Want to sound like (insert name here) ? Read this! (DB forum thread)

[Uncletoad]

Originally Posted by psykopatsak

the only exception to this rule is more of a electric thing, but effects are probably the only things that CAN be an "instant X sound"

If you can't play very well great fx still sound like somebody who can't play very well.

[Marc Piane]

Agreed all around. Nice post Toadie. Your point of seeking the best gear you can afford though is well taken too. I've been mostly gas free for a year or so but I sure wouldn't mind a Hawkes Panormo or a Prescott or something when I win the lottery.

[Chris Symer]

Originally Posted by Uncletoad

This is not as black and white as it seems. I would not suggest to ignore improvements to your equipment. There is a vast difference in tone and playability between my $5000 plywood bass and my $25000 150 year old carved bass. The difference is so profound that over several years experience in playing the instrument I'm sure my playing has improved in ways that would not have been available to me without such a great instrument.

I still sound remarkably like me on both instruments, however the better instrument sounds more like me these days, maybe because I play it more, but more likely I think because it allows me to do things the other cannot do.

The balancing act is to seek out tools that help me perform at my best; tools of higher and higher refinement that allow me to grow past the limitations of lesser refined tools. That notion is balanced against my tendency to buy stuff in an attempt to make myself better rather than practice and perform to make myself better.

Practice makes me a better musician. Practicing on good equipment gives me opportunities to be better still. Without the practice, you just have a pile of expensive stuff you can't play very well.

This is along the lines of where I'm comming from. The tools you use won't help you really sound or play like someone you are not, but they most definitly can help you sound like you. The "just a tool' analogy only goes so far but makes a good point. I do find that sometimes it can be a good way to trick myself into working on somethings and practicing more while I'm all excited about some minor gear change that nobody else notices.

[MartinBorgen]

Originally Posted by Uncletoad

If you can't play very well great fx still sound like somebody who can't play very well.

Yes, of course the GIGO rule apply here as well. (Garbage In, Garbage Out)

[bassist1962]

I am lucky enough to have inherited a good upper mid grade carved bass. Once I had it properly set up, I have vastly improved my playing, and do not have intentions of sounding like anyone else, I just want to learn my way around the instrument, so I can do what I do with some resemblance of fluidity and authority. I don't have the spare cash or time to do all the experimenting with strings, etc., So I took the route of listening to you fine players, and even the luthier, and had Spiros installed. They still need to tame down, but I am loving the sound of this instrument and set up, even with my lack of experience. Practice and time spent with the instrument are the only things that will make it better. I sound nothing like the family member I inherited it from, but they are the one that pushed me to learn how to 'really play', and those principles and foundations have stuck with me. It comes from you and not so much the tools. I remember seeing someone's signature 'You got your wood, you got your string, what else do yu need?'. Wise words.

[PsychoScout]

Eddy Merckx once said: it's not the bike, it's the man on the bike...

I got these wise words from a teacher...
He said to me: "You have a very nice sound", I replied "I have a very nice sounding bass", to which he quoted Eddy Merckx :-)

[Greg Clinkingbeard]

Originally Posted by PsychoScout

Eddy Merckx once said: it's not the bike, it's the man on the bike...

I got these wise words from a teacher...
He said to me: "You have a very nice sound", I replied "I have a very nice sounding bass", to which he quoted Eddy Merckx :-)

A listener once told Chet Atkins how great his guitar sounded.

Putting the guitar down, Chet looked the man in the eye and asked simply, "how does it sound now"?

Musical instruments are merely the tools we use to create. We need to carefully choose and adapt our tools to facilitate that creation but always remember that we create the music.

[George Kaye]

Back in the 80's or 90's, I forget when, Ron Carter's bass was in a bass shop in NYC. The owner of the shop told me one of his other customers tried Ron's bass. All the customer said afterward was "It's him." There is nothing amazing about Ron's bass. It is a Juzek set up really well, but it isn't an old Italian or some other uber valuable bass. It's Ron.

We have a completely tactile instrument. So how we touch it, the timing between the left hand and right hand, how hard we hold down the strings, where on the string we pluck or bow, 2 fingers or 1, all define the sound. The feel comes from how we articulate.

I played with the late drummer Dennis Chambers (who played with Cecil Taylor, Paul Chambers, etc) on a tour with Dakota Staton. Dennis once asked Mr. PC how he got that sound of his. Paul said it's all in the left hand.

For me, my articulation is much better if I have been bowing some bebop to warm up.

I have always admired Ron Carter's sound, feel and musicianship. He has been the model of a jazz bassist that I most try to emulate. I also try to emulate Mr PC who was Ron's influence. What I noticed is that my ear leads me to the sound automatically. But it took years of practice and analysis of Ron's playing to get there.

When I was young and sat in on other basses I used to worry about intonation and it being a different bass. But one day I found myself playing without a thought about it. That bass had a sound I wanted that I could get and it allowed me to express myself just the way I wanted.

So I think you need an instrument that can get the sound you want, or a sound that works, and your ear will take care of the rest.

[Ed Fuqua]

When were you with Dakota? Looking back through some stuff, I think it was 93 and 94 for me....

[John Wiitala]

Hey George--thanks for the cool post. In it you meant Denis Charles, right?

[M Ramsey]

Originally Posted by Uncletoad

This is not as black and white as it seems. I would not suggest to ignore improvements to your equipment. There is a vast difference in tone and playability between my $5000 plywood bass and my $25000 150 year old carved bass. The difference is so profound that over several years experience in playing the instrument I'm sure my playing has improved in ways that would not have been available to me without such a great instrument.

I still sound remarkably like me on both instruments, however the better instrument sounds more like me these days, maybe because I play it more, but more likely I think because it allows me to do things the other cannot do.

The balancing act is to seek out tools that help me perform at my best; tools of higher and higher refinement that allow me to grow past the limitations of lesser refined tools. That notion is balanced against my tendency to buy stuff in an attempt to make myself better rather than practice and perform to make myself better.

Practice makes me a better musician. Practicing on good equipment gives me opportunities to be better still. Without the practice, you just have a pile of expensive stuff you can't play very well.

No truer words have ever been spoken through falser teeth.

In all truth, Toad, you have nailed it again. When I grow up, I wanna be like you, but I can't 'cause I'm already ME!

I live in the bluegrass bass world. I'd love to nail upright bass stuff like I've listened to from the early Ray Charles recordings, but it's not within me. Oh, I could study it, maybe begin to understand it, but in the realm of North Carolina where I live, my musical outlets will be of the bluegrass vein and I do love the music.

Other bluegrass bass players have commented to me about how good they think I sound, when they've had an opportunity to listen. I have my own doubts about MY sound, but evidently, they're hearing something in my playing that impresses them, to some degree.

Someone earlier in this thread mentioned that our individual "sounds" are attributed to how we pull the string, what type of string we're comfortable with, WHERE we pull the strings, etc., etc. I think that's what makes me sound like me and you sound like you, more so than what type of bass we're playing. When I do get to play on a nice carved bass, I still sound like me, but maybe with a bit deeper or possibly louder tone.

Ultimately, our sound is in our muscles and our hands.

Cool thread and great idea for someone to make Toad's observation into a sticky.