Damian Dlugolecki Strings

[Nathan Parker]

Since the old DD thread has bean kind of buried, and talk of gut strings fills the air, I figured I would start a new one.

I recently got a full set of DD gut strings, plain gut G & D and wound and polished A & E. The wound strings are almost like flatwounds, as they have been polished down to a smooth finish. I decided to go for these strings in an endeavor to sound like my bass hero's, Sam Jones and Ray Brown. Their sound in the 50's and early 60's particularly speaks to me. Now, I have tried gut strings in the past, Chorda's, and I have tried Velvet Garbos. But, I've been using Spirocores for the past couple of years. I like their sound, but I just don't feel they work for me. They tend to crap out on me when I really start to dig in, and I don't care for that.

The first thing I react to about these strings is the smell. I used to work at a butcher shop for several years, and one thing you don't forget is the smell of hog and sheep casings. These smell eerily similar, which makes sense as they are the same material. It's kind of gross, and at the same time, it brings back pleasant memories of cutting meat. Anyways, after I get past the smell, I notice they are slippery as hell, and about a mile off the fingerboard. I don't remember them being this high, and years of higher tension/lower action have made me lazy. Unlike the Chorda's that I had they have a very even sound all the way up the fingerboard. Not just even in tone, but fairly even volume-wise, which is nice because I try and play without an amp whenever possible. My favorite thing about them is the amount of punishment they can take. I feel like the more I dig in, the better they respond. It's a good feeling for me, as I am fairly hamfisted, and a bit of an ogre when it comes to playing, so the better the groove gets, the harder I pull. At least, that's my theory.

I plan on testing this quite thoroughly this weekend, as I have 4 gigs. It's a fairly wide variety of venues as well, so I should get a chance to see how these strings feel in a multitude of settings. As soon as I am done, I will report my findings here, in an attempt to not only inform those who are curious, but to gain notoriety for myself.

Cheers.

[JeffKissell]

Since Nathan started this I'll post here, but this quote is from the Gamut string thread...

Originally Posted by JeffKissell

FWIW, I'm going back to gut on my Cleveland. I'll post in this thread 'cause this is where the action is!

It's currently set up with DD strings on the top and a date with the bass doctor to fit an Efrano "Euro" unwound A string along with a silver wound E. The raw A was a great deal (thanks Nuno) and something I've always wanted to try. If it doesn't work out I'll put a wound gut A string on...
-J

Progris report,

Set-up: E&A- Efrano, D&G- Dlugolecki

Preface, I really, really wanted the less expensive Euro gut strings to be close enough to make me think twice about the cost of the domestic boutique strings but I don't think they are.

Damian's strings kick @ss on the Efranos. I can live with the wound E string but the unwound, raw A will not last long me thinks. The D & G strings are focused, clear and loud. Absolutely gorgeous with the bow. The way I would describe it is a really clear, lyrical, singing quality to the sound of his strings. The A string is actually not too bad bowed but is limp and unfocused pizz. It also has a much rougher surface to it. It looks old fashioned. Something else I've noticed is that the DD's don't have that "PC buzzy" arco sound under the bow but the Efrano A string does.

The wound E will do for now. It's nothing special but it balances well with the D & G. It isn't as present as Damian's wound strings though. His really are the best sounding E & A strings I've had on this bass. The real dilemma is the A string. Damian makes an unwound A string but the cost is major bank. He has said this string is meant for arco (Baroque) and discouraged me from buying it the first time around but it sure is tempting.

I've got an unamped, outdoor gig tomorrow with guitar and mandolin so we'll see how the A string does under fire, but I believe I will end up with a DD strings across the board on this bass sooner rather than later. It was mentioned in another recent thread that often a full set of the same maker/brand of strings feels the most balanced on a lot of basses. So far this has held true for my bass as well.

-J

[Nathan Parker]

I agree, Jeff, they are fabulous strings.

I only had a chance to play one gig this weekend due to the crappy Seattle snow-storm we are having. It was quite interesting. I forgot how much new gut strings stretch out, and I was about 1/2 step down in pitch after the first 4 or 5 tunes. The leader was calling 'em pretty fast, so I didn't have much time to tune up, and I had to resort to tuning while playing, which is always a blessing.

They are also difficult to pizz at first. I kept missing beats. I guess I'm used to Spiro's and a lower action. All in all, I'm quite pleased with the sound, but I can tell I'm going to need to spend quite a few hours in the woodshed before I get to enjoy the benefits of these strings.

[Nathan Parker]

I have a question for all you regular gut string users; Is there a specific way you practice intonation with gut strings that differs from the way you would with steel?

I am struggling with these strings, since they slide out of tune so much. When I used guts in the past I was a much worse player, so I just abandoned practicing scales and the like, and just fiddled around for a few hours a day. Now that I know better, I am worried that as the strings slide out of tune, the proper notes will come to pitch in different locations, depending on how out of tune the strings are. Just wondering what methods you all use?

[Peck_Time]

Keep tuning them, they will settle down.

Learn to tune with harmonics and a bow- only takes a second to get 'in the ballpark'.

As long as they are in tune with themselves, your practising will be fine.

Or- use Spiros on your E and A, and tune to them, no-one will notice the difference.

[JeffKissell]

Originally Posted by Nathan Parker

I have a question for all you regular gut string users; Is there a specific way you practice intonation with gut strings that differs from the way you would with steel?

I am struggling with these strings, since they slide out of tune so much. When I used guts in the past I was a much worse player, so I just abandoned practicing scales and the like, and just fiddled around for a few hours a day. Now that I know better, I am worried that as the strings slide out of tune, the proper notes will come to pitch in different locations, depending on how out of tune the strings are. Just wondering what methods you all use?

Sorry Nathan,
The key is practice. Playing more on your fingertips will give you a clearer note, but you should practice tuning using harmonics and open strings every time you pick up the bass. Your ear will tell you how to adjust. Eventually you will get used to how much and which way they wander during breaks, from day to day, etc. I've found the unwound strings to be more stable than the wound strings once they've settled. Also your ear will improve and sometimes it's not the bass that is out of tune.
-J

[DC Bass]

Pistoys are getting lots of well deserved attention- I have a D and G that I'm really pleased with. I wanted to try a plain A, and after much research I opted for a string from Damian. He is really helpful, and quick to respond to emails. I felt confident placing my order.

My string just arrived- prior to installation, it was breathtakingly beautiful! Amber in color, so translucent as to be bordering on clear. It looked like it was filled with fluid!

Installation was quick and easy- but a little disheartening, as it left little marks that disturbed the pristine look at the bridge, nut and where it attatches to the tuner shaft- oh well, it was inevitable, and I didn't buy it to look at it!-

I tuned it to pitch, did a little slappity slappity followed by some more tuning- then pulled out the bow- Straight away, the arco tone is AMAZING! The string starts quicky, and speaks with a sweet, sonorous tone that balances perfectly in sound and volume with my Gamuts- all the way up the fingerboard!

Pizz-it's kinda "flubby"- actually, it's VERY flubby! I know it's always going to be slow, but I hope it picks up some from where it is now...I'm sure it will be a mixture of it settling in and me learning how to play it.

Very happy so far- many thanks to Damian an all the TB'ers who have shared their experiences on this less traveled path.

More to come...

Joe

[Marcus Johnson]

LOL Joe... It shouldn't matter if a string is pretty or not, right? But when they're as pretty as these guts made by the hands of masters like Damian... it's okay to drool a little. I do the same thing when I see the Pistoys. Aesthetics count... it's art, after all.

I'm betting that the A string will settle in and start speaking. Maybe these fine guts are the musical equivalent of the "slow food" movement. Everything just might take a little longer. Keep us posted. I'm a guy that could easily go for a plain A string at some point.

[Mark Perna]

Originally Posted by Nathan Parker

I have a question for all you regular gut string users; Is there a specific way you practice intonation with gut strings that differs from the way you would with steel?

I am struggling with these strings, since they slide out of tune so much. When I used guts in the past I was a much worse player, so I just abandoned practicing scales and the like, and just fiddled around for a few hours a day. Now that I know better, I am worried that as the strings slide out of tune, the proper notes will come to pitch in different locations, depending on how out of tune the strings are. Just wondering what methods you all use?

They will settle down soon. It takes a few days to stretch out. They'll also start to sound more focused as they stretch out. I used to keep a tuner plugged into the effects out of my amp. You can tune on the fly very quickly even when there is a lot of noise in the room.

More: 1) the strings are higher off the board than they were before so you have to change your timing. It takes slightly longer to finger the note so your brain has to recalibrate itself - that won't take too long. 2) the strings are stickier and more pliable than Spiros so your hands have to get used to the new feel--it really takes a different touch to play guts--it takes time but you'll figure it out--it took me about 3 months before I didn't have to think about it anymore. 3) play lots of scales or scale fragments--all pizz. Up and down the G string in particular. You will do two things-get used to the feel and height of the strings with your left hand and get used to the changes you have to make with your right hand. That's what I did and it worked for me. Mostly Spiro-free for almost 3 years.

And lastly, they sound different than steel strings when played with a band. Get used to hearing them. Next time you're playing with a band, really listen to where you sit in the mix. It is different than with steel. Lower. Guts have much less mid range presence but significantly more low end presence (which is why you can hear an unamplified gut string bass with the rest of the band blaring away while the unamplified steel string bass gets lost). Once you get used to really hearing where you are in the mix, playing gets easier.

mark

[Earl]

+1, especially the last paragraph.

[Marcus Johnson]

For me, it's one the best parts of playing a full gut set in a larger band. That feeling of propulsion, of the notes dropping in just the right place and pushing the music up and forward from the bottom. The beautiful front of each note, and the beautiful space at the end of each note. It's playing without an amp and being heard clearly all over the room. It's not caring if you ever play a solo again (although that's fantastic as well) because it feels so damn good just to play bass lines. It's power, it's pure, and it's intoxicating.

Basically, it's like being given a free pass to have sex in public without getting busted.


IMHO

[DC Bass]

Well, this is a little odd...

When I returned to by bass after a few hours I discovered something a little disconcerting. The arco sound on the new string "went bad" on me! While it sounded glorious earlier in the day- it sounds rather "chainsaw-esque" now, with a really harsh overtone thing going on- this is only on the new plain A. Everything else sounds fine/normal.

The string isn't stretching like any of the other guts I've used...it settled into pitch rather quickly, and I seldom need to adjust more than a quarter step. Not sure of what to make of that. My (purchased used) Gamuts are still stretching in- the G has been on a couple weeks, and the D about a week.

Earlier in the day the pizz was "flubby"- that is getting better- there is more definition- so that's good.

I've changed nothing- same bow (Kolstein German, fresh hair), same rosin (Soft + oak)- I didn't even re-rosin the bow before this started- literally everything was the same from my afternoon practice session- and adding more rosin doesn't change anything.

The slots in the nut and bridge are sized correct and well lubed with graphite.
There is no binding of string in the peg box.
Humidity and temperature are well controlled.

Again- all the other strings sound GREAT- and the DD sounded great a few hours before!

My classical bass (carved) also sounds fine/normal.

I was hoping that it would chill out while I was at work today, but I just got home and nothing has changed from last night- save chipping up the tuning of the D and A, about a quarter step each.

Any ideas?

I'm going to wait until after the holidays to contact Damian-

Thanks!

Joe

[Chris Symer]

I had no idea that gut strings were so fussy. In 2008 Nathan says his strings are problematic and today he gets told not to worry, they will settle down soon........ I love it!

[Marcus Johnson]

Bad string? Happens....

[DC Bass]

Bad string? I didn't want to think that so early in Marcus, but it certainly could be possible...but as a neophyte I didn't want to be the guy who puts a cake in the oven and wonders why it isn't done baking after two minutes!

Defect aside, I could have messed it up somehow too!

Chris, yeah- almost three years to the day!
I tell you what: I aint gonna wait THAT long!

Seriously though, this is my first "brand new" plain gut string- all the others I've used have been either NOS or used, even if only lightly. That, and it's very different in it's feel- it was almost like fiberglas in its consistancy- somewhat like the way the Lyon has been compared to uncooked pasta, but more so- the Lyon D I have is/was much more flexible.

If this string always sounded like this I wouldn't be so concerned- it was soooooooo gorgeous at first!!! It started immediately, and the tone was pure and sweet all the way up the neck...

I'll keep waiting to see what develops- and I'd appreciate any advice that any of y'all might care to share!

Thanks!

Joe

[THE SAW]

Funny thread guys......

[JeffKissell]

It took quite a while (2+ weeks) for the plain A that I have to settle in. I actually took it off the bass and worked with some mineral oil to increase the flexibility and get it to look and feel more like the D & G I already had. It's not as pretty as it was but the sound is way better.

The interesting thing about this string is that it sounded really boomy and had a lot of overtones at first, especially from the player's position, so I recorded it both up close AND from about 10ft away to see what was up. Lo and behold the sound was glorious and balanced out in front, just sucky in my ears.

I'm glad I was patient with it because now it sounds great!

-Jeff

[stefaniw80401]

Originally Posted by JeffKissell

... and had a lot of overtones at first, especially from the player's position, so I recorded it both up close AND from about 10ft away to see what was up. Lo and behold the sound was glorious and balanced out in front, just sucky in my ears.

That what they say about Spiros -- so I drink the cool-aid and believe it.

[DC Bass]

Thanks Jeff! I was hoping for some feedback from someone who is a plain A user. I knew this was gonna be a tough row to hoe from the git go, but I wasn't expecting the radical change in arco response l experienced- man, initially it sounded SOOOO goooooood!

I had an unamped rehearsal yesterday. The minor troubles with pizz completely vanished into the sound of the ensemble, and everyone was pretty impressed with the sound and the way it carried. It blended seemlessly with the Gamuts.

Arco on the A was hit or miss, most of the time (80%) it was "fair"- with the harshness disappearing into the group sound- but other times it was either sweet glorious arco thunder or cringe inducing torture ! lol!

I will try some oil too! Thanks for the tip!

I shall endeavor to persevere- and I'll keep ya posted!

Thanks!!!

Joe

[Nathan Parker]

Wow, this is an old thread. There's so much I want to tell 3 years ago Nathan... he was so naive.

Glad more folks are happy with Damian's strings. He's an excellent maker.