Unhappy w/35" scall G string , TI JF

[ChrisPbass]

I have TI Jazz flats on my Modulus (35" scale) and I <really> like them but the G string is noticeably tighter then the rest of the set. I have looked, w/zero success, to see if I can get a single lighter gauge G.
does anyone know if it's possible to get lighter G's.
Will it even help? I've read some talk about G strings and 35" scale.

[FunkMetalBass]

Originally Posted by ChrisPbass

I have TI Jazz flats on my Modulus (35" scale) and I <really> like them but the G string is noticeably tighter then the rest of the set. I have looked, w/zero success, to see if I can get a single lighter gauge G.
does anyone know if it's possible to get lighter G's.
Will it even help? I've read some talk about G strings and 35" scale.

In reality, string manufacturers use thicker strings for the D&G strings, resulting in a higher tension. On any scale, they will feel noticeably tighter.

TI only makes one string smaller than the .043, and that's a .033, which will probably feel far too loose. Would you be willing to buy an individual string from another company?

[cassius987]

Originally Posted by FunkMetalBass

In reality, string manufacturers use thicker strings for the D&G strings, resulting in a higher tension. On any scale, they will feel noticeably tighter.

+1

I believe the LaBella 760FX (Deep Talkin' Flats) set might be more like what you are looking for as far as overall tension. The tensional balance is typically tighter on their sets (which you can analyze by doing a regression of the ratio of each string over its smaller predecessor (D/G, A/D, E/A), ideally you get a horizontal line intercepting the y-axis at 1.333) than I have found with TIs which tend to have tighter D and G strings as mentioned above; apparently there is historical reason for this related to how early Fenders responded to strings. Nowadays these compensated tensions aren't needed but are still in place for many makers.

[ChrisPbass]

Originally Posted by FunkMetalBass

In reality, string manufacturers use thicker strings for the D&G strings, resulting in a higher tension. On any scale, they will feel noticeably tighter.

TI only makes one string smaller than the .043, and that's a .033, which will probably feel far too loose. Would you be willing to buy an individual string from another company?

I am not against trying another company. I DO like the rest of the set and I probably won't change them. The D string seems fine.

Got any good suggestions for a single G?

.33 seems like it would seem wayyy to thin compared to the rest of the set.

[ixlramp]

Originally Posted by cassius987

which you can analyze by doing a regression of the ratio of each string over its smaller predecessor (D/G, A/D, E/A), ideally you get a horizontal line intercepting the y-axis at 1.333

Yes. From string physics you can derive the rough rule of gauges in the ratio of 4:3 for equal tension across a fourths tuning

[ixlramp]

Originally Posted by ChrisPbass

.33 seems like it would seem wayyy to thin compared to the rest of the set.

EDIT: My mistake, I was not going by TI's published tensions.

[FunkMetalBass]

Originally Posted by ixlramp

Are your gauges .043, .056, .070, .100? If so a .033 with a .056 is actually a reasonable match. There are many sets with a .035 and a .055. The .033 will be a little looser but that actually feels right and helps to balance the tone. I recommend trying that .033.

Unless I'm mistaken, that .033 will have a tension of ~23 lbs, which would be quite low indeed.

I'm basing all of my information off of the TI website, but that's what I see.

[ixlramp]

I can't find TI Jazz flats on the website, where are they?

[FunkMetalBass]

http://www.thomastik-infeld.com/guitars/index.html

click Jazz E-bass, 6-string, Flat Wound Medium. Use the .033 specs to calculate UW, then lump it all back together into the formula with a 35" speaking length and ~98Hz.

[ixlramp]

Ah ... found it, thanks. Interestingly the .043 D and .056 G are at the same tension. So yeah the .033 will indeed be very loose at G, probably even feel worse than the .043.

[FunkMetalBass]

Originally Posted by ixlramp

Ah ... found it, thanks. Interestingly the .043 D and .056 G are at the same tension. So yeah the .033 will indeed be very loose at G, probably even feel worse than the .043.

It is curious to me that the D feels fine but his G-string feels very heavy, even though they are roughly the same tension. It's likely more of the string's construction causing less flexibility.

[ixlramp]

Yeah, curious to me too.

G .043 37.03 pounds of tension
D .056 37.47
A .070 31.30
E .100 34.39

The D and G are tighter than the E and A. Perhaps the G 'feels' tighter due to being thinner, that's my experience anyway.

[Angus]

Originally Posted by FunkMetalBass

It is curious to me that the D feels fine but his G-string feels very heavy, even though they are roughly the same tension. It's likely more of the string's construction causing less flexibility.

Well yeah- it's because tension isn't the only thing that makes a string "feel" floppy. You also have to consider how the vibration in and transmits across the string, the decay time and envelope, etc etc. Tension only tells you one parameter. But you knew this intuitively already- we all that certain brands feel more "tight" to us even if they are effectively indistinguishable in terms of their tension.

[ChrisPbass]

Originally Posted by FunkMetalBass

It is curious to me that the D feels fine but his G-string feels very heavy, even though they are roughly the same tension. It's likely more of the string's construction causing less flexibility.

the G string is slightly higher then the D in distance off the neck that is.
I just sat and played it a bit and I guess they do 'feel' the same tension wise but the G is a little harder to play. Maybe because it's a thinner.

Is there something y'all can recommend that might feel a little looser?

I <see> that the G should feel similar to the D, but it doesn't. can't fool my mind ;-)

[cassius987]

If the G string has higher action shouldn't you address that and see if that fixes your problem?

[ChrisPbass]

Ooops. I'm fried. Went and saw Gogol Bordello and can barely keep my eyes open. As a matter of fact, my wife just came home and i'm going to go take a nap!

I can't lower the G anymore. saddle is maxed.

also...although the action isn't super low it also isn't super high. I actually have the action about where I want it. If I lowered the G enough to make it play easier It would be unproportionately (did i just invent a word?) low.

[ixlramp]

Perhaps look for a different brand of flats with gauges 35-95. Good luck!

Just Strings have a lot of single flatwounds, you could build a set: http://www.juststrings.com/bassguitarsinglestrings.html

They have a good range of LaBellas from .039: http://www.juststrings.com/deeptalki...lestrings.html

How about this extra-long LaBella set 39-96?: http://www.juststrings.com/lab-760fx-exl.html. The tensions look reasonably well balanced.

[duncbass]

The TI JR G may be lower tension. I think that set is lower in general than the flats.

[Johnny Alien]

Originally Posted by ixlramp

TI know what they're doing, they know the tensions, and they still design sets with this tension imbalance They must be so used to the feel of traditional sets they honestly believe that to be the ideal

TI does know what they are doing with tension and balance. Their gauges are odd for the sole reason that they wanted a balanced set. I have never experienced a set that feels unbalanced like you describe HOWEVER I never put a set on a 35" scale before. Are you using the JF344 set and stringing through bridge?

I would be concerned that maybe there is an issue with that string. I am not sure where you got it but the dealer should be able to get you a new string if you send the old one. If you can't get anywhere with them than shoot me a PM but it's best to come from the dealer you bought it from.

It might be the way it feels with a 35" scale but I would at least TRY to replace it and see if that fixes it.

[ixlramp]

Johnny Alien, apologies, my statement there was too harsh.

In fact TI jazz flats are actually much more tension balanced than a standard set:

TI Jazz E-Bass flats

C .033 38.13 pounds tension
G .043 37.03
D .056 37.47
A .070 31.30
E .100 34.39
B .136 34.83

D'Addario EXL 170-6

XLB032 C 0.032 38.9 pounds tension
XLB045 G 0.045 42.8
XLB065 D 0.065 51.3
XLB080 A 0.080 42.0
XLB100 E 0.100 36.5
XLB130 B 0.130 34.5

Also, respect to TI for publishing the individual string tensions