also love short scale basses. Yeah, scale length is moot to me

[ixlramp]

Originally Posted by knuckle_head

5 frets to 39.55" actually . . .

[wideyes]

Originally Posted by knuckle_head

5 frets to 39.55" actually . . .

Is this a testing instrument, or are you considering marketing such a thing?

[knuckle_head]

Originally Posted by wideyes

Is this a testing instrument, or are you considering marketing such a thing?

It will be a platform for the scale length of your choosing - likely no shorter than 36" - up to 55", and in a vertical/uprightish format.

I'll test the beegeebers out of the first true 55"

[TapyTap]

Sweet...