I swore off the string quest-but I'm back

[Whit Townsend]

I'll recap for you who don't remeber my thread from a few months ago:
I played Bluegrass for 13 yrs on an old 51 Kay strung with Supernils and got a great sound. But Alas, the old girl has bitten the dust and I had to buy a new Romanian Plywood.

It came strung with Helicore Orch. The bass performed very well with them, but I don't play enough to keep the extra tough callosus needed on the plucking hand so my right hand stayed a bloody mess. Plus I was playing in a band thru a pu on gigs, and the sustain was so much I didn't like having to damp all the time. I was used to digging in ond the old kay and letting em ring.

So I put some Nils on. Stopped the right hand blisters, and tone thru the p.u. was back what I was used to. Acoustically, tone was ok except for the flabby E, but

they are just not cutting it volume wise.

The old Kay with the low tension nylon strings could be heard for a mile and felt in my bones. But not this bass. It's tighter and brighter. The Nils (and the Hel Orch) were a good match to offset the brighter timbre, but the Nils won't get this thing to vibrating. I'm getting killed by Martins, F5s, and Mastertones to the point I can barely hear myself.
Right now I've left the band, and will not be using the p.u. much for the forseeable future.
I need volume for festival jamming. I can live with sustain since the p.u. wont get much use, If I can get a big loud note that jumps out there and can be heard, without shreading my right hand to bits.
So I'm thinking I'll go back to a higher tension string to get some volume out of this bass.

I've just about narrowed it down to Weich Spiros or Obligatos.
But I hear good things about the Eurosonics or Super Silvers too.
I'm not really interested in the cost of gut or, Animas or Olives. Too expensive and I don't think the tension will be enough to drive this top like it needs.

My action is on the high side, around 6-7 on the G and 9-10 an the E.
My bridge is not adjustable, so I really don't want to lower my action to accomodate the string choice. I like to dig in pretty hard with my right hand. I slap very little, walk when it can be done tastefully, and never use a bow. I don't play jazz, just Grass and old country, maybe a blues once in a while.

Which of these strings do you think will give me the most volume without turning my right hand fingers to hamburger? A smooth flatwound steel, like the Weiches, a wound synthetic core like Oblis, or a large diameter gut immitation like the Euros or Super Silvers?

Maybe something else, like Chromesteels or Fexecors?
I'm at a loss and this can get darn expensive.

I need dark, loud, and easy as possible on the plucking fingers!

Yall please chime in.

[Marcus Johnson]

You would probably love Obligatos, given your description. Every time I play a bass strung with Oblis, I wonder "damn, why did I ever switch from these?". ( The quick answer is that the E string is just a bit wimpy on my bass). They are very easy on your hands, and they sounded nice and full when I had them. I may have been able to get more low end sound if I'd raised the string height, but I never tried.

I know you don't want to spend $200+, but if you did, you might want to check out Velvet Garbos. Frickin' loud, nice complex sound. Not high tension, though.

Ultimately, it's hard to go wrong with a good ol' set of Spiro Mittels, well broken in. (BTW, I get a fair amount of volume out of Weichs, once they're used awhile... they get louder, I think) If you're feeling particularly macho, you could do a Mittel set with a Spiro Stark. It sometimes is easier to deal with a string that speaks loudly and plays a little harder, only because you don't have to pull so hard to get big volume.

[Chasarms]

I think Obligato is a little warmer and fuzzier than than a spirocore.

I like both, but Spirocores are very string sounding to me.

For a more traditional tone, I think the Obligato is probably a better choice. Although, completely agree with the wimpy E syndrome that they manifest. The do feel really sweet under the fingers though.

You give a little, you take a little I guess.

[Mudfuzz]

Originally Posted by Whit Townsend

I'll recap for you who don't remeber my thread from a few months ago:
I played Bluegrass for 13 yrs on an old 51 Kay strung with Supernils and got a great sound. But Alas, the old girl has bitten the dust and I had to buy a new Romanian Plywood.
-----------------------------clip---------------------------------
Maybe something else, like Chromesteels or Fexecors?
I'm at a loss and this can get darn expensive.

I need dark, loud, and easy as possible on the plucking fingers!

Yall please chime in.

Jargar!!!! I'm using the Forte set.
Dark, loud, easy to play, bows like butter.
I've had these on my Ply bass for a few weeks now and I have to say they are the best sounding and playing string I've run across so far. Versatile too, pizz at FB end = nice punchy Jazz, pizz way up the FB = Cuban, old school swing boom, slap sound is the best I've found on steel so far[Lee Rocker uses the Jargar mediums by the way], and I'm getting the deepest cleanest arco sound I've ever had on my bass. Am I going over the top? Maybe so, but then I've never been happier with my sound.

[Whit Townsend]

<<<<<<<Every time I play a bass strung with Oblis, I wonder "damn, why did I ever switch from these?". ( The quick answer is that the E string is just a bit wimpy on my bass). >>>>>>>>
The E string issue. Thats the main thing I worry about w/oblis too. When I had on the Hel Orchs, the E was the weakest string, volume wise, compare to the rest. Its was still pretty good tho. The Supernil E might as well be nylon rope from Walmart, a big rubber band.
Interesting about the Spir Mittles vs Weiches. Some on here have claimed the Weichs are actually louder. Is ther that much diff? If not I'd prob go with a weich set w/a Mittle E.
As far as the left hand goes, I would like a smoother feeling string than the Helicore Orchs, but tension wise, I really didn't have a problem with them once I got my action at the nut right.
Will the spiros windings feel smoother, with the mittles about the same tension as the Helicore Orch? If so mittles with a stark E may just be what I need for maximum loud. If the windings are smoother, my right hand will surely appreciate it the most! If they feel the same rough roundwound texture as the Helicores, then I don't want Spiros. Will have to look somehere else.

[Whit Townsend]

<<<<<but Spirocores are very string sounding to me.>>>>

Well, I understand you have to break them in. They say the older the better. Lots of bluegrass players use them, and keep them on for a long time.

Jagars, interesting. Are they a smooth feeling flatwound string? Forte sounds a little tough, but if they feel good I might be game. Rocker plays thru an amp, maybe thats why he can use the meds. The fact the slap sounds good is tempting, I don't do it much, but I lke it when I want it.
Are the Fortes really that easy on the fingers(right hand I mean) I guess if they are fairly smooth feeling strings, I can get um to work for my left hand. Bowing, I could care less, although the Helicore Orchs had a good sound, they just tore up my plucking hand. So I would not be opposed to an Orch string, just not gonna do orch.

[Marcus Johnson]

I have the Weich w/ Mittel E combo on right now (until Monday ), and it's fairly loud. It may be a bit too "nasal" for your musical situations, depending on your bass. I'm a jazz bassist, so they work okay for me, but even so, the "zingg" is starting to get to me. Back to the Animas....

The Spiros , in all gauges, are wound very nicely, no roughness at all. Very comfortable, smooth surface. They also last forever, and improve drastically with time, so you are not likely to have to think about restringing for a long while. They are a great value because of that.

[Whit Townsend]

The thing that got to me with the Helicores was the winding more so than the tension, I think.

One thing that worrys me abouit going to a Mittel or Stark ga steel is I'm worried I'll have to lower my bridge some. I do play up around the 5th "fret" quite a bit, and a really high tension string may give me some problems up around the middle of the fingerboard unless I lower my bridge some.

[Mudfuzz]

Originally Posted by Whit Townsend

Jagars, interesting. Are they a smooth feeling flatwound string? Forte sounds a little tough, but if they feel good I might be game. Rocker plays thru an amp, maybe thats why he can use the meds. The fact the slap sounds good is tempting, I don't do it much, but I lke it when I want it.
Are the Fortes really that easy on the fingers(right hand I mean) I guess if they are fairly smooth feeling strings, I can get um to work for my left hand. Bowing, I could care less, although the Helicore Orchs had a good sound, they just tore up my plucking hand. So I would not be opposed to an Orch string, just not gonna do orch.

Yeah they are. Fortes feel about the same as Spirocores. Tension is a bit less then Mittels.

[Whit Townsend]

Marcus,
Are the spiros, given say, 30 hours of playing time to break them in and mellow them out, still gonna be a lot "zingier" than the Hel Orch? If so, I may need to go with a darker sounding orch string with a smooth winding like the Jagers instead. This bass tends more toward bright tone than dark, and I'll need something to offset that.

[Whit Townsend]

Jagar Fortes tension is a bit less than Spiro mittel? Great!
How about the E? Is is as loud and punchy as the rest of the set?
What make is your ply and how old is it?

[TroyK]

Originally Posted by Whit Townsend

Interesting about the Spir Mittles vs Weiches. Some on here have claimed the Weichs are actually louder. Is ther that much diff?

It completely depends on what your bass responds to. Some basses open up and sing with less tension on the table. Some need that tension to get it vibrating. What worked on "someones" bass will not necessarily work on yours as you learned when you switched basses and tried your favorite strings on the new one.

I THINK that on a new, solid, stable, factory bass I would assume that medium tension would produce more sound than light tension. Maybe high tesion would produce more than medium tension, but at point, too much tension will choke it down. But, don't trust me on that. It's bass specific. My theory is that it's probably more bass specific on older and more specially made basses.

[Mudfuzz]

Originally Posted by Whit Townsend

How about the E? Is is as loud and punchy as the rest of the set? What make is your ply and how old is it?

The E is pretty even on my bass, which has been a problem ever since I stop using Spiro mittels. I got tiered of the tension and the treble. My bass.......... well, I bought it new in 97 but I have no Idea who made it or where it was made. According to the guy I bought if from [Thin Man string co. in Alameda CA] has given me a few stories; It is either from Eastern Europe, China or assembled in China from parts made in Eastern Europe or visa versa Last summer I refinished her and carved a new fingerboard and tailpiece as well as made a extended nut to bring the string length down from 43 3/16" to 41 7/8".

[Marcus Johnson]

Originally Posted by Whit Townsend

Marcus,
Are the spiros, given say, 30 hours of playing time to break them in and mellow them out, still gonna be a lot "zingier" than the Hel Orch? If so, I may need to go with a darker sounding orch string with a smooth winding like the Jagers instead. This bass tends more toward bright tone than dark, and I'll need something to offset that.

Sorry, Whit... never laid my hands on Helicores of any kind, as far as I can recall. I was comparing the Spiro "zing" to Animas, which balance my bass out a lot more across the whole range. Obligatos fall somewhere between the two, in terms of balance and volume. They all sound great on my bass; they just speak with different voices.

I really could see "dating" Obligatos again at some time. They darken up the sound somewhat, arco beautifully, I can race around 'em like a cockroach on meth, and they feel realllly comfortable. Short lifespan, but they aren't too expensive, so.... maybe I'll move them ahead of the Animas when I go to the string drawer on Monday. Or maybe not... then again....

Now you see how I keep my hand strength up..... from turning DB tuning machines!

[Whit Townsend]

For now, I've put the med. Helicore Orch back on.
The bass woke back up, for sure.
Yesterday I was fooling around with my old 4 track, laid down some acoustic guitar anc vocs, then went back with the bass.
Nothign special as far as recording, just a SM58 about a foot away from an F hole, in the bedroom, into an old Tascam casette 4 track. I played very lightly.
Upon playback, I was amazed at the tone. Huge, fat, clear notes. Just the right amount of sustain, a great sound.

Was gonna order some spiros but I think I'll hold off a while.