Spiros! Back to bass-ics

drurb · #1 10-31-2009, 10:34 AM

Because of my injury, I needed to make some modifications so that it's easier to play with only my right index finger while my hand is splinted. No surprise that the somewhat unnatural position of my hand can lead to fatigue. The Evah weichs, wonderful as they are, are just too stiff.

So, even though I am not yet cleared to play at all, off to Upton Bass I went. Gary and I went back and forth as to whether I should go with the Spiro mittels or weichs. Either way, the string heights had to be dropped while I regain function. We went with the Spiro mittels. So, I've come full circle (no, not the pickup

).

My bass doesn't sound all that bad with my new, temporary setup. There was one surprise that I hope folks will comment on. With the Dominants and with Evah mittels and with Evah weichs, hitting the open G on my bass always produced a HUGE punchy sound. It was as if you could feel the pressure wave hit your head. The most noticeable change is that the G sounds relatively wimpy. Now, I know full well that Spiros darken over time and loose their banjo-ey brightness BUT do they actually gain anything in the fundamental? That is, can I expect that G to gain some "fullness?" Uncle's grand Spiro thread seems to suggest that I can expect that.

Here's what I said in that thread:

Quote:

Originally Posted by drurb

Spirocores-- for some, can't live with 'em, can't live without 'em.

I live without 'em because I can't stand that banjo sound and, well, they're a bit too bright for me at their best. I say this knowing that someday I might return to them! Keep us posted.

Yup-- I've returned to them. Sorta like being back home!

This coming Tuesday, I'm allowed to start playing again in the splint. Can't wait to get back up in the saddle!

Marcus Johnson · #2 10-31-2009, 02:55 PM

I believe that they do gain the fundamental as the brightness dissipates. It takes some patience. i don't really start digging spiros until at least a couple months of steady gigging.

Uncletoad · #3 10-31-2009, 03:54 PM

The G is especially cranky. Mine is still making my crazy. I've tried a half dozen different strings and always come back.

I suspect the fingerboard dress can help or hinder more on that string than others. With low string height that guy tends to move quite a bit and bang into the board. Especially since you can't really fire it parallel to the surface of the board from the usual driver's angle. It always ends up at an angle.

So, yea it gets better, to a point then after it's fully settled in, setup varients should be considered.

I'm kicking that around for myself because even with the break in action on the queen it's had enough time on it to stop being annoying and it hasn't.

Fwiw the strings are slightly lower on the Cleveland with a little less camber and I don't have that problem on there at all.

drurb · #4 10-31-2009, 04:58 PM

Phil and Marcus--

Thanks for the insights. Actually, no problem with the fingerboard dressing. No buzzing at all. Just doesn't seem to have the punch and power that I'm used to. I'll try to be patient as I know Spiros are weird for weeks. I was ready for that. Still, in a way it's comforting to have the old standards back.

Paul Warburton · #5 10-31-2009, 05:42 PM

Just for a change-up, can I ask a question oh string junkies?
Do you guys hand stretch your new strings after installation?
People say you can injure them doing that, but I bring them up to a bit over pitch and pull out on them one at a time carefully, of course, several times. My Thomastik Orchestras last for way longer than anybody could wish for. That stretching thing works great when new for me...they sound a bit rank for a gig or so, then seem to calm down pretty nice.

Glad things are coming along, Les.

clink · #6 10-31-2009, 05:45 PM

Welcome home Les. Both of my basses wear Smittels and couldn't be happier. Give them time and know that they will improve with time. Good luck in your recovery.

Uncletoad · #7 10-31-2009, 06:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by drurb

Phil and Marcus--

Thanks for the insights. Actually, no problem with the fingerboard dressing. No buzzing at all. Just doesn't seem to have the punch and power that I'm used to. I'll try to be patient as I know Spiros are weird for weeks. I was ready for that. Still, in a way it's comforting to have the old standards back.

Oh, I misunderstood. They sound like **** for awhile, and then they don't. It's pretty simple.

gypsyjim · #8 10-31-2009, 11:05 PM

Any thoughts from you folks on bluegrass strings for volume. I have t. spirocore on my old German. I have obligatos on my Upton Hawkes on Gary's recommendation. I don't seem to have the volume I want anymore. They are one year old. I don't remember
feeling this way a year ago. I get the punch with the spirocore but they tear my right
hand up after hours. The Obligators end up with the same result because I end up pulling so much harder to get the volume I need. I am looking for volume and easy on the hand. I also tried supernils for a few days and couldn't get over the size difference in strings and how soft the feel was. Any advice?

james condino · #9 10-31-2009, 11:17 PM

Currently I'm using a Spiro mittel E/A and gut D/G. Lots of volume and nothing feels or sounds like gut for that old school sound. Ten folks or ten basses and you'll likely get 100 different reponses....

j.

salcott · #10 10-31-2009, 11:49 PM

I always give new strings several good yanks as I'm tuning them up, checking the bridge as necessary.

basss · #11 11-01-2009, 08:09 AM

I've been using spiros with either an obligato or velvet G for the past 7 years or so with good results

drurb · #12 11-01-2009, 11:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by basss

I've been using spiros with either an obligato or velvet G for the past 7 years or so with good results

Thanks. In the past, I've also found the Obligato G to be too weak-- perhaps moreso than the Spiro G. Just part of the YMMV of strings/basses/players.

Then again-- maybe I'll throw on my Obli G sometime down the line.

james condino · #13 11-01-2009, 12:02 PM

Have you tried the Olive G?

j.

basss · #14 11-01-2009, 12:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by drurb

Thanks. In the past, I've also found the Obligato G to be too weak-- perhaps moreso than the Spiro G. Just part of the YMMV of strings/basses/players.

Then again-- maybe I'll throw on my Obli G sometime down the line.

The Velvet might work better then if your're not getting enough volume from the obli G. I have the low end Velvet G on with a weich A & D and a mittel E. The velvet is closer to gut in timbre though and I remember the obli matching the spiros better for it's sound.

drurb · #15 11-01-2009, 01:11 PM

Thanks for the Olive and Velvet suggestions. I'm getting a little ahead of myself as I'm not even allowed to return to playing until Tuesday. I also have to be very careful about tension. Playing while splinted can be fatiguing so I may have to give up a bit. How do the Olive and Velvet compare to the Spiro G in terms of stiffness?

Jake deVilliers · #16 11-01-2009, 01:47 PM

So you're saying that EP Weichs are stiffer than SMittels? Wow...

You should have gone with the Spiro Weichs, then you could sell them to me in 3 - 6 months when all the banjo's worn off!

Marcus Johnson · #17 11-01-2009, 01:58 PM

I have a hard time remembering which one felt the softest on my bass. I guess it was probably the Velvet, then Oliv, then Mittel. I dunno.... these Gamut guts erased all of my string memories.

Anyway.... check yer PM, doc.

Phil Rowan · #18 11-01-2009, 02:04 PM

With felts on the D and G I'm finding the Spiro Mittels to have a nice and even balance pizz and arco. Yes, the D/G are still somewhat bright (been on less than a month), but that's until I hear someone else play my bass as I stand a few feet in front. To me they don't sound quite as bright heard outfront compared to how they sound as I play the bass.

drurb · #19 11-01-2009, 02:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jake deVilliers

So you're saying that EP Weichs are stiffer than SMittels? Wow...

You should have gone with the Spiro Weichs, then you could sell them to me in 3 - 6 months when all the banjo's worn off!

I was a bit worried that the weichs might be too soft and the advantage of the mittels was that I could leave 'em on and be happy with 'em for a long time to come. Seems you like the Spiro weichs and would really like to hear your thoughts about them.

As for Spiro mittels vs. Evah weichs, indeed the Evahs are substantially stiffer. It seems that they stiffen with age, at least that's what the folks at Upton reported and that seems to square with my experience as well.

When I was at Upton's shop, I was all set up to have the Spiro weichs installed and plucked a few notes here and there on some basses strung with the Spiro mittels. I was surprised at just how much softer the Smittels were than the Evah weichs.

As I and others have mentioned here, the Evahs seemed to be mis-named. Their weichs are what most would consider mittels-- and stiff, larger diameter ones at that. The Evah mittels or "regulars" are as stark as I'd ever like to experience.

drurb · #20 11-01-2009, 02:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phil Rowan

With felts on the D and G I'm finding the Spiro Mittels to have a nice and even balance pizz and arco. Yes, the D/G are still somewhat bright (been on less than a month), but that's until I hear someone else play my bass as I stand a few feet in front. To me they don't sound quite as bright heard outfront compared to how they sound as I play the bass.

Phil--

Thanks for the feedback. Sure, I know the brightness fades but was wondering if that G would develop some "meat." From Unletoad's experience, seems it will. I'll wait and see.