Jargar?

[Al Smith]

Did someone say "Jargar" ? (Francois?) I've been thinking about Jargar strings for orchestra. The "best" string for orchestra? Which guage? Maybe "heavy" for volume? Maybe mixed up? Maybe?

Thanks in advance... I've used Obligatos, Helicore arco,
an old, used set of Helicore Hybrids (I liked them!) and the "popular" Flexocor G D, Helicore Arco A E mix.

[Francois Blais]

The Forte could give more volume, depends on your bass!
They're also stiffer.
The Dolces are mostly used by slappers or for solo-tuning.
I'd go with mediums. (funny because I ordered two Jargars yesterday!)
They're quite dark and very gut-like!

[Al Smith]

Thank you Francois, my next question - The package says medium orchestra helicore A - the tail colors are correct - but the peg end is "black" - that is, black only. No light, med. or heavy "ring" color. That is, no blue for medium guage - so are some strings distributed with errors and should I believe the package the string was placed into? OR?

Thanks again for the valuable info you share with the rest of us.

[Francois Blais]

Originally Posted by Al Smith

Thank you Francois, my next question - The package says medium orchestra helicore A - the tail colors are correct - but the peg end is "black" - that is, black only. No light, med. or heavy "ring" color. That is, no blue for medium guage - so are some strings distributed with errors and should I believe the package the string was placed into? OR?

Thanks again for the valuable info you share with the rest of us.

The Helicore medium gauge ring color is a very dark blue. Maybe you just have difficulties to see it?
If you have a caliper, measure its gauge, I have a medium and a light here so we can compare...

[Al Smith]

All of the other Helicore medium strings I have, have a "blue " color ring at the peg.

This string , to me, looks like black on black at the peg!
Maybe it doesn't matter much - the size measures the same as my hybrid A - I don't care for the twangy sound it generates (the orchestra helicore medium A). Therefore, I am still considering the Jargars - although I'm concerned they may be too dark for me and my bass.

Since removing my Obligatos in January, I have been striving for a brighter sound, it is the helicore A that seems to usually be different sounding from the other three strings. (Helicore orhestra arco set).
Would anyone care to compare Obligatos (arco) to Jargar (arco) (orchestra).

Thanks.

[Francois Blais]

Jargars are probably the darkest steel strings around, so it you're looking for brighter, forget them!
Maybe you could try Pirastro Permanents?
They're a bright orchestral string, but with a fuller sound than say, Corellis, which are thin from A to Z.
The Permanents use a nickel wrap, like Helicores, but are much better, IMHO!

[jneuman]

Francois

I am considering trying a Jargar G with Original Flex D and A. Is this a legit match? and if so, which guage of Jargars best matches the Originals for feel and volume.

Thanks,
Jon

[Francois Blais]

I'd get a Forte gauge one.
Did you try a Flexocor '92 G?
It's quite warmer than the Original Flex G, and could give a better tonal fit than a Jargar methinks.

[jneuman]

Originally Posted by francois

I'd get a Forte gauge one.
Did you try a Flexocor '92 G?
It's quite warmer than the Original Flex G, and could give a better tonal fit than a Jargar methinks.

Thanks Francois. No I haven't tried the 92 yet. I am vasilating on whether to stick with the Original D and A and change out the outside strings, or whether to start fresh with 92's and go from there. I am concerned a bit about replacing the original G with a 92 G since the original apparantly falls between 92 medium and heavy. One of the things that bothers me about the Original G is the difference in color between it and the D. Lately I've been playing a lot of solo material in orchestra tuning, and I have trouble with string crossing on the G and D because of this difference. If I go with the 92 G, would it make sense just to replace all of the strings with 92's? Maybe I should just by some different G strings and try them out. I just don't know.

Jon

[Francois Blais]

Originally Posted by jneuman

Thanks Francois. No I haven't tried the 92 yet. I am vasilating on whether to stick with the Original D and A and change out the outside strings, or whether to start fresh with 92's and go from there. I am concerned a bit about replacing the original G with a 92 G since the original apparantly falls between 92 medium and heavy.

Tension-wise?
To me the '92 medium is a tad stiffer than the Original Flex, but you may feel different, of course.

One of the things that bothers me about the Original G is the difference in color between it and the D.

I suppose you're talking of the tonal color?
The G is much brighter than the D.

If I go with the 92 G, would it make sense just to replace all of the strings with 92's? Maybe I should just by some different G strings and try them out. I just don't know.
Jon

The '92 E (medium) is quite weak though.
The '92 A (medium) is nice but doesn't match very nicely the D & G, IMHO.
It's a nightmare to mix-and-match Pirastro strings as sets are often unbalanced by design.
The Permanent set, a more recent product, has a much better balance though!

[jneuman]

Thanks Francois

I think I understand. I don't like Permanents as they are too bright for my taste. Will the 92 G work with the Original D and A though? Note I don't know what I want to try for the E yet. I leaving that for the last I want to balance it's brightness with the eventual G string. Maybe Helicore, maybe Spiro, Kolstein? I don't know. Oh and yest I meant tonal color. The difference in silk wrapping is less of an issue for me

Jon

[LouisF]

I'm having Jargar mediums put on a bass being built for me by Auday-Giormenti. They think it gives their instruments a very warm and full sound. They wanted to put Fortes on, but they are a little stiff for me. (I have Kolstein orchestra strings on my ocurrent bass). I'm looking forward to trying them out.

Louis

[Francois Blais]

Originally Posted by jneuman

Thanks Francois

I think I understand. I don't like Permanents as they are too bright for my taste. Will the 92 G work with the Original D and A though?

Yes, I think so, but you be the judge!

Note I don't know what I want to try for the E yet. I leaving that for the last I want to balance it's brightness with the eventual G string. Maybe Helicore, maybe Spiro, Kolstein? I don't know.

The Kolstein Varicore is your best suggestion, IMHO.

[jneuman]

I have replaced my original flexo G with a Jarger medium (blue). Here are my comments:

1. I think the forte (red) would be a better match from a feel standpoint, since the medium is lower tension than the rest of the strings. I ordered a red, but Lemur was back ordered so I went to my local violin shop and bought what they had, which was medium only. Thumb position is a breeze now.

2. Sound-wise this set-up works for my bass since the top string is rather strident to begin with. Volume is balanced with respect to the other strings, but it is slightly darker than the D and A. I love the dark sound. It makes me want to play the G string, where as before I was afraid of the G.

3. The feel of the medium Jargar is similar IMO with the Helicore orch. mediums. This might be a good mix and match for Helicore players that want a more meaty sounding G string.

Jon

[bdengler]

I love they Jagars. Of course, my primary concern is bowing. Bowing on the strings is like cutting into butter; so smooth. My teacher hates them (he uses Flexocor Originals). But I love playing them, notwithstanding their dark, gut-like tone.

Brian

[jneuman]

I got the forte g from Lemur within a day of my last post. Those guys are fast. Anyway, this is the clear winner. The forte g matches the original flexocor d and a well. Volume and feel are close. I don't even notice that it is a different make of string now that I have been playing it for a while. This is just what the doctor ordered for folks who don't like the strident nature of the original flexo G on their bass. Note that I played an old czech bass my teacher was borrowing recently and it sound great with the original flexo g. I think it just depends on the instrument. The Jargar is a winner. Now if I could only figure out how to pronounce "Jargar". is it Ya-ger"? That how I heard a cellist pronounce it.

Jon

[Marcus Johnson]

Say it like a pirate..."yarr-grrr"...matey.

[KSB - Ken Smith]

I have not played these strings since the 70s. Please tell me how they compare to Obligato Orchestra For Bowing smoothness, twist, tension and color of tone and a Bass that is neither dark or bright.

My Gilkes has a Clear Cello like tone. It cuts through better than my seemingly more powerful Italian Martini but in the end, the Gilkes will prevail. I want to darken up the Bass a little without loosing the comfortable tension on the Bass now. I got the Bass with very old Flexicores. They were about 10-20 years old. I was told they would compare to the Flexicore 92s as the Flexicore Originals are not as original as the 92s.

So fellow Bassists, if you can please tell me which set of Jargers would best darken my Gilkes and still bow as smooth or better....

[jneuman]

Originally Posted by KSB - Ken Smith

I have not played these strings since the 70s. Please tell me how they compare to Obligato Orchestra For Bowing smoothness, twist, tension and color of tone and a Bass that is neither dark or bright.

My Gilkes has a Clear Cello like tone. It cuts through better than my seemingly more powerful Italian Martini but in the end, the Gilkes will prevail. I want to darken up the Bass a little without loosing the comfortable tension on the Bass now. I got the Bass with very old Flexicores. They were about 10-20 years old. I was told they would compare to the Flexicore 92s as the Flexicore Originals are not as original as the 92s.

So fellow Bassists, if you can please tell me which set of Jargers would best darken my Gilkes and still bow as smooth or better....

Ken

Unfortunately I don't have experience with Obligatos, but I would hazard that Jargars are darker. They (Jargars) bow better than any other string I've tried to date. You can attack them anyway you want and you will not get a harsh sound out of them. My experience is with the G string only though. I would think that the medium would be a good match tension-wise with Obgligatos.

Jon

[KSB - Ken Smith]

Ok, so if I were to buy a set for my Gilkes, where would be the best place to get a deal? I can buy from a dist. but being that they are not that popular, maybe someone has sets to unload at a lower $?

Anyone? francois?