Numb Spot

[TroyK]

I almost tacked on to the "posture" thread, but I thought that you wrapped that one up so nicely that I didn't want to take it in a different direction, so:

About 2 months ago, I noticed that I had a small (baseball sized) numb spot just inside my left shoulder blade. Not pain, but clearly something. It felt just like your arm does when you fall asleep on it for a few hours. I'm involved in several physical activities that irritated it, once the problem manifested and I have some other health issues that could have contributed, so I went to my doctor who ran a bunch of tests, including multiple MRIs and found no apparent cause or complications.

I was referred to a massage therapist, who really helped, but I was still puzzled about cause. None of the doctors or the massage therapist had seen anything exactly like that before. Then I mentioned it to my bass teacher and he said "oh yeah, I get that."

Mystery solved. I stretch, I think ongoing periodic massages are in order, I try to take breaks when I practice and I just stay aware of it in general. But, I'm wondering how common this is and if there is a more specific cause with posture or bass habits.

Thoughts?

Troy

[PNeher]

Yes this is a very common problem / pain! When you lift your left arm up over your left shoulder height, you rotate the shoulder blade outward. This causes a stretch to the muscle(s) that hold the blade to your back. Most commonly, this continuing stretch eventually irritates the muscle and you get what feels like a knot and even numbness. It is a kind of over-usage injury that most doctors know little about. I am NOT a doctor, but I have experienced this issue myself and some of my students have also. To avoid it, try NOT to lift the left arm too high for long periods of time (or for years like I did!). One other thing, avoid "hunching" at the shoulders over your bass. To bend over the bass, do it from the waist and keep your back "straight." I often look up as high as I can, to the sky or ceiling, while playing, especially in upper registers, so that my back stays straight-ish and I don't bend at the shoulders. This has helped alleviate my back/shoulder pain for more than a decade now!
Cheers!
PN

[TroyK]

You're just what this forum needed. Thank you for your answer!

[Don Higdon]

Originally Posted by PNeher

Yes this is a very common problem / pain! When you lift your left arm up over your left shoulder height, you rotate the shoulder blade outward. This causes a stretch to the muscle(s) that hold the blade to your back. Most commonly, this continuing stretch eventually irritates the muscle and you get what feels like a knot and even numbness. It is a kind of over-usage injury that most doctors know little about. I am NOT a doctor, but I have experienced this issue myself and some of my students have also. To avoid it, try NOT to lift the left arm too high for long periods of time (or for years like I did!). One other thing, avoid "hunching" at the shoulders over your bass. To bend over the bass, do it from the waist and keep your back "straight." I often look up as high as I can, to the sky or ceiling, while playing, especially in upper registers, so that my back stays straight-ish and I don't bend at the shoulders. This has helped alleviate my back/shoulder pain for more than a decade now!
Cheers!
PN

Bending at the waist is misuse of the spine. The contrary qualitites of plasticity and rigidity afforded by the delicate, intricate structure of the spine are not for the use you describe. The healthy way to “bend” is to hinge at the hip sockets, maintaining the integrity of the spine’s natural curves. Think of a ball and socket joint, with the usual roles reversed: the ball (the head of the femur) stays relatively motionless, and the socket (the pelvis) rotates around it. The ischial tuberosities rock forward, and the spine tilts forward as a unit, its curves undistorted. The movement should be done with direction (a skill learned in the Alexander Technique) so as to avoid compression of the vertebrae. Photographs of this have been printed in the ISB journal.

A common mistake is the belief that identifying the nature of a symptom, or even its proximate cause, is the same as identifying “the problem.” The pain in the scapular area is not caused by the lifting of the left arm per se, but by the thought and muscle processes so involved, beginning with the manner of reaction to stimuli of any type, from any source. Proper coordination is our natural endowment, visible in every 2-year-old without her even knowing what it is. This natural coordination is overcome all too soon by our environment, including the examples set by our care givers. My goal as an Alexander teacher is to enable students to recover what was theirs to begin with.

Alexander teachers, especially those in the Madonald pedagogical line, spend a good portion of their working lives with their arms above shoulder height, elbows out, without ever experiencing the symptoms cited here. They simply know what not to do. As Alexander said, “The right thing does itself.”

Rounding the shoulders forward is a common bassist’s habit, routinely eliminated as an indirect consequence of Alexander lessons.

Looking up, as a formula for keeping the back straight, is fraught with risk of cervical damage and should not be attempted out of the sight of someone trained to recognize excessive tension and compression of the neck. The doer is not a reliable judge. We all suffer from misinterpretation of our proprioceptive feedback. I enable each new student to discover this for himself in the first lesson. It takes me about ten seconds.

A word about me and the Alexander Technique: I used to need a chiropractor about 30-35 times a year; massage therapists, occasionally. From the day I began as an Alexander student, I have eliminated both from my life. I determined that I would spend the rest of my life helping others to secure their own wellness, so I went back to school to become certified as a teacher.

The Alexander Technique is taught at your alma mater, in both the music and dance divisions. There are skilled teachers in both Tucson and Seattle.

[PNeher]

Lots of wonderful comment and perspective, Don. Thank you!!!
The terminology used for finding and relieving ailments is vast and what works for some, does not necessarily for others. Clearly the discussion, though, is helpful when one finds what works for oneself (remember finding "IT?"). I avoid who is right or wrong, for all thoughts and opinions on the subect(s) are welcome. All experience is welcome to give others insight. It'd be nice if we could agree on terminology that we can all use, but, fortunatly - like the shapes of and approaches to the double bass itself, there are myriad ways to say/do anything/everything.
PN

[TroyK]

All very interesting and useful. I don't think that I've solved my problem, by identifying it, but at least I'm tuned into it by eliminating the many other potential causes in my life as suspects.

I noticed in pictures that people have taken at my gigs that my end pin seemed a little high, so I've lowered it a few centimeters and that definitely takes some pressure off. Plus, I'm watching my posture and not over-doing it.

I'll consider studying Alexander Technique. I've got a great jazz bass teacher and haven't been considering adding or changing. Maybe he knows someone through the U who could compliment what I'm working on with him.

Thanks again for your replies.

Troy

[Don Higdon]

Originally Posted by TroyK

I noticed in pictures that people have taken at my gigs that my end pin seemed a little high, so I've lowered it a few centimeters and that definitely takes some pressure off. Plus, I'm watching my posture and not over-doing it.

I'll consider studying Alexander Technique. I've got a great jazz bass teacher and haven't been considering adding or changing. Maybe he knows someone through the U who could compliment what I'm working on with him.

I found that I could go to thumb position with better use of myself by lowering the bass, contrary to what many people say they do. It will vary from bass to bass, since dimensions and setup vary so much.
I know who the Seattle teachers are. I'll PM you.