Why do flats suck?

AHbassist · #1 12-04-2007, 01:58 AM

I just bought a set of steel fender flats so I wouldn't tear my fretless' neck up, but they sound dead! Please tell me there are brighter sounding flats.

Arild · #2 12-04-2007, 02:09 AM

La Bella (James Jamerson. Deep talking) Are Great strings

LHbassist · #3 12-04-2007, 02:10 AM

The Fender flats are just not going to sound like a roundwound, and they have a lot of dampening material in the windings to cut down on the overtone of the string. Great for quick decay and punch, but not for those players wanting more ringing sustain.
As a bassist going on 35 years professional..I'm STILL trying out new strings. I'd suggest for you to try Thomastik Jazz Flats, very light tension, very bright sounding, high quality set...but expensive. I think this set is only available in one gauge. An alternative would be the just as excellent LaBella 'Deep Talkin' Bass' flatwounds in a similar gage- say 45,65,85,105 and see if you like those. As the post above mentions the Jamerson set, I myself have been wanting to try those. I have a set of the LaBella 45-105's on my Danelectro Longhorn, and they are a great sounding flatwound. I also like the heavy gauge set Rotosound makes, called 'Jazz Bass'. I have those on my Warmoth maple neck Precision bass, love them, but the heavy gauge might be too heavy for some players. The gauge is 50 70 95 110, almost exactly the same as the Fender 9050's, and similar to the 'Jamerson' set. They are pretty high tension strings. I play upright, and don't mind that, and the action actually is better on that bass than any of my others! I'm sure the lighter gauge 'Jazz Bass' set has lighter tension, logically. Good luck!

EADG mx · #4 12-04-2007, 02:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AHbassist

I just bought a set of steel fender flats so I wouldn't tear my fretless' neck up, but they sound dead!

Isn't that the whole point....

nastyn8c · #5 12-04-2007, 02:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EADG mx

Isn't that the whole point....

Yeah. You may have bought a crappy set of flats, you just don't know what you're looking for, or both. Judging by the first post, I'd say it's both. Try some Chromes out - they're relatively cheap and available anywhere, but don't expect them to be bright like steel rounds or anything.

Drucocu · #6 12-04-2007, 03:11 AM

flats don't suck!! this is just your opinion!
they have to sound that way, in case you didn't know.
I played also the fender flats, and they are IMO and IME the brightest, compared to Rotosound Jazz, and the LaBella Deep Talking Flats, I've played them all.
dont know 'bout the Thomastik...

what about Halfrounds? but dont expect'em to sound like rounds either.

Sorefinger · #7 12-04-2007, 03:39 AM

I´m not crazy about Fender flats myself. Unless I roll the tone off, they sound rather hollow and harsh (although they get mellower over time, but it takes months).

Chromes are much fuller, smoother and more versatile soundwise IME.

For fretless, I´d still go with rounds for maximum mwah, regardless of neck wear.

James Hart · #8 12-04-2007, 04:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AHbassist

so I wouldn't tear my fretless' neck up

then you need to work on your fingering technique. Metal, be it flat or round, is stronger than wood.

Use strings that sound like you want them too.... I use stainless rounds on most my fretless basses!

nemo · #9 12-04-2007, 04:44 AM

Don't worry about the wear. Especially if you have the ebony board (?).
If you want the juicy mwaah, get a set of DR Sunbeams and don't look back.

Learn not to do a vibrato perpendicularly, but laterally, along the string.

CrimsonGhost · #10 12-04-2007, 06:20 AM

rotosounds, would give a mean mwahh

Phalex · #11 12-04-2007, 06:24 AM

Maybe you should try some half rounds??

SuperDuck · #12 12-04-2007, 06:27 AM

I'm not going to say that your fretboard is invincible, and I'm not going to say you don't have to worry about about it, but I played nickel rounds on a fretless bass for 5+ years. When I finally disassembled the bass to part it out, the neck was fine. This was a MIM Fender with a rosewood(?) board. There was some slight discoloration from the strings, but there were no grooves or indentations or what have you.

Just food for thought.

gre107 · #13 12-04-2007, 06:32 AM

Just use rounds. You will not beat up your fretboard for a long long time. Just make sure they are nickel rounds and you will not have any problem.

There seems to be this myth/fear of using rounds on a fretless that is really untrue.

If you use nickle wound strings and do not bend notes (slide instead) you will be fine.

Baird6869 · #14 12-04-2007, 07:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sorefinger

I´m not crazy about Fender flats myself. Chromes are much fuller, smoother and more versatile soundwise IME.

For fretless, I´d still go with rounds for maximum mwah, regardless of neck wear.

+1, +1, +1

62bass · #15 12-04-2007, 07:36 AM

There are many flatwound strings on the market. They all don't sound like Fender flats. They don't all sound dead. Anyhow, use the strings that give you a good sound for your ears. Roundwounds will wear a fingerboard faster of course, but not so quickly that you'll have to worry about it for years, and then it's pretty easy to resurface the fingerboard. I made my original 62 P bass with rosewood fingerboard fretless and played it for more than 10 years with the original Fender flats on it. Only the last few years did it get to the point where I'd consider it needed a bit of work. If they had been rounds, maybe I'd have got half that amount of time. But, I was playing a lot then. With gigs and practice (when there was time to practice) I averaged 6 hours a day every day of the week. I doubt you'll play that much.

Dincrest · #16 12-04-2007, 09:34 AM

Flats generally are dead sounding for that more thumpy, upright sound. I once tried SIT PowerFlats and flats really weren't my thing. In terms of brightness, Steve Harris gets a bright sound using Rotosound flats, but he has aggressive digging right hand technique and sometimes uses his fingernails like fingerpicks for that sharp attack.

Half-rounds like SIT Silencers have the feel of roundwounds, only smoother and warmer.

lambro · #17 12-04-2007, 09:59 AM

comon folks

http://www.pyramidstrings.com/st-guitar.html

BillMason · #18 12-04-2007, 10:38 AM

Didn't Jaco use Rotosounds?

Pilgrim · #19 12-04-2007, 10:40 AM

The answer: flats don't suck. Congratulations on jumping in and condemning an entire class of strings that many people love, based on a single experience. That's such a reasonable stance!!

There's nothing wrong with flats - a little searching in this forum would reveal many, many discussions.

I prefer flats and my favorites are Labella Deep Talkin' flats. But if you like extremely bright sound they're not for you.

I'm trying to find some bright-sounding flats for my Epi EB-0, and I'm not spending the $ for TIs. From reports, I'm thinking Chromes might be OK.

capnsandwich · #20 12-04-2007, 10:49 AM

If you wanted to use rounds instead of flats, Elixers are great for fretless since they have that coating on them that makes your fingers slide easier and you won't be as tempted to bend your strings for vibrato. The coating also protects the fretboard from coming into direct contact with the metal and they're made of nickel, not stainless steel.