Pecanic tailpiece and loop ended strings

61pollmann · #1 10-22-2008, 07:15 PM

I just started to install some Velvet strings with loop ends and discovered that the Pecanic tailpiece on my Pollmann doesn't like the loops. Especially at the D string there is quite an angle with a sharp edge on the tp. I stopped installing because I don't want to damage expensive strings. I will try to get a photo added to this thread so you can see the problem. Does anyone use Velvets with a compensated tailpiece?

George

61pollmann · #2 10-22-2008, 08:32 PM

This is the tailpiece I'm talking about. The loop tends to assume an angled direction on the tp.

Jake deVilliers · #3 10-22-2008, 10:25 PM

I've been considering this situation myself and I'm going to mount the strings using small pieces of hardwood dowel on the underside of the tailpiece. This way the afterlength tuning and mode matching would be preserved.

Put the loop through the hole, put the dowel through the loop & pull up. It may only need two longer pieces with 2 strings on each.

hdiddy · #4 10-22-2008, 10:53 PM

Not sure what you guys are talking about... are you talking about mounting the cord through drilled holes at the bottom of the tp? I had it like that for years. Never had a problem. I did however take a round file and removed any sharp edges.

Gearhead43 · #5 10-23-2008, 12:16 AM

Yeah, why not just file the sharp edge?

Ed Fuqua · #6 10-23-2008, 09:04 AM

I don't know if it's my tailpiece or if it's something JEFE JEFF did for me, but this is what mine looks like

it's got the little saddles...

.matthew e wengerd. · #7 10-23-2008, 09:35 AM

I asked this in my Velvet Blues thread several days ago: doesn't the nature of the loop-ended strings negate the benefit of a tuned tailpiece? If your saddles are set to tune the afterlengths, they would be of no effect when you're using loops, right?

Ed Fuqua · #8 10-23-2008, 09:47 AM

It's not a tunable tailpiece

.matthew e wengerd. · #9 10-23-2008, 10:05 AM

I dig, but mine was tuned and many others are; would I have to do the dowel thing to reap the benefit of it?

Ed Fuqua · #10 10-23-2008, 12:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by .matthew e wengerd.

I dig, but mine was tuned

Copasetic.

Jake deVilliers · #11 10-23-2008, 01:44 PM

"I dig, but mine was tuned and many others are; would I have to do the dowel thing to reap the benefit of it?"

Unless you re-position the tailpiece to re-tune the afterlengths and re-do the mode-matching, you'll need to feed the strings through from beneath.

You could install little hardwood pegs into the back of the tailpiece to hook the loop ends on to if you have enough flat area.

My tailpieces tend to end up hollowed out like dugout canoes by the time I get the note low enough, so that's not really an option for me.

.matthew e wengerd. · #12 10-23-2008, 01:56 PM

Good ideas; I'm not sure how one could be re-tuned if you're using the recommended method, though. AFAIK, the vibrating length of the afterlength starts where the string comes out of the loop. That position is determined by the amount of wood *above* the holes on the TP; you'd have to change that to tune them, I'd think.

Jake deVilliers · #13 10-23-2008, 03:42 PM

Yes, that or the length of the tailpiece wire.

61pollmann · #14 10-24-2008, 06:33 PM

Thanks for all the replies. Ed's photo shows the problem with the string coming off at an angle. As far as tuning after-lengths, I think the simplest solution would be to shorten the cord a distance equal to the length lost by not using the saddles.

This brings me to a question. I'm using a Pecanic tailpiece cord, which must be tied using a Carrigan Bend knot. Would there be a problem untying it and then retying it to change the after-length, or would it weaken it?

Thanks in advance for any help.

George

.matthew e wengerd. · #15 10-24-2008, 08:21 PM

Well, since two replies have said something similar, I must point out that changing the TP cable length would only be effective in re-tuning the afterlengths if the contour of the top of the TP is exactly the same as the saddles'. In my case, the top of the TP is straight (traditional), while the saddles are staggered.

61pollmann · #16 10-25-2008, 07:54 AM

The saddles on Pecanic tp's are staggered, so changing the cord changes all the after-lengths. I'm still curious to know if anyone has untied the knot and retied it without any problem. The Carrick Bend knot really tightens up when tension is applied to the strings. I understand that Velvet also sells a braided cord.

George

.matthew e wengerd. · #17 10-25-2008, 08:20 AM

pollman, if you're responding to me, you're not reading what I'm saying. They loop-end strings mean that the saddles have no effect on the vibrating afterlength of the string. the contour of the top of the tailpiece does, however. If that contour doesn't exactly match the contour of the saddles, the effect of the compensated or tuned tailpiece will be changed.