Keeping strings alive forever?

[project_c]

As far as I know, the main causes of a dead string are dirt, sweat, acidity and oil from fingers clogging up the small spaces in the winding. If this is the case, I'm assuming that boiling / denatured alcohol only solve the problem for a short while because these methods only get rid of some of the dirt rather than all of it.

If there was a way to clean strings which enabled the removal of *all* the dirt stuck in the windings, would this mean the string would essentially be as good as new, right up until it started rusting / stretching / unwinding after a good few years of use? And if this is the case, how come, with all the innovations that go on in the bass world, nobody has come up with a better way of prolonging the life or roundwounds?

I know coated strings (Elixirs etc) exist, but the feel / sound is just too different from rounds, and I can't help but feel that this is an area where there's room for some innovation.

[Chopper]

metal fatigue

[LiamPodmore]

That would be perfect, and if it was cheap. Well..... I wouldnt be saying no to that, i can't afford strings much as it is. £22 for a set of Ernie Power Slinky Bass 5's is abit much for a kid in year 11.

Liam

[project_c]

Originally Posted by Chopper

metal fatigue

According to Wikipedia, "Metal fatigue is the progressive and localized structural damage that occurs when a material is subjected to cyclic loadings". So do you mean that the constant strain the strings are under are a large contribution to the process? If this is the case, wouldn't something like this still take many months, if not years to start having a noticeable effect?

[Jim C]

Structural damage and a subtle change in tone are two different things
Some guys like the dead tone and never change their strings, others can't stand it when they are more than a few days old

[project_c]

Originally Posted by Jim C

Structural damage and a subtle change in tone are two different things
Some guys like the dead tone and never change their strings, others can't stand it when they are more than a few days old

Both very true statements!
But they don't answer my question - if the main cause is the build-up of gunk, why has nobody invented a good way of removing it?

[plangentmusic]

Metal fatigue, plus dirt and oil. No preventing it. The same thing happens to all metal -- cymbals, saxophones, etc. You can clean them but it won;t do much.

[pin_head_47]

Originally Posted by project_c

Both very true statements!
But they don't answer my question - if the main cause is the build-up of gunk, why has nobody invented a good way of removing it?

Because if they did, the string companies couldn't sell as many strings.

Cleaning my strings works fine for me, I don't like them to sound completely brand new. But you still have to deal with the strings being worn down by the frets, and there's nothing you can do about that.

Seriously though, the string companies just have a big conspiracy going on to prevent strings from being brought back to life completely... as least that's what I think while wearing my tinfoil hat.

[giacomini]

I've seen a couple guys in other threads that wanted all the brightness from their rounds, all the time.

Their solution: buy lots of cheap string sets and change constantly. (by cheap I mean those that come in bulk, sets that cost less than 5 bucks each).

[HolmeBass]

Buying in bulk is a good way to get very inexpensive strings. And to answer directly to the OP, it's not just about dirt. The metal gets fatigued and older and some of the zing goes out of the string no matter how clean you keep them. I found that boiling them was terrible for strings! For a week or two they would sound a bit better, from being cleaned up, but then they would die completely. I'd go with alcohol to extend string life, but unless you really love dead strings eventually you will need a new set. Phil Chen, famous recording bassist, said in a Bass Player magazine interview that he's had the same set of flats on his P bass for *45 years*. So yeah, some people don't find that they ever need to change their strings.

[project_c]

Originally Posted by giacomini

I've seen a couple guys in other threads that wanted all the brightness from their rounds, all the time.

Their solution: buy lots of cheap string sets and change constantly. (by cheap I mean those that come in bulk, sets that cost less than 5 bucks each).

It's not so much about maximum brightness, as consistency. Strings start out very bright, then they wear in and become 'just right' for a relatively short amount of time, and then they deteriorate rapidly. It would be great if that process could be slowed down, and if the 'just right' phase lasted longer than a few weeks at most. (I know some like their strings dead and some like them brand new, but most players seem to love their strings most when they have that new, but just worn in sound and feel).

I understand the metal fatigue effect, but I still wonder how long that takes. And I don't think the 'string companies wanting to sell more strings' theory is that crazy at all, there must be an element of truth to that too.

[chadhargis]

Just do your best guitar player imatation and break them.

[Psycho]

Boiling loosens up the strings too much, in my experience.

I had the same old, worn out set on my Blackbird for a while, and decided to clean them by boiling. Don't get me wrong, they came clean. But they were so loosened they just died.

As in, no saddle adjustment or tightening would fix 'em.


Strings aren't extremely expensive, in my experience. A good set will last me a year.

[erbine]

Since the strings are under constant tension, I can see how they could fatigue over time, but for steel wrapped, steel core strings, it seems to me it would take a loooong time for that to happen. Dirt and grime are the biggest culprits along with corrosion and oxidation, and regular cleaning should mitigate that. I've never cleaned strings before, but I think I'm going to start with my next set. If you clean them regularly I would think one set of strings should last quite a long time. Then fret wear would be the only cause for replacement.

This is the way I'm going. http://www.tunemybass.com/strings/ba...rings_faq.html

[WJGreer]

Denatured alcohol might not remove 100% of the buildup from the strings - but it's pretty close. I was a boiler for 20 years until I read about denatured alcohol here - IMO, it is much more effective than boiling in renewing a string's tone, and to my ears, cleaned strings sound essentially equivalent to new.

My point - the industry already has a satisfactory solution to this problem, so that may be why nobody is innovating further.

[lunarpollen]

I think the boiling thing might help rejuvinate flats more than rounds in a relative sense (i.e., as much as flats can be "rejuvinated"), although most flatwound players aren't looking for sparkle in their strings, and that's why some keep a set on for decades unless they break a string.

What gives roundwounds their sparkle is the round winding around the core. As you play it, over time, not only does dirt and grime build up in the spaces between the windings, but the edges of the round windings erode where they come in contact with one another and with the core. Cleaning the strings with alcohol, boiling, etc. can give an immediate perceivable boost to the high end if the strings were really dirty beforehand, and some people mistake this as the strings sounding like brand new because the change is so drastic from before to after, but cleaning the strings doesn't magically cause the round windings to regenerate what was lost to erosion. Sure, I suppose if you don't play very much and play very gently but have grimy hands, you may not really cause a lot of inter-winding erosion, but you'll quickly deaden the strings from gunk buildup, in which case, boiling/cleaning the strings might make them sound almost brand new...

[elzeder]

String companies just have to make strings in less dense material than frets, cause its still better and cheaper to change strings than frets.
So you cannot get around the fact that no matter how much you clean your strings, your frets will always mark them and get them to age.
If you want your strings to last forever by cleaning them, you gotta get a fretless...

[project_c]

Originally Posted by WJGreer

Denatured alcohol might not remove 100% of the buildup from the strings - but it's pretty close. I was a boiler for 20 years until I read about denatured alcohol here - IMO, it is much more effective than boiling in renewing a string's tone, and to my ears, cleaned strings sound essentially equivalent to new.

My point - the industry already has a satisfactory solution to this problem, so that may be why nobody is innovating further.

Originally Posted by lunarpollen

I think the boiling thing might help rejuvinate flats more than rounds in a relative sense (i.e., as much as flats can be "rejuvinated"), although most flatwound players aren't looking for sparkle in their strings, and that's why some keep a set on for decades unless they break a string.

What gives roundwounds their sparkle is the round winding around the core. As you play it, over time, not only does dirt and grime build up in the spaces between the windings, but the edges of the round windings erode where they come in contact with one another and with the core. Cleaning the strings with alcohol, boiling, etc. can give an immediate perceivable boost to the high end if the strings were really dirty beforehand, and some people mistake this as the strings sounding like brand new because the change is so drastic from before to after, but cleaning the strings doesn't magically cause the round windings to regenerate what was lost to erosion. Sure, I suppose if you don't play very much and play very gently but have grimy hands, you may not really cause a lot of inter-winding erosion, but you'll quickly deaden the strings from gunk buildup, in which case, boiling/cleaning the strings might make them sound almost brand new...

Ok - both of these replies make perfect sense, I think I understand.
Denatured alcohol will keep the dirt off the strings, but I didn't consider the erosion of the windings - that's an excellent point and would definitely explain why strings eventually, die no matter what.

I guess the way to go is to refresh the strings with denatured alcohol, and repeat whenever needed until the erosion to the windings caused by playing eventually renders the strings useless.

[meatwad]

I have a set of rounds that have been on my fretless since I bought it over a decade ago, and needless to say, they are quite mellow. I'm on the verge of switching to flatwound Chromes, so I will have a set of crummy rounds with nearly no surface wear, absolute zero fretwear, and 10 years of finger grime and sweat embedded deep in the windings.

Can't wait to hear how these clean up!