TI Flats revisited...

[Sundogue]

I've had a set of TI Flats for about two years now.

I've also been in three different bands in that time, all playing different styles of music. I've always taken them back off my basses because for whatever reason, while they always sounded great at home, they never cut it live.

My current band is a cover band playing all variety of music, but mostly rock covers. Over the course of the past year I've been using Dean Markley Blue Steels and lately DR Lo-Rider SS strings.

The last time I had my TI flats on...they were on a P-Bass and I played through an Eden WT-400 and a 210 cab, and I was playing a very subdued, quiet, private party, Christmas gig. It was like playing at an old folks home we were so quiet. I barely got done with the last song of the first set and I couldn't rip off the TI's fast enough and put on some roundwounds.

Part of the appeal of flats is getting some "thump" from the bass, and in the context of that gig and what I was playing through I didn't really give them a fair shake as I was playing so quietly through basically a 210 combo that was up on a case. There was no thump, and definitely no room for any articulation either. It sounded like I had a blanket over my cab, it was so bad. I blamed the strings at the time and vowed to never go back to flats.

The other day I was going through some gear and found my TI Flats in a package. They were still shiny and there is still something appealling about flats and it was time for a string change anyway with a gig coming up tonight. So, I thought I'd give them another try.

But now I have my custom made bass. Passive, but with a reverse P-Bass pickup at the neck and a MM humbucker at the bridge. A very bright, punchy and lively bass. I also now play through a Peavey T-Max 210/115 setup. 500 watts into that cab config.

So I threw on the TI Flats, earnestly wanting to give them another shot. I tuned them up, plugged in my new bass into my new rig and cranked her up (well as loud as what is comfortable at home). I know what my bass sounds like through my rig at home and how it compares to playing out live, so I have a pretty good idea now what works live, even at home (having used this bass and rig many times at both places).

Holy sh*t!!! OK, so this is what that "thump" is!!! Wow...all I can say is, Wow!!! Every note from the low E to the highest of notes have such amazing clarity and definition. These are not your father's flatwounds!

Doing some octave runs showed that the D and G strings have just as much punch and thump as the E and A. With every set of roundwounds I've ever tried the D and G strings always sounded thinner and weaker (though slightly more even now that I have the P-Bass pickup reversed and added the humbucker). Amazing. I can play on the D and G and still have some balls to my sound finally.

These TI flats (that are almost two years old now) are astoundingly bright in comparison to my DR roundwounds I replaced. The DR's were not dead yet...I only had them on for about 5 gigs and I am meticulously cleaning them before, during and after shows, and practicing. I'm playing along and thinking to myself..."Are these really flatwounds?"

I played a few songs from our setlist that I knew needed that roundwound sound..."Never Been Any Reason" by Head East, (in the bass solo part) really stands out as a typically punchy P-Bass with RW sound. The TI's really jumped all over that part and handled it quite well considering they are flats. "Play that Funky Music" by Wild Cherry is another. I do a lot of slapping and popping on that song (though I must admit I'm no slap player). Wow, I actually like the TI's better than my roundwounds on that song. The popping I sometimes do for accents on songs always seems a bit to bright in comparison to the other notes of a song I might do it on and lately I've been cutting back on doing it for that reason. But because the TI's sound so much more balanced all across the strings and fretboard, the "pops" sound more in line with the rest of the notes. The pops still jump out as accents like they should, but now they "fit" in with the rest.

I'm really psyched about my gig tonight. I really feel that for those who may not like TI flats, it might have more to do with the bass you put them on, and the rig you play them through, than the strings themselves. They are much brighter than traditional flats, yet they are not as "zingy" as roundwounds. They are more even from string to string than any other flats or rounds I've ever had.

A big difference for me is, in the past the TI's might not have cut through much because my rig lacked on it's own and even my roundwounds didn't cut as much as I wished. Of course, the louder the band got, the more I'd dig in with my fingerstyle playing...not good. Now, I usually have my amp's volume on 1 or 2 to keep up with the stage volume with headroom to spare.

So tonight, if I need to be louder, there is no need to dig in and play harder (which is poor technique anyway) I can turn up and still play light.

TI Flats are great strings. Tonight will be the final live audition for them. I'm pretty confident this time they will stay on my bass for awhile.

[FretFree]

Keep us updated after your show tonight...

[jady]

Man, I am using Chromes and really dig the even sound and tight fundamental but it isnt bright enough, maybe TIs are the trick.

[Sundogue]

I'm finding I have to cut back the 1.5 slider on the EQ and also turn back my tone control to cut the treble a bit because the TI's are so bright. Almost too bright.

They seem to be brighter than my roundwounds, but they are bright without the "zing" if that makes any sense.

[Sundogue]

Originally Posted by FretFree

Keep us updated after your show tonight...

Oh, I definitely will. Tonight's show is at a very familiar club where the sound is THE best of anywhere we play. I'm always pumped up to play this gig.

Because the sound is so good there we tend to really crank it up, both onstage and through the PA. If ever there was a gig to test if these strings can cut through the mix, this is the place.

And cutting through is really THE test for me with these strings. I like everything about them at every gig I've ever had them on, except they never really cut through as I would have liked. But they were on a different bass, through a completely different rig, so I guess I will know for sure.

I really want to like flats. I am so sick of buying roundwounds so often, because with rounds...when they go dead, they really suck badly. Flats just seem to get better with age. I always love these strings, but live is where it's at, so we'll see after tonight.

[62bass]

I switched to the TI flats almost 10 years ago. They do it for me better than any other string I've used and I've tried almost everything over many years. I have them on 5 different basses, each bass unlike the others. The TIs work on all of them.

You may have to do some setup work and pickup height can be important and you don't need to dig in too hard. Small amount of foam mute under the strings at the bridge, just touching the strings helps too, but that trick works with all strings.

I won't use any other string now. I'm spoiled. Sure, they cost a lot more but they last like no other. The set on my P bass is almost 8 years old and still sounds good.

[Sundogue]

Originally Posted by 62bass

I switched to the TI flats almost 10 years ago. They do it for me better than any other string I've used and I've tried almost everything over many years. I have them on 5 different basses, each bass unlike the others. The TIs work on all of them.

You may have to do some setup work and pickup height can be important and you don't need to dig in too hard. Small amount of foam mute under the strings at the bridge, just touching the strings helps too, but that trick works with all strings.

I won't use any other string now. I'm spoiled. Sure, they cost a lot more but they last like no other. The set on my P bass is almost 8 years old and still sounds good.

Well, I've never been a huge fan of flats, per se. I've always been more of a roundwound kind of player. But, there are certain aspects of flatwounds that I love...like solid fundamentals, not zingy, easy on the fingers, stay cleaner and last longer, etc.

Some of the things I don't like about flatwounds, that the TI's seem to overcome...dull sound, more like a thud instead of having clarity (the TI's are very bright), almost too heavy kind of sound (the TI's are anything but heavy sounding...they seem to have all of the qualities of a roundwound without any of the negatives).

A very unique flatwound to be sure. They are nowhere near as loose as so many people seem to claim. But then again I like lighter guage roundwounds than most people do.

[62bass]

Yes, that looseness seems to only last while the strings stretch in. I've never found them floppy. And I agree they have all the qualities of a roundwound (except for the extreme upper end brightness) without negatives.

[Sundogue]

Well, I played my gig last Saturday night with the TI Flats.

NOTE: I play on a custom made passive bass with a reversed P-Bass (neck) and humbucker (bridge) pickups.

They really added some depth to my sound I didn’t have before. Every note sounded like it had a solid fundamental. After playing with roundwounds for so long there was a bit of reconditioning of what I think a bass should sound like. What I was expecting to hear and what I got were sometimes surprising.

The TI’s are bright, but not piano bright. One thing that really stuck out while playing was the solid, well defined notes on the D and G strings. For the most part anything I’ve played on the D and G roundwounds in the past always felt like the bottom dropped out. The TI’s keep the low end there no matter where I play on the neck.

I really wouldn’t recommend these (or any flatwounds) to those that don’t have an adequate rig (for a rock band anyway). They do cut through (especially the D and G), but I did need to turn up a little louder than I normally would. Roundwounds seem more “open” and the flats are a bit more “choked”. They do sustain, but unlike roundwounds, they don’t “ring out”. The TI’s do have a quicker decay than roundwounds, and on some songs where I let the note hang for a while, they did not sustain as much as my roundwounds. But really the difference in sustain is minimal. Other flats I’ve tried had a very fast decay and didn’t really sustain much at all.

I did get to slap and pop, play chords and do some very subtle playing and the TI’s were more than capable. I love these strings. If anyone is expecting these to sound like roundwounds, they don’t. But they are about as close to a roundwound as you will ever get with a set of flats.

Pros – Even, solid sound throughout spectrum, from string to string. No notes are more or less pronounced than others. Clear and bright for flats. The bass dominates the low end, as it should, without sounding like just a low end guitar…but it does not sound boomy.

If you have EVER felt that you lose some low end when playing the D and G strings...you just have to try these TI Flats out. Every note on my D and G strings were very solid. Never before has playing on those strings kept the bottom driving like it does using TI's.

Cons –They are not roundwounds (and that is about the only “con”, if there even is one).

[Chris Breese]

Thanks a lot for the info, Sundogue. I have been toying with flatwounds for some time - Chromes (.105), Fender flats, LaBellas, etc., but I keep taking them off for some reason. I think it may be my rig, whatever, but I think it's just fear of the unknown.

I put a new set of Chromes on my '62 J bass clone (the .100 set this time) and I thought, "the heck with it. I'm going to leave them on for the whole gig!" It was a low pressure family reunion gig through my mid '70s SVT - Avatar 2x10 - Avatar 1x15. Whoa - pleasantly surprised! Nice full fundamental with just the right top end, without all those high end overtones. But if the chromes sound good, maybe the TI's will sound better. Thanks again.

[phat5]

Originally Posted by Sundogue

Well, I played my gig last Saturday night with the TI Flats.

NOTE: I play on a custom made passive bass with a reversed P-Bass (neck) and humbucker (bridge) pickups.

They really added some depth to my sound I didn’t have before. Every note sounded like it had a solid fundamental. After playing with roundwounds for so long there was a bit of reconditioning of what I think a bass should sound like. What I was expecting to hear and what I got were sometimes surprising.

The TI’s are bright, but not piano bright. One thing that really stuck out while playing was the solid, well defined notes on the D and G strings. For the most part anything I’ve played on the D and G roundwounds in the past always felt like the bottom dropped out. The TI’s keep the low end there no matter where I play on the neck.

I really wouldn’t recommend these (or any flatwounds) to those that don’t have an adequate rig (for a rock band anyway). They do cut through (especially the D and G), but I did need to turn up a little louder than I normally would. Roundwounds seem more “open” and the flats are a bit more “choked”. They do sustain, but unlike roundwounds, they don’t “ring out”. The TI’s do have a quicker decay than roundwounds, and on some songs where I let the note hang for a while, they did not sustain as much as my roundwounds. But really the difference in sustain is minimal. Other flats I’ve tried had a very fast decay and didn’t really sustain much at all.

I did get to slap and pop, play chords and do some very subtle playing and the TI’s were more than capable. I love these strings. If anyone is expecting these to sound like roundwounds, they don’t. But they are about as close to a roundwound as you will ever get with a set of flats.

Pros – Even, solid sound throughout spectrum, from string to string. No notes are more or less pronounced than others. Clear and bright for flats. The bass dominates the low end, as it should, without sounding like just a low end guitar…but it does not sound boomy.

If you have EVER felt that you lose some low end when playing the D and G strings...you just have to try these TI Flats out. Every note on my D and G strings were very solid. Never before has playing on those strings kept the bottom driving like it does using TI's.

Cons –They are not roundwounds (and that is about the only “con”, if there even is one).

Nice review Sundogue! I'm ready to go back to the TI JF's. Had them on my Epi Jack bass, and they were a great match. I'll be ordering a set of 345's soon for my RBV. The nickel rounds sound killer on this bass, but they're just not my cup of tea. I'm not fond of the low end dropping out on the D and G strings; they sound "pinched" in the house mix.

[Sundogue]

If I had to pick one particular thing I like about TI Flats, it's the consistency from string to string with regard to the fundamental.

With EVERY set of roundwounds (or even other flats I've tried) I've used since 1977, the D and G strings always sounded like guitar strings. They just sounded too thin when compared to the E and A strings.

I'd be playing along in the song using the notes on the E and/or A strings and the bass is keeping the low end foundation in place. Cool, just as it should be.

But if I did runs that went up into the D and G strings, then it sounded like the bass dropped out and only guitars were playing.

Now, I have decades of experience, not only in playing bass, but in bass setups and experimenting with pickups, strings, amps, etc. I know how to get a good sound. It's not like I'm some novice that doesn't know how to EQ or has the pickups too low, or not balanced to the strings, etc.

I've experimented with using different guages and even different strings for the D and G, just to try and get those two strings to have the same low end feel of the E and A, but with no luck.

Now, I understand that being lighter strings they aren't going to have the same bottom the heavier E and A strings have, but they also shouldn't cause the bottom to just drop out like it doesn't even exist when playing on them. It shouldn't feel like your playing bass on the E and A, but guitar on the D and G. I'm not talking about ERB's, just your regular 4 string bass that holds down the fort, as it were.

The TI's however are very even sounding. I can hit any note (even up higher on the neck) on the D and G strings and the bottom is still there. In fact, if I cared to, I could play all the notes to a song on the D and G string, and it would still sound like a bass (maybe a bit weird, but still bass).

Are TI's for everyone? Of course not. No string will ever do everything for everyone.

I do know that the TI's have an evenness about them I haven't found in other strings. And just because I like them, doesn't mean they will do the same for anyone else. In fact, I went through three different basses, and countless numbers of rigs before I found that the TI's worked for me.

It's the combination of the gear that finally does it for you and not any one thing. One bass might not sound good through every amp you try, or one amp might not sound great with every bass you play. So it is with strings as well.

With experimentation, you eventually settle on what works for you.

[LoveThatBass]

Originally Posted by 62bass

Yes, that looseness seems to only last while the strings stretch in. I've never found them floppy. And I agree they have all the qualities of a roundwound (except for the extreme upper end brightness) without negatives.

Well, that explains why they felt much better the 3rd time around that I tried them.
Not at all like I remembered them as they were sort of floppy on the Low E string. Not any more!
These are very nice for a P bass. Ok for J bass but they make the J loose all it's identifyable growl (not necessarily a bad thing in my opinion). In fact the J will sound more like a P than a J but not quite as balsy. They produce higher output than some strings I use (D'Addario nickel rounds).

[Kael]

How long are you guys giving TI's to break in before that floppiness dies down? I've got a set that I had on my fretless J and I took them off after three or four months because of their lack of tension. Maybe 30 minutes play time a day. Any time that I played faster than about an 1/8th note I was forced to pluck within an inch of the bridge to get a little tension. And just forget ghost notes with them. I loved the tone my TI's got, but could stomach the tension at all. Seemed to really limit how/where I plucked the string to an unacceptable level IMO. I like to pluck up around the neck pickup on up the neck to about the 14th "fret". Couldn't do that with my TI's unless I was really sticking to 1/4 notes.

How dramatic is this tightening up? How long does it take to kick in? How would a fully broken in set compare tension wise to say a set of d'addario chrome flats?

Thanks in advance...

[LoveThatBass]

Originally Posted by Kael

How long are you guys giving TI's to break in before that floppiness dies down?

How dramatic is this tightening up? How long does it take to kick in? How would a fully broken in set compare tension wise to say a set of d'addario chrome flats?

Thanks in advance...

I think mine may have sped the time up that it takes by putting them on and taking them off then putting them on for the 3rd time. The difference is noticable. Before I could not pluck them fast unless I plucked near the bridge. Not so this last time. They felt like the rounds I took off as far as tension goes.
I will admit that before, I was using a string through the body bass and now a top loader this last time. Did that make a difference? Don't know.

[dunamis]

Originally Posted by LoveThatBass

Well, that explains why they felt much better the 3rd time around that I tried them.
Not at all like I remembered them as they were sort of floppy on the Low E string. Not any more!
These are very nice for a P bass. Ok for J bass but they make the J loose all it's identifyable growl (not necessarily a bad thing in my opinion). In fact the J will sound more like a P than a J but not quite as balsy. They produce higher output than some strings I use (D'Addario nickel rounds).

+1

I liked them on my J bass; *love* them on my P bass.