Annoying Fender Jazz action

[*Munkeh*]

Hi Guys and Girls,

Here's what i have... a Fender Deluxe Active Jazz

The action on the bass is pretty high, when i measure the relief (Hold the 1st fret with my left hand and hold the last fret with my right elbow. Then press the string down and measure half way which is the 10th fret, the relief i get is about 2 business cards)

The bridge saddles are screwed as far down as they would go. The truss rod doesn't need to be tweaked IMO because well... there's no buzzing in the neck so why adjust?

What i want is...

Low action, loose medium or low tension strings opposed to stiff high tension strings thus easy playability.

What can i do fellow bass enthusiast's?

[Foamy]

The bridge/saddles adjust the height - is the string height where you want it to be? Is it low enough? If so, then you probably wouldn't be asking. If you need the action lower than it is, and the saddles are are far as they go...are they ALL down? So, is the action "flat" instead of following the radius of the neck? You have a couple choices to lower the action further; you can shim the neck. Use something very thin like a credit card - you'll be surprised at the difference it'll make. That'll give you the effect of lowering the strings.
The truss rod affects relief, as you know. If the relief is good, then no adjustment needed. If you want lower action in the middle of the fingerboard, you can try and straighten the neck, but that may come at the expense of some buzzing - and that may be an OK trade-off. It's up to you.
I think the tension part will really only be affected by your choice of strings.
Let's see what the real gurus say!

Oh yeah, the other way to lower the action is to grind/file the saddles, but that is an ugly method, and since you ahve a bolt-on neck, I see no reason to even consider it.

[*Munkeh*]

Originally Posted by Enchanter_Tim

The bridge/saddles adjust the height - is the string height where you want it to be? Is it low enough? If so, then you probably wouldn't be asking. If you need the action lower than it is, and the saddles are are far as they go...are they ALL down? So, is the action "flat" instead of following the radius of the neck? You have a couple choices to lower the action further; you can shim the neck. Use something very thin like a credit card - you'll be surprised at the difference it'll make. That'll give you the effect of lowering the strings.
The truss rod affects relief, as you know. If the relief is good, then no adjustment needed. If you want lower action in the middle of the fingerboard, you can try and straighten the neck, but that may come at the expense of some buzzing - and that may be an OK trade-off. It's up to you.
I think the tension part will really only be affected by your choice of strings.
Let's see what the real gurus say!

Oh yeah, the other way to lower the action is to grind/file the saddles, but that is an ugly method, and since you ahve a bolt-on neck, I see no reason to even consider it.

The bridge saddles follow the radius of the neck and they are as low as they can get following the radius curve of the neck at the same time.

I just tuned my bass one step down FCGD and it's more or less what i am looking for... the tension of the strings are nice for easy playability but the action problem is still there. Maybe i need to adjust the truss rod after all turning it to the left to flatten the neck more? Suggestions?

Thanks for your post!

[Foamy]

I don't quite understand the action problem.
If it is too high just in the middle few frets, then adjusting the trussrod to flatten the neck and solve that (possibly at the expense of a bit of fret buzz).
If the relief is OK, but you want to lower everything further than it is now, and you've bottomed out the saddles, then the best way is to shim the neck. Use something like a business card to start, and go from there.

[Basshole]

For myself, I'd probably just crank up the truss rod a little. I like the low action feel of a neck at near-zero relief.

Since you seem to express reluctance to tighten it at all, I'd still notheless suggest that you take ONE business card out of it by cranking the rod, and "take another card out" by actually putting a shim made of a business card in the bottom of the neck pocket to ever-so-slightly change the neck angle.

I think if you "split the difference" in this way, you'll probably be very happy with the results. It should be lower, but still compromised to about the way you have it now, because you will have taken a bit of action out of it evenly in both ways.

[pkr2]

Originally Posted by *Munkeh*

Hi Guys and Girls,

Here's what i have... a Fender Deluxe Active Jazz

The action on the bass is pretty high, when i measure the relief (Hold the 1st fret with my left hand and hold the last fret with my right elbow. Then press the string down and measure half way which is the 10th fret, the relief i get is about 2 business cards)

The bridge saddles are screwed as far down as they would go. The truss rod doesn't need to be tweaked IMO because well... there's no buzzing in the neck so why adjust?

What i want is...

Low action, loose medium or low tension strings opposed to stiff high tension strings thus easy playability.

What can i do fellow bass enthusiast's?

Munk, I am kind of hesitant to jump into this thread, but I have a feeling that the confusion is just before setting in, followed by frustration. I'm only going to offer you one suggestion at a time and if you will follow the directions in the order that they are offered, it shouldn't take long to either fix the bass or at the least , understand what's wrong with it.

The absolutely first theng that you MUST get right is the truss rod adjustment. Luckily, it's probably the easiest one to do properly.

Fret at the 1 fret and the 12 fret. Put 3 or 4 cards between the G string and the top of the 6 fret. just enough cards that the stack is thick enough to stay in place in playing position.
The pressure of the string should hold the cards in place with the bass in playing position.

Now. remove the cards one at a time. At some point the pressure of the string will no longer hold the cards in place as the card stack becomes thinner, and the cards will fall out.

The adjustment that you want is for 2 cards to stay in place but one card falls out. This method elimenates having to "eyeball" the clearance.

In the pix 2 cards are staying in place. To adjust this bass the truss rod, simply loosen the TR nut 1/4 and give it a couple of hours. If the cards don't fall out within a couple of hours, loosen the TR nut another 1/4 turn.

Understand that this is a "rough in" adjustment and will be refined a little later in the set up. Hopefully the clothes pin/rubber band capo is self explanatory. If not i'll explain.

Do this step and let me know the results and we'll go from there.

[*Munkeh*]

Enchanter Time:

The problem is the strings are too high off the fretboard to fret properly when playing because they are just really high. The problem is around the middle of the fretboard when reaching around frets 9 to 17.

Took your advice and adjusted the truss rod by turning it to the left = loosing the rod. Should i be worried if the truss rod seems abit loose when turning the rod? Like i barely had to use any force to turn the truss rod to the left...

Basshole:

Are you saying i should tighten the truss rod? Wouldn't this just raise the action even more by turning the truss rod to the right? Also... when shimming the neck, i put the business card in the neck pocket where the 4 bolts of the screws for the neck go in right? And then i just screw the neck back on, right?...

pkr2:

This sounds like an interesting experiment... I'll use this as last resort if the shimming doesn't work.

Thanks for the help all!!!

[Basshole]

Originally Posted by *Munkeh*

Enchanter Time:

The problem is the strings are too high off the fretboard to fret properly when playing because they are just really high. The problem is around the middle of the fretboard when reaching around frets 9 to 17.

Took your advice and adjusted the truss rod by turning it to the left = loosing the rod. Should i be worried if the truss rod seems abit loose when turning the rod? Like i barely had to use any force to turn the truss rod to the left...

Ugh, you've done the exact opposite of what's required to lower your action. At least maybe now you'll notice it's worse, and stop following the WRONG advice.

Originally Posted by *Munkeh*

Basshole:

Are you saying i should tighten the truss rod?

Absofrigglutely. Ya wanna lower the action? Tighten the rod. That's how it works...not the other way 'round.

Originally Posted by *Munkeh*

Wouldn't this just raise the action even more by turning the truss rod to the right?

Absolutely not. You tighten it, causing it to counteract string pull more, thus lowering your action.

Originally Posted by *Munkeh*

Also... when shimming the neck, i put the business card in the neck pocket where the 4 bolts of the screws for the neck go in right? And then i just screw the neck back on, right?...

As far down into the bottom of the nedk pocket as you can, to maximize the lean back you get on the neck. The heel of the neck. Trim the card to make it fit. Us a crisp, non-spongy card.

[guy n. cognito]

The Deluxe is designed to be used with TW strings. You will note that Fender 8250 strings, which are sold with the bass when new, are TW on both the B and the E string. I find that you have to use TW strings in order to get the proper string height on the B and E strings.

[*Munkeh*]

Basshole:

Which angle are you looking at the bass? I am looking it from headstock down to turn the truss rod...

guy n. cognito:

I replaced the bridge with a Gotoh 201 bridge... does this still matter if the string is TW or not?

Here's the bridge:

http://guitarpartsdepot.com/Merchant...g-Bass-Bridges

[floopy]

Originally Posted by *Munkeh*

pkr2:

This sounds like an interesting experiment... I'll use this as last resort if the shimming doesn't work.

I would suggest you try thinking of pkr2's advice as an 'essential first step' rather than a 'last resort' on this one

[guy n. cognito]

Originally Posted by *Munkeh*

Basshole:

Which angle are you looking at the bass? I am looking it from headstock down to turn the truss rod...

guy n. cognito:

I replaced the bridge with a Gotoh 201 bridge... does this still matter if the string is TW or not?

Here's the bridge:

http://guitarpartsdepot.com/Merchant...g-Bass-Bridges

If everything else in your setup is perfect and you are still bottoming out the saddles, then yes, TW strings should help. They will allow the bottom of the string to get lower to the fretboard, but only on the TW strings, obviously. If ALL of your strings are still too high, then you have a more serious problem that will probably involve neck shimming or cutting on the saddles.

[pkr2]

Originally Posted by floopy

I would suggest you try thinking of pkr2's advice as an 'essential first step' rather than a 'last resort' on this one

Thanks for the vote of confidence, Floopy, however I do believe the OP is very close to finding this out the hard way. I've seen very few setups turn out well that consisted of "turn this and see what happens". When it comes to the abused TR, I've seen my share of good basses relegated to the bone yard.

Basshole: "At least maybe now you'll notice it's worse, and stop following the WRONG advice."

The problem is that he doesn't have any way of separating the good advice from the bad. This is a serious ongoing problem that I don't have an answer for. I have stopped pointing out serious errors in advice because it invariably ends in an argument.