Best string for more pizz volume?

[stz]

Hello everyone.

I play almost totally pizz, I don't ever mess around with the bow seeing as I'm not a real db'ist. I'm sure I'll get around to it though.

What I'm after at the moment is more accoustic volume when busking. I've heard that nylon strings will give me that, so what I'm after is:

Is that the case at all? Nylon strings? Are they Nylon or Nylon core w/nickle wrap? What gauge to go for? What brand? What would you do/have done for greater accoustic volume for pizz?

Please remember I don't use the bow and I want more volume, any decription of a plucking technique will also likely help but I'll be off looking that up myself in a bit.

Thanks!

[Jake]

Bro, sorry if what I wrote sounded a little rude or condescending. I deleted it. If you work on your left hand (strenth, intonation, etc) with and even without the bow, it will help your tone and your sound production. Also, the great Lynn Seaton has a post where he talks about the right hand aspect in the Soloing in the Low Register thread in the Ask the Pros section.

[stz]

Using a bow is kind of on my list of things to do, I'll play around with it at home but I'm a liability with it when recording and I'll be one when busking. I realised I should maybe give more background.

It is a CCB, laminate. Horrible and shiney (I think I'll be working on that soon) I bought it new but sold as seen from one of those import 'cheap instruments but clueless' companies w/hardcase for next to nothing because it needed a setup (bridge fitting, soundpost etc). I had it taken to a luthar for that. It didn't come with any strings so for the luthar I ordered a set from mainland china for the special price of $16 a set. I am assuming you get what you pay for. So thats why I'm asking about string recommendations, it is christmas after all and I've been a good boy.

I find it fairly easy to play loud and with good technique when I'm keeping it simple, but that isn't always possible, I'm sure my technique will catch up as I play fairly often. The left hand isn't what I'm really worried about, I'm fretting notes clean if that is what you are refering too.

Anyway I'm kind of going off topic. More info.

I'm playing mostly scottish/irish/folk stuff with a little weird jazz like stuff from the fusion (ish) band we were in together.

[Jake]

Well, you can't go wrong with Thomastic Spirocores. They come in 3 different gauges, weich, orchestra/mittel, and stark. I don't recommend the starks unless your willing to work really hard for your sound. Also, the D'Addario Helicores are good. I like the Hybrids for pizz (non bow playing), but they also have arco and pizz sets as well in light, med, and heavy gauges. Thomastic Superflexibles are also good strings, easier to bow than Spirocores and a loud string.

[Bruce Lindfield]

Velvet Garbos are supposed to be very loud - do a search and you'll find lots of discussion about these!

[Francois Blais]

Some basses will sound louder with lower tension strings, some with tenser ones.
You may need to try a few things.
You can also try a simple test: detune the bass slightly, flat and sharp, so see what the tension change does.
Let the bass settle a few hours between each change, and when you go sharp, don't go beyond a whole tone to prevent string over-stretching.

[stz]

Velvet Garbos, I had a search, most people either said "are they loud?" or it was discussion on the manufacturers other string types and a comparison/love/hate deal, prehaps the real info is buried in the past?

I'll have a go lowering the string tension. I did try that at one point before when deciding how I wanted the bridge height adjusted. I loved it being slightly lower tension and the sound but I was checking the playability, I can't really comment on what it did to the volume. I'll try lower and see if it is quieter or louder than normal as I've already broken a string overtuning and don't want to break another one until I've at least got a spare set!

The ones on there are fairly light gauge, I'm sure those are supposed to sound louder. Light gauges are fairly low tension compared to heavier gauge as far as I know. I don't know if I can go much lower tension without some serious rattle issues, esp past the D on the G string.

I'll get back to you on the tuning issue, maybe then some recommendations can be made?

[Bruce Lindfield]

How about this :

http://www.talkbass.com/forum/showthread.php?t=232985

[Johnny L]

I've yet to see a jazz concert where the bassist plays unamplified or unmiked while being surrounded by drummers and/or electric guitarists.

The only bassist I've seen play with Velvets is Rufus Reid on his DVD, and even he plays amplified there.

[Bruce Lindfield]

Our own Ed Fuqua uses Velvets and has played unamped gigs - you can hear what he sounds like on several tracks around here - good enough for me !!

[stz]

I think what I'll be doing tommorow morning is standing in a corner underneath a low overhang, I thing that will give me more projected volume, I'll also deny the fiddle player and guitarist the corner and overhang.. then hope it rains too!

mwhah!

[Bass]

Originally Posted by stz

...Please remember I don't use the bow and I want more volume, any decription of a plucking technique will also likely help but I'll be off looking that up myself in a bit...

I understand that if you keep your fingers pointed towards the bridge (ie paralell with the strings) you might get more volume. This allows you to pluck the strings with a little more meat of the fingers, maybe up to the second knuckle. Also, increasing the distance / tension you pull the string before releasing should increase the volume.

Why not try slap technique? I understand slap bass was invented by somebody who needed more acoustic volume.

Disclaimer: I've been playing the DB for about 1 month, so please feel free to ignore this post.

[Ed Fuqua]

Originally Posted by Johnny L

I've yet to see a jazz concert where the bassist plays unamplified or unmiked while being surrounded by drummers and/or electric guitarists.

I haven't seen any lizards around NYC lately. That means they're all extinct, right?

[Johnny L]

Originally Posted by Ed Fuqua

I haven't seen any lizards around NYC lately. That means they're all extinct, right?

In NYC? Based on my own experiences there, I'd wonder if I just wasn't looking hard enough.

Sorry Ed I'm really not trying to say that raw acoustic sound and acoustic power aren't worth chasing...though yeah it's easy to infer that from my last post I agree.

But it can turn into a John Henry vs. the steam powered hammer contest real quick when the drummer's on fire...and I don't want to see anyone get hurt.

I'm such a wus aren't I LOL

[Ed Fuqua]

Well to each his own, I've played with plenty of drummers that like to throw down. But they all also value the musical moment and they never play in such a manner that all they can hear is themselves.

If somebody isn't listening to the extent that they aren't aware of NOT hearing somebody else on the stand, I just ain't that interested in playing with them.

[TroyK]

Ed, I think you're being closed minded. If none of the bassists in all of the top jazz clubs in Victoria, Texas are playing unamplified, where do you get off?

Just to add some value to my post, I don't much about Nylon stings, but I would put medium gauge Thomastik Spirocores on your bass. It's true what people say about the neuances of diffent basses and some liking more tension or less. You've got an inexpensive plywood bass and you're playing outside unamplified. Spirocores are the safest bet for some volume and "cut". They'll last forever and are a somewhat inexpensive choice (compared to Velvets, certainly). You might even pick up a used set here. Very common string. Very good string for what you describe. I wouldn't overthink it.

-tk

[Johnny L]

Originally Posted by TroyK

Ed, I think you're being closed minded. If none of the bassists in all of the top jazz clubs in Victoria, Texas are playing unamplified, then what makes you think that you should?

I didn't assert anything of the sort.

Besides, you don't need my permission to play unamplified. If that's what you want to do, I don't care.

For amplified acoustics, you can have the strings you want and any loss in volume you can make up with a pickup and/or mike and an amp. If you find that offensive, I'm sorry.

But that doesn't make it false.

[TroyK]

Oh, you saw right through my subtle sarcasim. Sorry, we got pounded by a windstrom last night and I brushed my teeth to a maglight this morning. Made me a little snippy. I had a smirk on my face when I typed it if that makes you feel any better.

The fact is that I love the idea of playing acoustically on gigs, but every time I try, I regret it. I think that I can be heard in the audience unamplified, but my bandmates and I usually have trouble hearing me and I suspect that my intonation is not as good when I can't hear. So, I can't pull it off. I haven't seen Ed play, but I suspect that much of his volume comes from his hands and he does use the strings that he wants.

Also, when you live in New York, guys generally don't take anything to the gig that they don't have to. I might learn to play without an amp if I had to take the subway to my gigs.

I've got 2 gigs today. One will be about a 5 block walk downtown and the other is in a suburb and I'll back my Subaru Wagon right up to the door.

For the 5 block walk gig, you can bet your a$$ that I brought my little amp, rather than my good one.

Sorry for being snippy. Guys on the board are used to my humor.

-tk

[Ed Fuqua]

Originally Posted by TroyK

Ed, I think you're being closed minded. If none of the bassists in all of the top jazz clubs in Victoria, Texas are playing unamplified, where do you get off?
-tk

90th St & Elmhurst Ave.

[Johnny L]

Originally Posted by TroyK

Sorry...

Forgiven. Hope the power comes back soon.