Eudoxa thoughts

[Gornick]

I picked up some used Eudoxa's (A, D, G, mated with a Spiro mittle E) from a fellow TB'er a couple months ago, and finally got around to trying them out. after settling on medium flexocores for the last 6 months or so, this is a bit of a departure.

I love em so far, they have settled in a bit. I think I now know what Ray means by "speaking slow" for the flexocores. these are immediate, very loud, a bit brighter, but not shrill, and beautifully old school. the arco isn't as friendly as the Flex's but they aren't as annoying as the spiro's and when the bow is on it sounds fabulous... so far. for both pizz and arco, they already seem to have more range dynamically.


we'll see how they develop over the next week, but any comments on these strings would be of great assistance since I am still trying to put it all together.

[JimmyM]

I bought a used set. I loved them. But that silver winding is extremely brittle and I've got several broken windings on mine, and for $350 a set, I decided that they weren't worth it in a strictly cost vs. performance contest.

[KSB - Ken Smith]

Originally Posted by JimmyM

I bought a used set. I loved them. But that silver winding is extremely brittle and I've got several broken windings on mine, and for $350 a set, I decided that they weren't worth it in a strictly cost vs. performance contest.

Did you properly re-groove the Bridge and Nut so they slide freely at both ends without friction?

[Aaron Cohn]

Originally Posted by KSB - Ken Smith

Did you properly re-groove the Bridge and Nut so they slide freely at both ends without friction?

I agree that this is very important. But I've had the windings on Eudoxas break in the playing length of the string a number of times.

I had Eudoxas on my old bass for a few years and it happened rarely enough that I found it manageable to replace the strings as this happened, especially since I never needed to replace them for any other reason--if nothing breaks, they last a long time.

But I bought a new bass early this year and put a new set of Eudoxas on it in, I'd guess, early March. In August, the G string winding broke in the area of the 1/2 position notes. Last week, the D did the same in first position. I, moments ago, very reluctantly ordered my replacement D string.

I love the Eudoxas when they work. I'm hoping I've just been unlucky this year. But if they continue to fail on me at anything approaching this rate I'll have to abandon them. It's way too expensive to have to replace them like this, and the few days it takes before a new one will stay anywhere near in tune is a nuisance as well.

I hope it doesn't happen, but if another one of the strings breaks on me any time soon it may just be the impetus I need to switch to plain gut.

[Bobby King]

It's been my experience that the flatwound gut stings like Oilv and Eudoxa will always be susceptible to having the windings separate. If you think about how gut strings constantly stretch and contract with the climate you have to ask, how is the fine silver winding supposed to deal with that? Roundwound guts and some like Pizzicato are more durable (but still can break). Lubricating the slots helps but it may really be an inherent problem with Oliv and Eudoxa. It's a shame because they're wonderful strings.

[KSB - Ken Smith]

Originally Posted by Bobby King

It's been my experience that the flatwound gut stings like Oilv and Eudoxa will always be susceptible to having the windings separate. If you think about how gut strings constantly stretch and contract with the climate you have to ask, how is the fine silver winding supposed to deal with that? Roundwound guts and some like Pizzicato are more durable (but still can break). Lubricating the slots helps but it may really be an inherent problem with Oliv and Eudoxa. It's a shame because they're wonderful strings.

I agree that this could be the problem. I suggest that you contact Pirastro if something breaks during normal usage prematurely. I think heavy Pizz could be a problem as they are made mainly for use with the Bow. You fingers also rub the windings when you play as well. I have fairly clean technique and have never had all these string problems I hear about here on TB. User error could also be the case here. A delicate string like Eudoxa, Oliv and even Obligato may need some extra care especially if you are naturally heavy-handed.

[jmpiwonka]

i've got an Oliv G that did that. the winding seperated just a bit around fifth position. the string still sounds fine, the seperation is not growing larger so i just deal with it...i can feel it just a bit while playing but i know where it is and now i have come to expect it to be there...no big deal for me.

[Gornick]

Thanks for the windings warnings. They were bought with some burn already on them, but I didn't put much money down either, so whatever I get out of them is what I get. A nice experiment. I can't imagine having 4 bills to throw on strings anytime soon so I will probably go on to something else when these do die.

All that aside: I am really liking these things so far, they continue to sound wonderful and full, both arco and pizz. The mid and upper registers are really strong, which is sorta similar to how UncleToad feels about his Gamuts. I think the lack of attack from the Flex's up there are starting to show their weekness in comparison. I am very anxious to test them on a gig, but that will have to wait.

[dfp]

i really enjoyed a Eudoxa G with Spiro D A E mediums for a few days, acoustic tone was a wonderful match, but amplified, they sounded so different, the lush character of the Eudoxa wasn't coming through... really a disappointement, but oh well.

yeah, the winding got screwed up on that G, too, within days of install, around the nut, winding snagged front side of the nut while tuning up to pitch after a bridge adjustment...

for arco, i was surprised by how finicky they were under my bow... some of the talk around made me think they'd be e-z to bow, maybe if i'd given it some time to let my right hand figure out the speed/pressure...?

[JimmyM]

Originally Posted by KSB - Ken Smith

Did you properly re-groove the Bridge and Nut so they slide freely at both ends without friction?

I had the bridge and nut widened for gut strings, if that's what you're asking. The windings didn't break there, though. They broke in the length of the strings. I'm sure what caused it was taking them on and off 3 times.

[svenbass]

I've had similar issues with windings in the past, but the last set lasted 1.5 years, the windings never separated, and the only reason they are off is because the E string snapped in the middle of the night. Refering to Ken Smith's post I definitely widened the nut/bridge slots and used ample graphite powder, but I am quite heavy handed, and gig very often and they never separated.....hmmm lucky draw, good batch, subtle technique change? I'm not sure how to explain it, but I'll certainly keep the others for backup.

I have a set of Pirastro Pizzicatos on now - love the sound, but they are not as forgiving under the bow, and I'm not a huge fan of the roundwound thing, but I'll let 'em run their course seeing as they were $$$ $$$.
I've been toying with the idea of Jargars for a change of scenery and they don't cost $400

[Bobby King]

I just got a hold of a set of Eudoxas and put them on my King bass (which had Corellis on it). It's been a while since I've used these strings and I'm really enjoying them. The arco is much better than I remembered (maybe I've improved!) and while they're not quite as easy to bow as the Corellis, the sound is big and rich (but not like the Country Music duo ) and louder too. There's something about that gut core vibrating that I can really connect with.

Pizz-wise, they've got a little more tension than the Corellis and I had to fool with the action a bit, but the pizz sound is very nice -- punchy, with a little growl and sustain, but not too much like many steel strings.

My other bass has Gamuts and Eudoxa is a very different sort of gut string. I think that in the past I was trying to use them for the blues/country/rockabilly/bluegrass stuff, but I always preferred the sound and feel of traditional gut sets. But as a classical and jazz double-duty string they work much better, IMO.

I hope they don't start having those winding issues! There's no free lunch where bass strings are concerned.

[robbielink]

I've used Eudoxas for many years, now, and have had all the problems mentioned above. A couple of things I've figured out, though. I used to have trouble with strings breaking "in the middle of the night" and finally realized that it was the wild humidity fluctuations we have in our North Carolina winters here. It can be 50 and raining for days and then suddenly get cold and dry. If I wasn't playing every day (sorry - don't jump on me about that!) and the humidity dropped drastically because the heat started coming on the strings would shrink and break. Once I opened the case and found the bass tuned almost a minor 3rd high! It didn't help that my studio was in the basement with no humidity control. Now, when we go from wet and warm to cold and dry I tune the bass down a step or so if I'm not going to be playing that day.
Also, when I've had the windings separate (especially on the G which gets a lot of use) and buzz when it gets dry I just wrap a very slightly dampened paper towel around the string for a while to swell it up a bit. Putting dampits in the bass and keeping the bass in its case works, too. You can extend the life of the strings that way (yeah, good for the bass, too).
Gut strings are generally a pain and expensive but for me the sound is worth it. Unfortunately it appears that Pirastro is cutting back on their gut string production and reducing the number of gauges available. I'm fairly convinced that the overall quality is sliding a bit, too.

[Bobby King]

Originally Posted by robbielink

Unfortunately it appears that Pirastro is cutting back on their gut string production and reducing the number of gauges available. I'm fairly convinced that the overall quality is sliding a bit, too.

I'm curious why you say this?

[robbielink]

Originally Posted by Bobby King

I'm curious why you say this?

referring to my statement that it appeared that Pirastro was cutting gut string production and reducing the number of gauges it offered:

A sales rep from one of the principal (possibly only - I don't know) Pirastro String importers told me that Pirastro has been falling behind in their shipments of strings to the states, and that many of the orders did not contain any gut strings. He also said that they were stopping regular production of some of the gauges that they have offered in the past and would only make them as "special orders" which would incur a 30% surcharge. He did NOT specifically mention bass strings and as far as I know the Eudoxa strings are still available in 3 gauges if you can get them at all.
That's all I know. (and it's second hand)
Robbie

[Bobby King]

Robbie,

I was also curious about what you said in terms of the quality slipping. Have you had any bad experiences recently with any Pirastros? I have recently gotten a set of Eudoxas which were fine -- the same as I remembered them from a few years back, and also a set of Obligatos for my son's bass and those are fine too.

A long time ago I had a set of Eudoxa Heavy from Lemur but as I remembered, I didn't like the extra tension. I think I was looking for thicker diameter to match with some plain gut upper strings. It may be that the other gauges don't sell enough to justify regular production.

The new set of Eudoxas cost almost as much as a custom gut set from Gamut (I use them on another bass). It would be interesting if someone like Dan Larson or Damian Dlugolecki made a flatwound gut string. A far as I know, Eudoxa and Oliv are the only string of that type being produced. I think that they're both wonderful strings, but we all know about the potential problems they can have.

[Stan Haskins]

Well, ther goes that plan (I was hoping to try some Eudoxas in the future)

Everyone's talking about the overall quality at Pirastro slipping - has anyone had problems with any steel strings, or is it just guts? (Permanents were going to be my next set)

[Reuben]

My Oliv D & G strings look and feel beautiful and after spending the week beating the crap out of them there are no signs of deterioration.

And I do mean I beat the crap out of them.

That said, I'm probably going back to spirocore D & G for their vesatility.