Jazz bass/flats vs rounds tension

[Wayne8]

I've been reading up on strings for several months now and I'm not really any closer to an answer than when I started so here's my post:

I've been thinking about trying flats on my MIM Jazz, mostly because I don't like the 'zing' I get with rounds and also there's a sound, I'm not quite sure how to describe it but I think it's like a high mid sound that I don't like about rounds. All I've tried so far are Fender 7150 (pure nickel rounds), 7250 (nickle plated rounds) and some Ernie Ball nickle plated rounds. Right now I've got the Fender pure nickles on and I can see how they might settle down eventually but there's still that tone about them that I don't really like. Sure, I can EQ it out but then I wind up with a very muted sound. And, like someone else posted, even if they eventually settled into a perfect sound, how long would they last before I had to put on a new set and have to wait for them to settle in again? So, I've been thinking flats. I like the idea of being able to play a single set for years. And before you say it, I have no problem spending the money for a good set of flats. My problem is, if I don't like them, I'm not going to be able to afford trying another and another until I find something I like. And I'm not going to buy a P either (I know the Jazz will never sound exactly like a P and I'm okay with that).

The Jazz has the stock pickups (which I'm not interested in changing) and I play through an Acoustic B200 combo. I play in church and also a classic rock/blues 4 piece band (drummer, me and two guitarists). Just an example of a tone I like (among many, many rock bassists) is Timothy B. Schmidt's tone with the Eagles.

The problem I have with the string reviews is that it's all subjective and folks don't always post what style music they play so you don't know if the strings being touted would fit with your style. I don't slap and don't care to. I just need my bass to sound more like the basses heard in blues and classic rock. And I know string noise is at least partially related to technique and I'm working on it.

Now, I've just been on Youtube listening to vids of folks playing flats on Jazzes and I've got to say the ones I liked best were Chromes and TI's. Most didn't say what kind of flats they were. A lot of the flats sounded too muted and others sounded like big, fat rubber bands. Maybe I'm not looking for the classic flats sound.

Now, here's my main question. I was reading a post earlier where someone said that what they liked about Sadowsky flats were that they were of a more 'normal' gauge and tension, allowing the person to switch back and forth between rounds and flats without much, if any, tweaking of the neck/saddles. I like the sound of that, however, I don't know what they sound like. I can do my own setups but I'm a little scared of truss rod adjustments (not that I can't do them but I've read about so many problems folks have had with them getting stuck or breaking and such that I'd rather not have to do it much).

Also, TI's are said to have extremely low tension, but is that compared to other flats or to rounds, too? I mean, how does the tension compare to say, Fender 7150ML's (pure nickle, 45-100)? And finally, how would the tension of the Chromes compare to the 7150's? Which of the three listed would you choose if you were me, based on what I've written above? Oh, and I play mostly finger-style.

I apologize for such a long post and I really have tried to figure this out on my own. Thanks in advance for any help you can give me.

[Slax]

I play mostly a P bass, and have used both Chromes and TIs. They both sound great. The Chromes are a bit higher tension where the TIs aren't. I like the TIs better in both tone variety and feel. The chromes I had are now on my backup instrument because they have the tone but the gauge and tension were higher. Don't think the tension is the difference between a lead pipe and a rubber band, it's not. It's actually much more subtle than I thought it would be when I first put on my TIs. (I was expecting rubber bands). The TIs seem to sit fine, w/o any technique adjustment period. You might need to adjust the truss rod a bit to give some relief, but mine it brought the strings to a perfect level. (My action was pretty high) Plus, even the lower gauge and tension (Though, not very pronounced) has had an easier time on my hands.

I'd suggest either. They're both great sounding strings.

[tomshepp]

Hey,
I have an old Jazz Bass that I use LaBella flats on. I have tried TI's and Chromes and probably a few others. MHO is the LaBellas are the perfect string for this bass and I'll never change them. They sort of fall right in between the TI's and Chromes. That is they have the nice tone of the TI's but the feel is not as soft. They aren't as bright to my ears as the Chromes and are not as stiff. As far as the Jazz Bass goes, the versatility of blending the pickups is the best part when you compare it to a Pbass. Of course the P is the classic old school sound, but there is something very cool about a Jazz with flats. Try the LaBella's let us know what you think.

[Wayne8]

Thanks guys. Do you remember which Labellas you used?

[mrhardy]

Wayne,

how did the pickup adjustments go for you?

I've used lots of flats on my MIM jazz.

Fenders
Labella's
Chromes
Roto's

They are all very good strings, and would work well. Like we discussed in the other thread, how they sound is dependent on overall setup. About the person who noted they did not have to change their saddle adjustment with a string change.

If your bass is setup correctly, and you like how it is playing then, usually, you should only need to reset the relief with a string tension change. A higher tension set will allow you to drop your action a bit as well in the final equation, if you wanted to.

With the MIM pickups being what they are, I've found that the Fenders and the Labella's provide a good workable bass tone.

The Labella's have a darker, more bottom ended personality then the Fenders. The Fenders have a bit more mids to them.

From what I know of your situation and what your looking for, I would go with the Labella's. You would have all the bottom your need, but could dial in as much top end as wanted.

I purchased my last set of Labella's from Elderly instruments. They have a good price on them, and fast shipping.

[Wayne8]

Hey mrhardy. I wound up at 10/64" on the neck and 7/64" on the bridge. Tried lower but lost a lot of volume. More minor adjustments may have sounded different but I couldn't tell so I just put it where you had yours and left it. Was about where I had mine to start with.

Mine came with a perfectly straight neck. I had buzz up at the first fret so I put a little relief in it (about the thickness of a business card) and I lowered the strings to what Roger Sadowsky calls low action (1/16" at the 12th fret on the G and 3/32" on the E). Plays great. So you're saying I might have to adjust the relief but the rest should stay the same?

I may go with the Labellas.

[mrhardy]

Originally Posted by Wayne8

So you're saying I might have to adjust the relief but the rest should stay the same?

I may go with the Labellas.

YES!

If you have worked your setup for all parametes, and have the bass setup to your liking. Then changing strings to a set with different tension will affect how much the neck is pulled into relief. Setting the neck to have the same relief as before you changed strings should keep the bass setup the same.

If you have gone to a higher tension set of strings, then you may be able to lower your action at this point, by a little bit.

Going further into this as a setup issue would require a much more in depth discussion. We would need to talk about nut height, relief, and action, as to how all three work together to produce a final product.

If you want to talk about that then we can. However we should do that in setup.

[Wayne8]

Labella 760FM? Is that the one? Gauges 49 through 109. If my bass came with 45 through 100, would I have to have the nut slots filed for these larger gauges?

[mrhardy]

That is the set that I'm using.
I have replaced my nut, but I think I still have my old nut in a drawer somewhere. Give me a minute and I'll check it out for you.

[Wayne8]

Something I've forgotten to mention. I have modded my bass with a series/parallel switch. How do flats get along with singles in series?

[mrhardy]

The 760fm would require the slots to be worked a little, based on my old jazz's nut slots.

Series/Parallel should not matter.

I like the large gauge flats, and have a new set for a fretless Precision project I'm working. I've used smaller gauge strings in the past, and like them as well.

The 760FX would be a good set, or just type 760FL into google, and go shopping.

[Wayne8]

With the FL's being 43 through 104, they shouldn't need nut work, right? Do they lose any bassiness being lighter? An thank you very much for all your help!

[mrhardy]

Originally Posted by Wayne8

With the FL's being 43 through 104, they shouldn't need nut work, right? Do they lose any bassiness being lighter? An thank you very much for all your help!

Should be ok. No bass issue's, The Labella's are a very good string.

Your welcome, I'll gladly share any knowlege I have.

[tomshepp]

Originally Posted by Wayne8

Thanks guys. Do you remember which Labellas you used?

I believe they are called Deep Talkin' Flats. Not the Jamerson set. I don't know the specific gauges, but they're pretty standard. Close to 45-105. To me....... perfect for a Jazz.

[Wayne8]

Great. Then that's what I'll do. Thanks again, everybody.