Fingering for Marcello in F

[GFDBGuy]

Hi,

I need advice in fingering one measure of the 2nd movement of the Marcello Sonata in F. Starting at the last two 16th notes of measure 23 there are two high A notes in thumb position. The next measure is F# slurred to G then A and Bb followed by an 8th note C with a trill and slurred to a descending Bb to A, back to Bb slurred to high D followed by C, D Bb C A then Bb. I've tried using my thumb in various places so I can play the trill with my 1st and 2nd fingers and then moving my thumb up to Bb to reach the D with my 2nd as well. It all seems a bit cumbersome. Attached is the excerpt in treble clef.

Thanks, Geoff

[PNeher]

Hey! Thanks for the question~
My fingering, which follows Rhythmic Fingering concepts, for each note:

ms 23: 4, 2(4 trill), 1, 1 (1)
ms 24: t, 1, 2, 3, 1 (3tr), 2, 1, 1, 3, 1, 3, 1, 3, 1, 2
ms 25: t, 2, 1, 2, t, 1, 1, 3, 1, 2, 3, 1, 4, 1, 4, 1
ms 26: 1, 0, 1, 2, 1, 4, 1 +4

Notice that the shifts are NOT within slurs but oriented toward the subdivision of an eight note within sixteenths and generally following the duple feeling of the music. Rhythmic Fingering (concepts orginally developed by David Walter).
Any fingering is just ONE WAY. There are myriad ways to approach all bass playing.
Best of luck.
PN

[GFDBGuy]

Thanks for the reply, we shall try it. This is our high school tryout piece for all-state orchestra. This section has been troublesome. All of my students use Rabbath positions and work primarily from the Vance Books. Would a Rabbath fingering be any different than the one you suggested?

[PNeher]

Generally a "Rabbath"-like fingering would, in Baroque Era music, tend toward utilizing across-string fingerings, without too much regard for bowing. This creates timbral changes that in Baroque music you can get away with. In Classical and Romantic those same timbral changes are less "accepted" by today's audiences. So, remember that fingering should be driven by Music not by Position (or technical ability). It is important, IMO, to always consider the expectations of the listener, the audience, in all technical decisions. How does one fingering, vs another, make it SOUND? What is the BOWING for that fingering? How will that affect the audience? How will that match our expectations of a particular genre? Even for beginning students, a consideration of style should have a concern, whether the students are concerned or not, the teacher MUST be when he/she suggests (or promotes) a specific fingering. But, of course, technical level is always a consideration... but it should be in accord with the expression of the music.
So... you KNOW how to finger the passage. But do you know how to make it have expression... that's what matters to the audience. Gary K. loves to finger many passages in Bottesini: 2, 2, 2, 2, 2 because he likes (and his audience likes) the way it sounds for a particular passage. "Use your nose if you need to, but make music!" - (David Walter).
Best to you
Patrick

[GFDBGuy]

Thanks for the reply. I preach to my students that fingering should accommodate the bowing, because this usually better serves the music. However, music is not served very well when it is played out of tune. Everyone likes the thumb on F# in measure 24, because it sounds better than crossing strings. The Bb to D later in the measure is getting there, but most of my students are contorting their hand and playing it out of tune, so I have advised them to let their 1st finger move up 1/2 step to C since this is the next note in the passage. Thumb on Bb to 2 on D is working better for some. Thanks for your advice, it has been very helpful.