Velvet Compas 180 Regular - review and comparison (Evah Pirazzi)

[Tightanic]

Hi everybody,


after using these strings for more than two weeks, and getting much info from some of the Velvet mega-threads I thought it was time to give something back to this great community and share my experiences on these somewhat rare yet great string.
I was thinking of buying them for quite a while already but since they're not exactly a budget string I was waiting for a chance to actually try them - at a Max Dimoff (principal bassist of the Cleveland Orchestra - incredible bassist!) master class I got the chance to play these strings on his bass and placed my order right away.

I should probably add that I'm a Jazz bassist by default yet studying a lot and occasionally performing the classical repertoire, currently with Orin O'Brien of the NY Philharmonic - therefore I won't be able to tell you how they perform in a 8 piece bass section, nor am I a classical virtuoso, but nonetheless I think I can provide a solid and broad view on this topic.
Sound samples are gonna follow, got some time to record something next week. Here we go:


Packaging
Pretty. They come in a nice rippled cardboard box with installation instructions.

Installing
Installing these strings on a bass is not easy since there are no ball ends. The pegbox end is not a problem but on the tailpiece some specific knots have to be tied. The difficulty doesn't lie in figuring out how they work but how long the afterstring length has to be to avoid the peg end of the string being too long or too short (e.g. winding up the wound part of the string which might compromise their health). Took me about 30 mins to install them properly, not the biggest deal though.

Users of Gage's Realist pickup should be aware of the fact that there won't be any ball end to mount the pickup - I didn't quite realize that before having put on the G-string. I ended up attaching the jack to the tailpiece with a rubber strap. :-)

Ease of use
These strings feel great and fairly elastic right out of the box. I chose the slightly higher (still below average) tension version called "Orchestra" (not the SUIT!). The winding is very smooth, the pizz resopnse is there immediately. The first few days the strings were considerably brighter and the bow response was kind of scratchy, especially on the A-string. Now that everything has settled in I'll only comment on the "final" sound I'm getting, read below for that.

Beware: These strings need quite long to hold their tuning. The first 3-4 days were pretty bad, I actually needed to tune up after every tune I played, now 2 weeks later they're pretty stable, still not quite on par with Spiros or such. I've read before that they should be fine from about the third week of use - we'll see. At least I cannot recommend putting them on in the middle of a season or right before important gigs / recordings.

Sound and response
Love it. Unlike Velvet Anima or Garbo these strings don't really emulate the gut string vibe but behave more like a "normal" string (e.g. steel). Despite their relatively low tension (26 kg per string on a 41" scale lenght - my bass has 42" though) they feel firm yet elastic. Definitely don't feel floppy under the bow in my opinion although I find them to usually respond better with slightly lower bow pressure than Evah Pirazzi for example. They speak excellent pizz and arco alike though.

The sound (as mentioned above), at least on my bass (dark but clear old Kulik from Prague), is somewhere between Spiros and Pirastro Olive I would say. The sustain is good yet not ridiculously long (I doubt anyone would really need more though), the pitches are very clear, definitely not so the weird-harmonics and out-tune-vibe of unwound gut strings. That being said they sound somewhat neutral pizzicato yet very fat and warm, good growl without the very pronounced "boing" of Spiros - just a little bit of that, and they allow for woody attack. My bass has a tendency of being a bit nasal on the G-string - not a problem with this string. Good depth and allow for very woody sounds, and the punch is very satisfying.

Arco they are different than I expected. The first thing that came to my mind was "great string for Baroque music" - so maybe they have more of a gut-vibe when played arco. I think they sing just fine in the upper register for romantic solo stuff etc., but they also got a lot of sizzle that makes the sound more airy and less nasal - very open and complex. Spiccato not a virtu and Détaché work equally fine, which every orchestral player who tried these strings on my bass confirmed.
Would they be powerful enough in an orchestral section? Hard to tell for me. I would think so since they're not lacking any power even for acoustic jazz playing, I just don't have the opportunity to (have someone) try at this point.

Another extremely pleasant aspect is the nature of the winding and how it affects the sound: Any sort of fingerboard noise (e.g. strings buzzing, shifting etc.) appear with a very "musical" spectrum - there is no trebly clacking or other harsh sounds, you can smash your E-string against the fingerboard and it will blend in with the sound unlike some other steel and synthetic strings.

Compas 180 vs. Evah Pirazzi
I have mostly used Evah Pirazzi both weich and regular for the past few years, and in my opinion the Compas 180 are superior by far. They are both kind of in the same zone, but I never got over the fact that the Evah's just sounded "dumb" to be sometimes, in certain positions they would just sound extremely plain and not very musical, just overly simple. And their arco always seemed a bit crude to me - and they're hard to modulate in my opinion, maybe due to their thickness - the Compas 180 seem slightly thinner. That being said although there is not the world of a difference it makes the world of a difference to me - what sounded dead before now actually became alive without being more trebly - the sound is just more alive, transparent and complex without sacrificing power. Maybe it would even make more sense comparing them to Obligatos - they sure don't have any of the string roll under the bow though.

Customer care
I've heard before that Velvet replaces broken strings without asking many questions, at least within the first year of use (as long as we're not talking abuse). I -fortunately- didn't have a chance to find out yet, but so far Nuno from Velvet's customer support has been very supportive in the process of choosing the right string and gauge, it's nice to have a personal contact, and he's even around on Talkbass!



That's it for now - as you can easily tell I'm really into these strings! If you got any questions feel free to ask, I'll add more later if anything else comes to mind - although this is already pretty extensive. And recordings will follow soon...
I wrote this review after 2 1/2 weeks of use, so of course I can't comment on longterm reliability and such, but I'll keep adding thoughts.


Johannes

[TroyK]

Johannes,

Thanks for the thorough review. We needed it, I've considered these strings before, but like you said they are no small investment and there wasn't that much on them in the past threads. A lot of discussion of the SUIT set and of Animas and Garbos.

My impression of Evah Pirazzis matches yours pretty closely and they left me wanting those regard. I don't think I've ever actually seen these strings, I have played on Animas and Garbos before and neither were quite right for me. Since it sounds like you have some history with Animas, I'd love a little more compare and contrast with them.

And I'll look forward to your sound clips. Again, thanks for enriching our body of knowledge with this review. It will be forever referencable (sure, that's a word).

[aaronallen]

I used these strings for a while. When their new like yours they have a good character but as they age, they become really dull for pizz which is what I mostly did with them. I replaced them with Animas and the sound was 10x better. I wish velvet made Animas using compass style windings, the copper windings are very problematic.

[Tightanic]

Interesting. So far I find them to be getting better every day, and the ones I played on Max Dimoff's bass were also on it for a few month, but that's also a matter of taste I suppose - but I'll keep posting my experience as time goes by. I like my sound to be somewhat dark, and I sure prefer the sound they got now over what I heard when I first put them on, so maybe your dull is my broken in (I also dig pizzing on Belcantos....)? :-D

[aaronallen]

I should add that I used these strings for 6 months. It's not that they got too dark, they just lacked character and became rather uninspiring to play on. However, they are a great arco string.

[Tightanic]

I hope I won't feel the same when they're getting old, I'll let you know.

TroyK: I think Aaron nailed the most obvious aspect: The winding is much funkier on the Animas, kinda "coarse" - which I find perfectly fine for pizz. Not that great for arco though, and also sound-wise they are more on the gut-side of life. That being said their pizzicato sound is more complex and probably thicker, maybe a little less focussed but very punchy and shorter sustain on the upper strings - I find it wrong to really compare them here though since I never played them and the Compas 180 on the same bass. But I don't really consider the Animas good hybrid strings like the Compas since they might be *bowable*, but it doesn't sound very great, nasal and relatively crude, and hard to modulate the sound. Maybe someone else has a different opinion, just what I've heard so far. On the other hand that's all relative considering how little the difference often is when hearing the sound in a band / in context. Maybe fine for some bowing, but not for extensive arco work I'd say. Also not your choice if you're looking for a Spiro / Helicore type string that's just a bit thumpier and darker, in this case I'd rather take the Compas 180 or Compas Blue.

[TroyK]

I didn't give Animas a great chance on my bass. They were on for a bit. I really didn't dig the windings. I played them on some other basses and really didn't like the feel. I believed that I could probably get used to them, but it would have required a lot of adjusting and I just didn't feel compelled to accommodate my strings.

I sat in on Kevin Hseihs bass in NY, which had Garbos on it and it felt great! I suspect that they are too dark for me and I seem to remember that it's not possible to bow their G or something, but I liked them and maybe I'll try them some day.

I'll keep following your thread with interest. I'm not in the market right now, but I do appreciate having information like this captured here for when I am.

[Tightanic]

That's funny, I played on his bass several times, I thought he had some velvets (Anima or Garbo) on the bottom strings and some other gut on the top two strings - not sure though, gonna ask him. I really liked the way it sounded, but it's probably not a very happening arco setup. :-)

[TroyK]

You know, I think you might be right about that Garbos low and gut high. Anyway, nice setup.

[S.fasciani]

Ive had the E, A, D, Compas 180 and the G chorda for the last few months and Im loving it. The compas mix quite well with the gut G sonically and to the touch. I do find that staying in tune is not their strong point but Im willing to deal with that.

[Eric Hochberg]

I used the suits for 6 months and the G started playing false. I liked them while they were working.

[Tightanic]

Hey Sean,

how are you doing, haven't seen you in a while! Everything going well in the NL? I didn't know you were using these strings, I thought I saw you playing some Anima or Garbo w. guts combo the last time I heard you playing - but that's a while ago. I gonna come visit sometime in June, are you gonna be around?

Johannes "F."

[Tightanic]

And a quick update regarding the strings: In the meantime my G string broke, was really doing nothing but tuning up and it popped somewhere below the bridge. I was kind of disappointed at first especially considering that I had them on for only about 4 weeks at that point, but there was a cure: I sent Velvet an email, had a free replacement string shipped to the US in 2 days (!!! yeah Nuno), that was impressive.

And I was also told that the serial number of my set indicated that I bought some REALLY old stock (5 years), so the design has been slightly changed since then and this part of the string is not supposed to be prone to breakage anymore.

[SeayBass]

I put Compas 180 set on my Hawkes Bass 7/8 Panormo shape with C extension.

Over the years I have used spirocores, flexocores, evah pirazzi, permanents, and dominants and zyex strings on this bass. They all sounded good enough for me. The real issues for me are feel and response. I need to play jazz and arco on the same bass/ same gig often, so I am always searching for a string that bows nicely and is satisfying when playing hard swing or bebop.

I most recently used zyex strings on this bass, which I liked in the winter time, but I hated as the spring rolled in. I took the Zyex off because after 4 months of use (in March) the zyex were coarse, especially up high, and too scratchy in sound for Mozart, Beethoven, etc.

so far (2 month on bass):
LOVE THEM. They are very satisfying to play. It's hard to find a string that offers both clarity and body, and these deliver both. They bow better than any 'hybrid' string I have tried, and better than some 'orchestra' strings I have used, too. While I do notice a brightness to them, it's not a scratchiness, nor is the brightness distracting to the overall tone. This is an improvement over spirocore, dominant, and zyex in my opinion.
I have also been surprised by the strings' response in the highest registers, too. It really sings up there, unlike pirazzis, which typically give me resistance.

So they bow well. But they have ping, thump, sustain, and growl, too. I have been getting lots of looks from guys in the band on rehearsals and gigs after putting these strings on. They notice the bass differently than they have before.
I am pleased to say when we play Tchaikovsky, and I have a solo pizz passage, it fills the texture with pillowy sound, while still providing clear pitch and articulation.
The bounce-back I get from them when walking lines or playing jazz melodically is also very satisfying.

In Conclusion:
I continue to find playing these strings very satisfying, whether I am playing Beethoven tunes or Bird tunes. If you can come up with the extra $$$ to pay for them, I recommend you buy some. On my bass, these bow better than spirocores or pirazzis, while offering the level of articulation and clarity of spirocores, and the pillow and thump of the pirazzis. They are softer feeling than either the spiros or pirazzis, too, which allows me more room to shape the sound and the music.

I will add that if you like/require the tight, focused sound of spirocores or Helicore strings, I think you may have a hard time getting used to these. As the previous review remarked- these have an open sound, which is a long way from spirocore.

other thoughts
I put a set on my 3/4 Italian bass maybe 3 weeks ago. I am getting a lot of satisfaction from them on this bass, too though it is a tighter instrument than the Hawkes bass. I am now considering trying the SUIT strings on this bass. . . anybody compared the compas with SUITs lately?

[engedi1]

can anyone comment on the longevity of these strings? I love what I am reading here about them, but am worried that like many of the hybrid strings out there, they won't last. I would like to know I will get 1-2 years out of a good set of strings. I also am gifted with the driest, non-sweatiest hand of anyone I have ever met. Strings on any instrument last way longer for me than most (especially electric bass ) I don't know if this makes as much a different on upright...

[Eric Hochberg]

Originally Posted by engedi1

can anyone comment on the longevity of these strings? I love what I am reading here about them, but am worried that like many of the hybrid strings out there, they won't last. I would like to know I will get 1-2 years out of a good set of strings. I also am gifted with the driest, non-sweatiest hand of anyone I have ever met. Strings on any instrument last way longer for me than most (especially electric bass ) I don't know if this makes as much a different on upright...

I got 6 months out of the suit G. The others seemed ok, but I took them off at that point.

[engedi1]

thanks eric.I wonder if the orchestra gauge would hold out longer. 6 months is unacceptable for $300 strings in my book.

[SeayBass]

velvet warranties the strings for 1 year. previous posts suggest prompt and conscientious customer service.

I myself have had some email correspondence with the company and they have responded promptly.

to broken string dude-
If your G died after 6 months you could contact velvet about it-

[Tightanic]

Not sure whose case this is referring to but my replacement G-string was in the mail 2 days after contacting customer support - and that included shipping to the US.

[SeayBass]

If anybody still looking at this, I'll say I have had the strings on the bass for over 6 months now and they have fully settled. I am very pleased still.
Many strings change radically after a couple months of break in. These have retained a lot of the sound character, which means they didn't lose too much brightness, nor have they tightened up too much.
They have darkened and smoothed out a bit, and they have tightened up a bit, but not as much as some other strings. They have retained that clarity and body, and still respond very well. I am very very happy with these strings. I hope they last for years.