Timothy B Schmit strings

Wayne8 · #1 03-09-2009, 10:47 AM

Anyone have any idea what strings TBS plays?

JTE · #2 03-09-2009, 12:56 PM

Not any more, but in Poco he used LaBella flats. That's based on the only interview of him I've ever seen. It was in Guitar Player Magazine back in the olden days, probably around 1975 or so (way back when GP was the ONLY guitar/bass magazine there was except for maybe a couple of folk mags and one classical guitar mag I saw a few times).

jte

Wayne8 · #3 03-09-2009, 02:02 PM

Thanks, JTE. From listening to him with the Eagles, can anyone guess as to whether it's flats or rounds?

Sundogue · #4 03-09-2009, 02:40 PM

I think he strung a Rick up with flats for a lot of the Eagles albums he was on. Not sure which flats he used.

I don't know that he ever used rounds for anything. But then again Tapewounds are roundwounds...with nylon over them, so they are like a bright flat.

Wayne8 · #5 03-09-2009, 04:35 PM

See, now I've been following your threads (Sundogue), and I really want to try flats, but even saying what kind of music someone plays might not be descriptive enough. If someone could take a particular song from each genre, one that everyone would know, and say that you can get that sound with a certain kind of flats, or you can't get that sound with flats at all, an example of both (can, can't), I think it'd go a long way toward helping folks know whether or not they'd be wasting their money ordering flats.

Okay, Motown is flats, more than likely Labellas. What about country, bluegrass, pop (60's/70's). I was just asking about TBS because his bass always has a real nice sound to it, IMO, that I could definitely live with. Sounds the same to me as dozens, if not hundreds of other famous classic rock songs.

Is there any sustain to flats at all?

Sundogue · #6 03-09-2009, 06:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wayne8

See, now I've been following your threads (Sundogue), and I really want to try flats, but even saying what kind of music someone plays might not be descriptive enough. If someone could take a particular song from each genre, one that everyone would know, and say that you can get that sound with a certain kind of flats, or you can't get that sound with flats at all, an example of both (can, can't), I think it'd go a long way toward helping folks know whether or not they'd be wasting their money ordering flats.

Okay, Motown is flats, more than likely Labellas. What about country, bluegrass, pop (60's/70's). I was just asking about TBS because his bass always has a real nice sound to it, IMO, that I could definitely live with. Sounds the same to me as dozens, if not hundreds of other famous classic rock songs.

Is there any sustain to flats at all?

My Chromes have sustain, so do my TI's. They just don't sustain as long as rounds. The initial attack of flats decays quicker, so what sustain there is, is not as bright nor as long as rounds. But it's not like the sound dies immediately upon being plucked (though with some foam under the strings at the bridge would kill it quicker if you like that).

Honestly, you should stop trying to sound like someone else and concentrate on sounding like you. If you play in a band, think about how you want the band to sound and what you can do to accommodate that.

I play a lot of cover songs that I know are played with roundwounds on the recording, but my band sounds better live with me using flats. I think of something like "Carry on Wayward Son" by Kansas. Though I've played it with rounds for that clear, punchy piano-like tone and Dave Hope clearly used rounds on the recording, we as a band sound tighter live when I play it with flats. And actually I can cop a pretty good bright, punchy tone with my bass strung with TI flats (can't wait to try the Chromes on a gig). Flats only sound like mud or dull if you want them to sound that way.

There is so much going on in that song and with my band being a 5 piece (two guitars, keys, drums and me) and all of us singing, flats keep the low end of our live sound tighter. Would my 'tone' be more accurate to the recording if I used rounds? Yes. But sacrificing the tightness of our rhythm section for that tone is not worth it. Especially since all that piano-like roundwound tone gets lost in the whole mix anyway. I'm not interested in sounding like Dave Hope. I'm interested in supporting the low end in the rhythm section in a live performance.

It's about what you need as a bass player, or what your band needs from you...it's not about what I think or what some other guy does on a recording.

Wayne8 · #7 03-09-2009, 07:20 PM

I understand what you're saying. I actually tried Labellas but took them off and sold them after only half a day because I didn't like the way they sounded at home. After your posts on how well they do with the band, I've been regretting that I never tried them in that setting before giving up on them. I think I'll wait until you post back on your opinions of the Chromes in a full band setting before I make up my mind.
It would be nice if I could find some clips of the Chromes with a band so I could hear for myself before I buy.

Sundogue · #8 03-09-2009, 07:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wayne8

I understand what you're saying. I actually tried Labellas but took them off and sold them after only half a day because I didn't like the way they sounded at home. After your posts on how well they do with the band, I've been regretting that I never tried them in that setting before giving up on them. I think I'll wait until you post back on your opinions of the Chromes in a full band setting before I make up my mind.
It would be nice if I could find some clips of the Chromes with a band so I could hear for myself before I buy.

Even if you hear Chromes in a band setting, unless you are the bass player in that band, there are too many variables for you to really make up your mind about them.

Different bass, amps, cabs, effects and especially the player himself makes a huge difference. You may hear something you like only to find it doesn't sound all that great with your bass and rig, or your band.

But, I'll be giving an update in my 'Chromes Impressions' thread after the 21st (our next gig). Actually I haven't had a chance to really even play the Chromes at practice much with the rest of the band. But we have rehearsal this Thursday night, so I'll see how they do in that setting.

It's imperative to give any piece of equipment a chance in a live setting because what sounds good at home alone seldom sounds good with a live band and visa versa. I still have "tone" issues with flats practicing alone at home. But then again, when I'm at home I'm more concerned with becoming a better bass player and learning my parts, so my tone doesn't matter much to me in that environment. For me it's ALL about how it works with the whole band. Gigs are where it's at for me. I don't record much anymore and I don't play at home just to hear myself.

Just a tip. NEVER sell anything if you can help it. I have so many strings in storage that I can pull out many an old set and try them out anytime I feel like it. That's what happened with my TI Flats. I decided to give them a try again (on and off again over two years time). I'm glad I still had them. First gig with them this last time and it totally changed my outlook.

Wayne8 · #9 03-09-2009, 08:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sundogue

Different bass, amps, cabs, effects and especially the player himself makes a huge difference.

Yeah, not to mention whatever magic they work in the studio on recordings.

david fitch · #10 03-09-2009, 08:59 PM

I agree with Sundogue on sounding like yourself. That's why I have been using Nickel Rounwounds in my current band. We cover 60's & 70's Soul music and on just about all the original recordings the Bass is strung with Flats. I find Roundwounds are working better for me in this setting. Don't think you can't hold down a tight rythem section with Rounds,they work fine for me. Dave

rumblethump · #11 03-11-2009, 09:41 AM

Sundogue, 2 great posts, both should be stickies. In my big band flats are just whats needed to provide the sonic space needed , but in my trio, Steel roundwounds fill the bill, My bass tone is MY voice within the band.

Sundogue · #12 03-11-2009, 09:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rumblethump

Sundogue, 2 great posts, both should be stickies. In my big band flats are just whats needed to provide the sonic space needed , but in my trio, Steel roundwounds fill the bill, My bass tone is MY voice within the band.

Yes, it's ALL about your wants needs and the context they fit in.

You can certainly "hold down" a tight rhythm section with rounds...I've done it for 30 years. Flats just do it better. There will always be compromises between your wants and the band's needs. Sometimes they are slight enough to not be very different at all. I'm willing to sacrifice some of MY tone for the sake of a better sounding band in the situations I'm in.

If I were in a different band than the three I'm in, and it was maybe a three piece band or different music, I'd love to have a Rick with bright rounds.

david fitch · #13 03-11-2009, 03:34 PM

"Flats Just Do It Better" ,for you my friend,not for me. I tried using flatwounds and just didn't work for me in this gourp. I remember the first time I heard Bob Babbitt using roundwounds with The Funk Brothers,I even said to him "sounds like you are using rounds" and he said "sometimes you just have too". The band still sounded like The Funk Brothers with the fat round Motown Bass. Dave

Sundogue · #14 03-13-2009, 07:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by david fitch

"Flats Just Do It Better" ,for you my friend,not for me.

Flats do it better. Period. End of story.

The only question is what "it" is. It means different things to different people. I love rounds and have played them for 30 years.

Flats have a better fundamental, quicker decay and more thump with less harmonics and overtones. There isn't one brand of rounds that can match that...not one. If that ain't your thing, then it ain't your thing. Rounds have their place.

JTE · #15 03-13-2009, 08:28 AM

YOUR THREAD??!?!

The original poster is Wayne8 asking about Timothy B. Scmitt's strings. And to say that "Flats do it better. Period. End of story." and then say "If that ain't your thing, then it ain't your thing." is just silly.

jte

Sundogue · #16 03-13-2009, 08:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JTE

YOUR THREAD??!?!

The original poster is Wayne8 asking about Timothy B. Scmitt's strings. And to say that "Flats do it better. Period. End of story." and then say "If that ain't your thing, then it ain't your thing." is just silly.

jte

I edited my post. Sorry...I was also responding to another in a different thread (of mine) at the same time and got sidetracked by my 3 year old.

If you look at my post you'll notice I originally added "the question is what "it" is." Flats do "it" better. What "it" means to me is probably different than what "it" means to you.

And if flats ain't your thing, then they're not. What's silly about that?

david fitch · #17 03-13-2009, 09:33 AM

Flats do it better. Period. End of story. That's funny! I have been playing Bass myself for twentysix years and have formed my own opinion on what works for me (and the band)and along comes Sundogue and he's going to tell me how it is. I do use a flatwound strung Fender Precision in my Blues band,but for the Classic Soul band I also play in rounds work better for the band. On Timothy B. Scmitt, when he was using is Carvin Bass, I know he was using roundwounds and his Fender Jazz Basses wore flatwounds with the Eagles. BTW,I spoke with Timothy B. Scmitt a few years back and he is a very nice guy. Dave

Sundogue · #18 03-13-2009, 10:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by david fitch

Flats do it better. Period. End of story. That's funny! I have been playing Bass myself for twentysix years and have formed my own opinion on what works for me (and the band)and along comes Sundogue and he's going to tell me how it is. I do use a flatwound strung Fender Precision in my Blues band,but for the Classic Soul band I also play in rounds work better for the band. On Timothy B. Scmitt, when he was using is Carvin Bass, I know he was using roundwounds and his Fender Jazz Basses wore flatwounds with the Eagles. BTW,I spoke with Timothy B. Scmitt a few years back and he is a very nice guy. Dave

I'm telling you how it is for me in my situation. Read the rest of my posts.

You know what? I also think Rounds do "it" better. I suppose you don't agree with that either.

Wayne8 · #19 03-13-2009, 10:27 AM

Thanks David for confirming.

david fitch · #20 03-13-2009, 10:33 AM

I also think Rounds do "it" better. I suppose you don't agree with that either. What ? Come on,your the one who said "Flats do it better. Period. End of story". My point is both work but not in every setting for ME. I tried flats in the Soul band I'm in,but I was getting lost in the mix,they were not working for me in that band. Flats work great in my Chicago Blues band. Your original thread on flatwounds was very well written, I just don't agree with everything you said, Big Deal...period.